Congrats, Browns fans.

by Benjamin Salem on Oct 11, 2009 5:37 PM EDT Comment 59 comments

I'm a lifelong Bills fan and I just wanted throw out some thoughts on the worst NFL game I've ever watched from beginning to end and get some perspective from a fellow suffering fan base that I wish nothing but the best for going forward.

1.) Was that the worst BROWNS win you folks have ever endured? A win is a win, but was that professional football we just watched?

2.) Reading your blog this week, it seems like Mangini and your ownership are about as popular with the fan base in Cleveland as Jauron and our ownership are right now with ours...how sad for two passionate fan bases starving for an overdue title. Does this game and the fact that Graham's FG attempt was probably no good cheer you up at all? Really, you're 1-0-1 over the past two weeks. Feel better?

3.) Rank these QBs: Anderson, Quinn, Edwards, Holcomb, Losman, Couch. Bleh.

4.) Ronnie Harmon sucks.

5.) Quick thoughts on the Sanchez and Edwards trades...personally, I findd it strange that Mangini is interested in helping the team that fired him less than a year ago (I HATE the Jets).

6.) We're going to lose our team once Wilson passes despite unwavering fan support for a team that never wins. Any pointers you can offer? I don't think the NFL's going to give us an expansion team to partially make up for the hurt though.

7.) I knew I was right about Robert Royal sucking.

8.) I don't think Clevelanbd is as bad as St. Louis, Buffalo, Oakland, Kansas City, Detroit, or Tampa Bay, but say you were...if you ended up with the first pick would you role the dice with a QB again and who would it be if you did? Or do you feel burned by Quinn (like us with Losman) and do you hide your head in the sand and gamble some other year at the game's most important position.

Thanks for humoring me since I need to vent now and I was banned from the Bills blog for not approving of our epic Ryan Fitzpatrick signing by the blogger who wrote this piece http://www.buffalorumblings.com/story/2007/12/4/213418/884 .

Also, Santonio Holmes was out of bounds in the Super Bowl last year, Kevin Greene used PEDs, Joe Table sucks, and Art Modell will rightfully rot in hell one day.

Go Bills.

1.) Was that the worst BROWNS win you folks have ever endured? A win is a win, but was that professional football we just watched?

3.) Rank these QBs: Anderson, Quinn, Edwards, Holcomb, Losman, Couch. Bleh.

4.) Ronnie Harmon sucks.

5.) Quick thoughts on the Sanchez and Edwards trades...personally, I findd it strange that Mangini is interested in helping the team that fired him less than a year ago (I HATE the Jets).

7.) I knew I was right about Robert Royal sucking.

Also, Santonio Holmes was out of bounds in the Super Bowl last year, Kevin Greene used PEDs, Joe Table sucks, and Art Modell will rightfully rot in hell one day.

Go Bills.

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Comments

1) No. our D and ST played a great game
2)Nothing will ever make me feel better when the Refs screw us out of the game, just like they did against Jacksonville that one year (the beer bottle incident)
3)I think you pretty much ranked em right in the order you put em in with one exception, I’d still put Couch over Holcomb any day of the week.
5) I think the Sanchez trade and the ensuing trading down that happened was completely retarded, though Alex Mack doesn’t look too bad so it worked out in the end, and as far as Edwards, I wouldn’t call that helping the Jets, he just sucks.
6) my condolences
7) Hands of Stone pure and simple, but I think we picked him up to help in the blocking game.
8) I don’t care how we do it, but we need a new QB and we need him bad, imo someone like (I can’t believe I’m saying this) Roethlisberger who can keep a play alive with his mobility enough to find an open receiver.

thank you very much for the kind words, and now that we won’t see eachother again this season I wish the Bills nothing but the best.

by North Coast Flea on Oct 11, 2009 6:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Losman is gonna take the Vegas Locos straight to a Championship.

by Uriah33 on Oct 11, 2009 6:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Thanks for wasting my time with what should have been a comment on a postgame thread.

by L Train on Oct 11, 2009 7:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

That’s a little harsh, I enjoyed some of his comments.

I would say some of us aren’t quite as down on Mangini yet because we want to give him a few years. If Mangini had been coaching as long as Jauron and that is what we had just witnessed then yes, I’d be ready for the next regime.

by Roger Dorn on Oct 11, 2009 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Too soon to tell about Mangini. If he had been here as long as Jauron and it were still this bad, yeah, I’d be ready.

by rufio on Oct 11, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

booo

by TheRealSlimShady on Oct 11, 2009 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That was rude. There is nothing wrong with this post.

by Buckeye Brad on Oct 11, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

This was far too large for a post-game comment. Good post, and good luck.

by Simmsinns on Oct 11, 2009 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

a little harsh

ok, maybe a little harsh, but I was reading more of a person hoping to smooth over a bruised fan ego than a congratulatory statement. Hence the beginning lines having an effect of, you beat us, but its your worst win ever so please don’t hurt me by being happy about it. And I’m sorry, but I will be very happy about. And 3 years in a row of winning this game means we can actually claim some dominance over something- a thought to which the writer was hoping to dispel- I won’t let that happen. It’s time to eat some f-ing cake.

by L Train on Oct 12, 2009 2:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nothing wrong with the post. Boy there are a lot of bad teams in the NFL. The list above confirms that.
Its early for our coach, lets wait till year 3. Browns need a QB, who I don’t know. People will get on my ass, but McNabb would be interesting to me. Maybe the Eagles let him walk I don’t know.
Sanchez deal, I was OK with, just wish the Browns didn’t go so far down in the 1st round.
I wish Winslow would of worked out here, Browns need a pass catching TE.

by Grockcubs on Oct 11, 2009 11:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I would take McNabb.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Personally, I wouldn’t hate taking a flier on Jason Campbell.

Draft a young kid and let Campbell do his thing for two years. Call it the Kolb plan.

I love Jake Locker and Dan LeFevour. Locker may be a first rounder (He is a big-time baseball prospect also, but he maintains he wants to play in the NFL.)

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 2:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Now those are a couple names that actually excite me. I’m so sick of the Bradford, McCoy, Tebow chorus when it comes to potential NFL QBs. I really like LeFevour and Locker, but I haven’t thought about them as pros much.

by Ryan Kelsey on Oct 12, 2009 3:05 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What about Tony Pike?

by Buckeye Brad on Oct 12, 2009 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

Any of those guys as long as we don’t have to sink Russell/Stafford $$ into them. If we can locate our starting QB in round 2, am all for it.

by talonk on Oct 12, 2009 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

REC

by SpecialBrownie on Oct 12, 2009 2:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dude looks great, no doubt. Even though he’s gained like 20 lbs this season, according to reports, he still looks really frail though. I’m afraid the NFL would break him. Though I’m sure he still can put on some more muscle.

by Ryan Kelsey on Oct 12, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He does come from a spread O.

by TheRealSlimShady on Oct 12, 2009 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

No thank you on Tebow, no sooner than the 3rd round, and with his acceptance that he will possibly play H back or TE.

Bradford, sure. Not sure we want to use a top-5 pick on a QB, but if we did, he’d probably be my guy. Durability is the big question, IMO.

I really like Locker’s physical tools, but have not seen enough of him to determine if I like his intangibles, accuracy, awareness, ability to read a defense, mechanics, etc.

I’d be OK with McCoy. He seems very accurate. I’d want to see him throw deep in workouts. I haven’t looked at him too closely, either but it sounds like his mechanics aren’t great and I know he plays in a QB-friendly offense.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

No thanks on Campbell, living on the east coast I get to see enough of him. I agree the hype of the 3 Bradford, McCoy and Tebow is enough. I wouldn’t touch Tebow until the 7th round. Bradford is never under center that could be a issue and McCoy actually has not played that well this year. Alot of season left see how it shakes out. Out of the 3 I would probably take McCoy.

by Grockcubs on Oct 12, 2009 9:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I personally no longer care about the never under center thing. Hell the Pats ran shotgun over 50% of the time the past two seasons.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

True, but you have to have the roster for that. We are nowhere near ready to run the Patriots offense.

by talonk on Oct 12, 2009 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Are you trying to say that Derek Anderson isn’t Tom Brady and MoMass isn’t Randy Moss and Mike Furrey isn’t Wes Welker?

I AM OFFENDED.

by DisplacedBuckeye on Oct 12, 2009 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

We need a Randy Moss. Maybe even two.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

heck, I’d be happy with a Welker instead.

by talonk on Oct 12, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would be happy with Edelman.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bradford struggles reading defenses. That is why he looks to the sideline for his frequently. He is trying to let the coaching staff read it for him.

by TheRealSlimShady on Oct 12, 2009 5:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Most coaching staffs do that now. I hate it.

Maybe I can get the answer here because I haven’t gotten it elsewhere:

Why is it not a false start when the O-lineman get out of their stances to look at the sidelines? Defenses should be taught to hit the O-lineman as soon as they move. Like LSU-UF Saturday night.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I know that the center is obviously allowed to move, so perhaps if he gets up from his set position, the other linemen are then allowed to follow. (I’m not 100% sure on this, but that’d be my interpretation of the rule.)

by Simmsinns on Oct 12, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rule 7 Section 1. a. 1.
© The snapper may take his hand(s) off the ball if it does not
simulate the start of a play.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah, it always bugged me how the previous UF center would move first, then snap the ball. He always had forward momentum to allow Tebow that added space to plow forwards.

by talonk on Oct 12, 2009 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I have been wondering the same thing

by TheRealSlimShady on Oct 12, 2009 7:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not sure if this the actual rule or not, but if the O-line bends over, but does not get into a 3 point stance, they can get back up and shift as needed. But once they go into a 3 point stance, the yshouldn’t be allowed to reposition.

Is that what you are seeing?

by talonk on Oct 12, 2009 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That could be it, but I am pretty sure they pop up from the 3 point stance. Look for it on Saturday.

Michigan, Florida State, Okie State, Oklahoma, Oregon are the ones off the top of my head.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I am not finding anything against removing a hand from the ground in a non-snap simulating way. In fact, I found this:

II. After a huddle or shift, Team A players take preliminary positions
then advance or drop into final positions. RULING: Such movement
constitutes a shift; players must hold their final positions for one
second before the snap (Rule 2-22-1).

Which I read as implying that a drop into a 3-point stance before the snap is OK, and that a prior shift up to a 2 point stance would also be legal, given a 1 second hold after the shift.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’m not sure if it is against the rules, but it sure is aesthetically terrible. I hate watching it.

by Ryan Kelsey on Oct 13, 2009 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rule 7-1

ARTICLE 4. a. If a snap is preceded by a huddle or shift, all players of the
offensive team must come to an absolute stop and remain stationary in their
positions, without movement of the feet, body, head or arms, for at least one
full second before the ball is snapped (A.R. 7-1-4-I) [S20].

It is not intended that Rule 7-1-4-a should prohibit smooth, rhythmical
shifts if properly executed. A smooth cadence shift or unhurried motion
is not an infraction However, it is the responsibility of an offensive
player who moves before the snap to do so in a manner that in no way
simulates the beginning of a play.

After the ball is ready for play and
all players are in scrimmage formation, no offensive player shall make
a quick, jerky movement before the snap, including but not limited to
(A.R. 7-1-4-II-IV):
1. A lineman moving his foot, shoulder, arm, body or head in a quick,
jerky motion in any direction [S19].
2. The snapper shifting or moving the ball or moving his thumb or
fingers, flexing his elbows, jerking his head, or dipping his shoulders
or buttocks [S19].

In other words, I think because the linemen’s movements aren’t simulating the snap and are not made in a flinch-y or jerk-y way, it’s all good.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks for the clarification. I personally, so no problem at all with this scheme. It’s fun to watch and not at all gimmicky. It just keeps the defense on their toes and allows you to play a fast paced, “high-octane” offense, utilizing certain weapons your team has and making up for ones you might be lacking.

by Simmsinns on Oct 12, 2009 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Has anyone

found any clarification on why UF’s center is allowed to do his little head jerk before he snaps the ball?

"Do you want a bunch of duds walking around with their shoulders slumped and having no emotions, no feelings?" Bradley said. "I don’t think the fans want that. I think they want a guy who’s going to get into the game and feel a little bit. I’ve always said, ‘I don’t really play baseball, I feel it.’ "

by Villeslgr on Oct 12, 2009 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I have not seen him do this I’ll try to pay attention if I decide to watch a Florida game.

From what the rules say, it sounds like it should be illegal. But, if he is doing something like a lot of NFL centers do (looking back at the QB who is in shotgun, then snapping his head back up in to ready position) I do not believe it should draw a penalty because it does not simulate a snap. He would then be simply getting in to his ready position over-zealously.

by rufio on Oct 13, 2009 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LSU did adjust. As soon as the UF center moved his head to the side, the NT pushed him backwards.

Officals flagged it and called it correctly, as a false start. The center did not do it again.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 13, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough, but if the d-line did the same thing when an offense looks to the side for the play call, I’d imagine it’d be an encroachment penalty on the defense.

by Simmsinns on Oct 14, 2009 1:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is what I am wondering. I guess the first call would set the precedent.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 14, 2009 2:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thank you sir. Interesting.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

much obliged!!

by talonk on Oct 13, 2009 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, I’m pretty sure what your seeing is called the no-huddle offense (spread variation). It’s very common at the college and high school level. The offense look to the sideline to get the play call.

by Simmsinns on Oct 12, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I tend to think Bradford is a very good pro prospect. His has superb accuracy and is tall, his arm strength is also underrated. OU does not exclusively play the spread offense, either. I think it’s telling seeing the difference between OU’s offense with and without Bradford this year. Other spread type offenses don’t miss a beat when a QB is replaced.

by Roger Dorn on Oct 12, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

That’s not necessarily why he looks to the sideline. Coaches do this now:

The offense goes to the line and gets into a cadence. Somewhere in that cadence (say, after two leg lifts) the whole offense is told to look to the sideline for adjustments that are made by coaches.

The QB just isn’t given the “keys to the car” so to speak. He isn’t the one making audibles, the coach is. Sometimes, this is because the QB can’t read the D or the Center isn’t good at making the Mike points or because of some player’s deficiency, but sometimes it is done so that the WRs don’t have to be able to hear an audible and can just look at the coaches. Some coaches are just control freaks.

Bottom line: I am pretty sure Bradford isn’t looking to the sideline out of desperation, he’s looking because he’s told to look.

I believe we did this earlier in the preseason/weeks 1 and 2. Not certain. I do remember Quinn looking at the sideline after starting the cadence.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Thank you! Exactly. That is the the no-huddle offense. It’s fairly common offensive scheme in college and high school. I’m having déjà vu.

by Simmsinns on Oct 12, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree, I just don’t think there is one no huddle offense that is the no huddle, and I especially don’t trust Wikipedia to tell me about the one and only no huddle.

This sort of check with the coaches is just something some offenses do, a lot of them being high-tempo, often no-huddle offenses.

by rufio on Oct 12, 2009 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I see your point, I was simply offering a reference for people who may not have been aware of the offense. I did state before that Oklahoma often runs a spread variation of it. Of course, you could put A LOT of different schemes under the “no-huddle” label.

by Simmsinns on Oct 12, 2009 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

1) Offensively, you bet. But I have been in need of a Browns win so badly, I will take it.
2) I have been Anti-Mangini since day 1. That being said, the man deserves his chance and this team has played decent ball past two weeks. While I may not agree with his methods, I dig our ST and defense right now.
3) I think Couch gets a bum rap. He was abused his first years here and had no talent around him. Was never going to be a Peyton type, but he could have been Hasselbeck. He never had a shot.
4) Ummm, okay.
5) I don’t care who Mangini trades with as long as he is getting a haul in value back. Personally, I loved the Sanchez deal, hated the Braylon deal.
6) Never give up hope. I really hope the Bills don’t move. Sometimes loyalty is more important than money.
7) Yeah, the Royal signing looks bad.
8) I think this team drafts in the top 5. And if we have a chance at a QB that the FO thinks is a difference maker, they damn well better draft him. I don’t care if a previous pick didn’t work out. The Ravens and Falcons didn’t let Vick and Boller hold them back. This team needs to make the best moves going forward, not looking back.

Art Modell will rightfully rot in hell one day.

Your my friend.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 12, 2009 12:28 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hah! Commiseration… I feel your pain, but not as bad as usual as we got the W this time. I agree it was not pretty though. There seem to be a lot of similarities between your sentiments and the sentiments of Browns fans. Hope you can keep your team. I wouldn’t wish what happened to the Browns with the whole Modell thing on anyone. And even as bad as they are right now, I still enjoy watching the games and would hate to have them gone.
Anyway…
2. Some fans were very quick to get down on Mangini. I see improvement in many areas. The low penalties on our side of the ball today were decisive in that nail biter. Penalties were a way of life under Crennel.
3. Ranking those guys is like ranking a Yugo, Edsel, and a Trabant. But in our current situation I’m sticking with DA.
5. When the draft went down I don’t think there was any way a new QB would have been accepted as a good pick as at that time most people thought we had 2 credible starters.
6. …just pray it doesn’t happen. It is out of your hands.
7. I think the idea was to get Royal to be a blocking TE. I wasn’t so keen on letting K2 go. K2 for Royal has left a void at TE here as far as receiving goes. But it would have been $$$ to keep K2 so there wasn’t a lot of choice.
8. Tough call about QB at this point in the season. Looks bad now but you never know how it will pan out once the receiver corps gets established. Everyone playing the position is new to the team now. 2 rookies and 3 trades that were new this year. It is going to take a while for everyone to get on the same page. Coach Mangini gets some blame here for a rocky start that did not develop the team chemistry in the best way.

Good luck to you.

Brownsyup

by Brownsyup on Oct 12, 2009 12:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

1.) Was that the worst BROWNS win you folks have ever endured? A win is a win, but was that professional football we just watched?

Probably the worst win, but hell, our worst win is better than our best loss.

2.) Reading your blog this week, it seems like Mangini and your ownership are about as popular with the fan base in Cleveland as Jauron and our ownership are right now with ours…how sad for two passionate fan bases starving for an overdue title. Does this game and the fact that Graham’s FG attempt was probably no good cheer you up at all? Really, you’re 1-0-1 over the past two weeks. Feel better?

—Actually, Mangini isn’t as unpopular here as you seem to think. As of right now, nationally he is MUCH more unpopular then he is here. We’re still up in the air about him, which is the correct thing to be given that he has just started his tenure with the Browns. Jauron should be judged MUCH more harshly since he’s been around a lot more with the Bills.

3.) Rank these QBs: Anderson, Quinn, Edwards, Holcomb, Losman, Couch. Bleh.

—Edwards, Couch, Holcomb, Anderson, Losman, Quinn

4.) Ronnie Harmon sucks.

—Ok.

5.) Quick thoughts on the Sanchez and Edwards trades…personally, I findd it strange that Mangini is interested in helping the team that fired him less than a year ago (I HATE the Jets).

—I wouldn’t say he’s intentionally ‘helping.’

6.) We’re going to lose our team once Wilson passes despite unwavering fan support for a team that never wins. Any pointers you can offer? I don’t think the NFL’s going to give us an expansion team to partially make up for the hurt though.

—You seem very sure of this. I didn’t realize it was to that point yet.

7.) I knew I was right about Robert Royal sucking.

—Too early to say yet.

8.) I don’t think Clevelanbd is as bad as St. Louis, Buffalo, Oakland, Kansas City, Detroit, or Tampa Bay, but say you were…if you ended up with the first pick would you role the dice with a QB again and who would it be if you did? Or do you feel burned by Quinn (like us with Losman) and do you hide your head in the sand and gamble some other year at the game’s most important position.

—I would trade down for more pics.

by johnnyphoenix on Oct 13, 2009 9:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No, Robert Royal sucks.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 13, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, personally I never would have gotten rid of Rucker…

by johnnyphoenix on Oct 14, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Mangini is willing to give Royal the benefit of the doubt that it’s the fault of his seriously jacked up finger. I’m not too sure I buy that.

by Simmsinns on Oct 14, 2009 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Tory Holt catches everything in his zip code with his bad finger.

So, yeah, I’m not buying that either.

by Bernie19Kosar on Oct 14, 2009 2:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

1. It was the worst game I’ve ever seen played, professionally!!! And on top of it all, the streaming video wasn’t as streaming as I would have hoped for. That made DA look even more horrible than he……check that, he looked the same.
2. I don’t want to pass judgment on Mangini yet but I will say that the city of Cleveland and Browns fans everywhere need to form a coup and kick Lerner into Lake Erie. And, no, I don’t feel better. This team shows no heart and doesn’t seem to care either. A few players like J. Cribs and J. Lew are exerting effort but I think that there are hidden motives behind this. Cribs wants out and I don’t blame him and Lewis knows the curtain is coming down on his career.
3. I would give bleh a chance. Couch may have been a good quarterback but there is no way that he could have survived another year of getting hammered by opposing DL’s.
4. Who’s Ronnie Harmon?
5. Edwards? Happy to see him go. He’s a “me guy” and I still think that he muffed passes so he would get the boot. Sanchez? Don’t know yet. Young, lot’s of upside but I don’t think that the pretty boy could hang during a game in Cleveland in December.
6. I stopped watching NFL for the most part when undercover of night, Modell ran out and took our Brownies with him to Baltimore. This team is not our Browns, this is not even a team that should be considered an NFL team. I think that there is a handful of college teams could beat this “team”.
7. I have no beef with Royal. He could stand to catch the ball a bit more often.
8. I don’t know where to go in the draft. I would get as many picks as possible, draft whatever QB that comes out of Purdue in the first round and then nothing but defense, defense, defense.

I hope for your cities sake that your ownership doesn’t jump ship. Getting kicked in the tenders may be more pleasant than watching your team get ripped away and moved to a different city.

Good luck

by Idiot Box on Oct 28, 2009 7:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs