Browns Draft Radar.... The Running Backs
by Dawg26 on Nov 15, 2009 1:16 AM EST
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Today featured plenty of solid matchups for some of the top tiers in the draft class to showcase themselves against the best talent in the league. Lets take a look at some of those players and how they fared:
CJ Spiller, RB, Clemson Tigers
Rounded himself off today showing that he very well could be the best back in the draft. 97 yards rushing with a TD on 18 carries, 3 catches for 48 yards and a TD, and also showed his best Ronnie Brown/Ladanian Tomlinson impersonation with a 17 yard TD pass. Spiller, the Tigers KR as well, was only able to touch 1 Kickoff, as the Wolfpack steered clear of CJ and his 4.3 gamebreaking speed.
Jahvid Best, RB, Cal Bears
Sophmore, Shane Vereen, carried the ball 30 times today vs Arizona, in place of Jahvid Best. Best, a projected 1st round RB and possibly the best in the draft, was sidelined after a concussion sustained in last weeks game. This is the second time during the season that Best has come away with a concussion.
Jonathan Dwyer, RB, Georgia Tech Yellow Jackets
In route to a ACC Berth clinching victory, JD rushed 14 times vs. the Blue Devils, gaining 149 yards and scampering into the endzone from 3 and 12 yards out. Dwyer is projected as a late 2nd round pick and is considered to be an everydown back at the next level
Ryan Mathews, RB, Fresno State
In a game where the Bulldogs were blown out of the stadium, Mathews failed to impress. 8 carries for 40 yards and 1 catch for 10 yards. Fresno State was forced to throw the ball early and often, as they just could not get their offense moving after the 1st Quarter.
Anthony Dixon, RB, Mississippi State
Facing a tough Alabama defense, this game featured many talents for the upcoming draft that I was able to tune into. Dixon became an intriguing prospect for me this evening. 22 carries for 81 yards isn't great, but vs. the Crimson Tide, it isn't too shabby against the nations #4 ranked defense. But the 6'1" 235 back was able to do some damage in the passing game, catching 6 balls for 59 yards, and the leading rusher and receiver for the Bulldogs. He has put up solid numbers against some of the nations best teams (Georgia Tech, Houston, UK, Auburn, and LSU). Dixon is a late 2nd/early 3rd projection, and if the Browns stick to the power run philosophy, Dixon could be a back that flourishes in a pro style power run game in the NFL.
Other Notables:
Charles Scott, LSU - DNP *Broken Collarbone*
Toby Gerhart, Stanford - 29 carries - 178 yards - 3 TD's
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The Browns need a RB. I simply tracked what the top tier RB’s in the Nation did yesterday.
Now, if you want to really know my thoughts?
I would draft Berry quickly. I would find a way to trade back into the 20’s and grab Spiller. I believe he is the best in the draft and can be had as the 2nd RB in the mid 20’s. Used properly, I think he is a very good mix of Chris Johnson/ LT.
Can any one Browns Employee be competent?
by Dawg26 on Nov 15, 2009 6:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
+1
R.I.P. Tony Fein
May God watch over you wherever you are now and may you be in a better place. We will never forget you!
by Zachary Beard on Nov 15, 2009 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
You really should add Dexter McCluster. He has been running like a mad man this year.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 10:24 AM EST reply actions
Yesterday was the first I had seen him play. I’d throw a late second or third round pick at him.
by golanbatrac on Nov 15, 2009 10:54 AM EST up reply actions
If this is all you have, don´t expect us to draft a running back.
Much less are you in a position to predicmentalize us with a hilarious single back formation this year, and go fishing with a proposed pro formation next year.
A) I only went with a few of the better names thrown around in the 2010 draft. This is not a deep draft at the RB position. I am also working on a small school watch piece and a sleeper piece to coincide with it.
B) It is a message board. I am in a position to do whatever I want because I don’t make FO or Coaching decisions. What I SUGGESTED in the other post was that they gameplan to their strengths this season. When you turn over your roster, it is impossible to implement your own system without the proper pieces to the puzzle and expect results. It was a short term solution, though I would personally like to see them go with a Zone scheme and draft Spiller. It would create less draft/FA needs on the OL and possibly even @ QB with Quinn. As well, it would be hard for me to make any proposal of any formation for next year considering I have absolutely no idea who the “Football Czar”, GM, HC, or OC will be.
C) Don’t try to use big words. PREDICMENTALIZE is not a word
Can any one Browns Employee be competent?
If you read a post and you immediately say “what the hell does that mean” and then you see it is by “mooncamping” just ignore it.
Also, welcome. And Good Post.
by Ryan Kelsey on Nov 15, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
Listen. Your big front is starting to look quite shady. You´re actually advocating ignorance at this point. The world is not bad, and people aren´t stupid. If you want to speak for the majority reading this site, at least lobby a little bit.
Thuggishness is not insignificant even if it is aimed at just one person. That´s called bullying.
by mooncamping on Nov 15, 2009 12:17 PM EST up reply actions
Is Shady a reference to me or just part of one of your dumbass metaphors.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
A) Sounds good. Let´s see what you can find.
B) -Yes, it is a message board, actually more or a forum. And you are entitled to voice your opinions.-A zone scheme is inferior to an offensive line actually defending the line of scrimmage on rushing and passing plays. Spiller is good as Davis was good in a collegiately enabled environment, he´s certainly not stellar.-At this point, center is our number one draft need, seeing as experts agree Alex Mack is more suited to guard, and Fraley has proven to be very tenacious at guard. Quinn and Anderson were considered tradable prior to last years draft, it´s a matter of time-and I mean day to day-when they´re gone. If not they will be the costliest players to ever sit the bench in Cleveland.-We don´t have stooges. If you have suggestions, someone with the Browns is reading.
C) I think I´m qualified to use big words. I´m one of the more eloquent people on this site.
by mooncamping on Nov 15, 2009 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
most times, it is the opinion of others that determines one’s eloquence, not one’s own random proclamation of such. don’t turn this into a battle of words and wits, you’ll lose to many other posters on this site.
by Dawg Nuts on Nov 15, 2009 12:50 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs
“you’ll lose to many other posters every poster on this site.”
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 1:39 PM EST up reply actions
what happened to you? you normally shrug all this stuff off, why are you bustin’ out the attitude all of a sudden?
by notthatnoise on Nov 16, 2009 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
“Experts agree that Mack is more suited to guard”
You aren’t an expert.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 1:37 PM EST up reply actions
Mack’s great at center. I’ve had mad man love for the guy since we picked him up.
by BrownDawg1409 on Nov 15, 2009 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
I know, I was just putting that out there.
by BrownDawg1409 on Nov 15, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
Mooncamping
If the Browns don’t draft a running back with there what, 12 picks they are foolish. They will draft a back. This league is set up that you need two good backs, Browns if they have a brain will draft a back early.
I love Spiller, he is game changer.
Maybe you´re right. If I could make those last comments disappear I would. But life is a stage, and the script is unforgiving.
by mooncamping on Nov 16, 2009 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
I am a big fan of Dwyer, he is probably the guy I’d want to target especially if he is going to go round 2.
It’s hard to say where he will go since he comes from an option offense. He could go anywhere from 10-40
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
I agree
That dude is big, fast, and tough to bring down. Watched him against Duke and was very impressed, if he’s available in the 2nd round, I’d be very upset if we don’t take him.
"There's nothing that cleanses the soul like getting the hell kicked out of you." Woody Hayes.
i’m a big fan of gerhart myself, and wouldn’t hesitate to throw a third or even second rounder at him. why isn’t he getting as much love as these other guys? is he slow or something? its not like he’s playing against cream puff teams (spiller, Dwyer, Mathews)
You are clueless if you think Dwyer and Spiller play cupcake teams
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
ok cupcake was a big overstatement, but the ACC isn’t the PAC-10
by notthatnoise on Nov 15, 2009 8:51 PM EST up reply actions
more specifically, USC, Arizona, Oregon, and Cal are all better than most ACC teams, so it could be said gerhart has had tougher competition and put up better numbers.
by notthatnoise on Nov 15, 2009 8:53 PM EST up reply actions
I like Gerhart. If the Browns draft him I wouldn’t be unhappy. Though definitely he’s not high up on the list. We have so many other holes to fill.
oh i agree with that completely, i was just saying that as someone who watches very little college football, i liked what i saw out of him.
by notthatnoise on Nov 16, 2009 9:28 AM EST up reply actions
And yes he is kinda slow. That is his downside. That and the fact that he is white
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 7:39 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe you have more accurate sources, but a 4.6 40 isn’t slow, and I thought he looked pretty quick the couple times I’ve seen him.
Also, I hope you are joking about the part about him being white as a downside.
I’m actually not a big fan of judging speed on 40 times. you don’t play football wearing a speed suit and track spikes. they should make guys run it on the field in full pads.
I also think a shuttle time is more important for a back, it gives a better measure of acceleration and change of direction skills.
by notthatnoise on Nov 15, 2009 8:55 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t disagree. But I just don’t know where the Gerhart “is kinda slow” thing is coming from.
by Ryan Kelsey on Nov 16, 2009 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think he will run that well in the combine. Even if he does, that doesn’t always convert to game speed. Maybe its just my opinion, but I don’t think that he looks that fast in games. I still like him, but is not an everydown guy (at least I don’t think)
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 8:59 PM EST up reply actions
I think that out of these prospects, I’d like to see either Spiller or Dixon. Or maybe even both. Any insight you can offer on how the guys you’ve listed do in pass protection? I like the idea of having a quick back that you can throw the ball to, which would make Spiller a nice option. One of the guys said that we have more of a power running game, so a bigger power back would be a better option. I think it’s also worth noting that our passing game seems to be a check-down type of offense, where no one ever gets open so the quarterback checks down to the running back. That would make Spiller a decent option in my mind. But he is a little small.
It seems like Dixon could also catch the ball… Any idea how fast he might be? I’d imagine it would be tough to get 4.3 speed from a 235 lb back… But I think he could be a good fit considering we have more of a power running game. Depending on how well he does in pass protection, he may be a nice pickup, especially in the late 2nd-3rd round.
Let’s not forget though. We will have James Davis back. I’d be interested to know what you guys think of him and whether he will be a legitimate possibility to be a starting RB next year.
I think Dixon would run around a 4.6-4.7, which isn’t that bad for such a big back. He is another possible third round back.
Montario Hardesty has been doing great for Tennessee this year and could be an everydown back if he stays healthy.
One sleeper might be Joique Bell. He is a D-II back that might be this years Rashad Jennings. He has had over 600 yards in his last two games and has had 28 games where he has ran for over 100 yards.
My favorite though is Ben Tate for Auburn. He reminds me of Cedric Benson. He can run very well in between the tackles, has good size, and even though he doesn’t have blazing speed, he can still be gone if he gets room.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
If we considered junior backs who make the jump early, I would absolutely L-O-V-E LOVE Joe McKnight out of USC.
The guy’s got the homerun speed (ala Chris Johnson) to be a real threat every time he touches the ball. Splitting carries between him and Harrison could only lead to good things. Plus, I like how he’s apparently gotten better at running between the tackles.
We’ll be in a great position to grab a high profile player anyway, why not grab this guy and go for Kurt Coleman (Saftey, Ohio State) later?
If Joe McKnight goes pro, then I wouldn’t want to spend anything higher than a 3rd rounder on him. He is like a poor man’s Reggie Bush to me. I wouldn’t mind a guy like Coleman in the 3rd though
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 7:42 PM EST up reply actions
All the more reason to pick him up. Maybe not as high as I would have thought, (I must admit, what I know is all I’ve seen him do against OSU) I would still love to pick this guy up.
If all we have to do is get him in open space with the ball then all we have to do is make him the check down guy. Our QB’s throw there about ten times a game anyway.
Who are you talking about? McKnight?
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
I’ve never seen the guy play before, but I’d be careful before judging him by what he did against OSU. Let me bring back the memory (although I know it is a painful one for you OSU fans) of Juice Williams and the loss to Illinois. I don’t know that Juice will do much in the NFL, but he certainly did well against OSU.
Another painful memory… All I have to say is Purdue. OSU just isn’t up to the level they normally are year in and year out. I’d be careful about judging NFL talent by what happens in OSU games.
Right, I know that. I’m not trying to make any outrageous claims without doing any research, but from what I’ve been hearing whenever McKnight is concerned is nothing but good news. I’ve seen him play in a few more games since then, and I still think he’ll be worth a serious look if he jumps.
by BrownDawg1409 on Nov 15, 2009 8:08 PM EST up reply actions
Gotcha. Yeah, I really haven’t heard anything about McKnight, but I have been kinda slacking when it comes to the realm of college football this year, so I’ll take your word for it. And I’m definitely tracking with what you said about the check down guy. My ideal is to draft a speed guy that would be a legit check down man… Then maybe pick up a power back that does well in the pass blocking. But maybe there would be some guys that would fit that role in free agency? Not sure. But I’d go with the speed back first.
Well Harrison’s got the speed, just not the bulk. Although that’s not to say he couldn’t handle a full load of carries (which we DID see him do a fantasitic job of doing once).
I thought James Davis did a decent job in pass-pro during the preseason.
At least McKnight is a good size (6 ft from his profile). He also handles punt return and kick return duties and does a fairly good job at it (again, from what I’ve been hearing). It would be a nice touch to have him AND Cribbs in the wildcat backfield at the same time.
by BrownDawg1409 on Nov 15, 2009 8:22 PM EST up reply actions
Hmmm… I mean, if he could be an every down back then I’d consider him, but as far as drafting him because he would be good in the wildcat, I think we need to address other issues than someone that will be used on special teams and in a set that we’ll use maybe 5-10 times a game. But I dunno, like I said, this is all speculation because I haven’t kept up with the college football world.
What do you all think about Royster, he seems like a Matt Forte clone. (I dont know if that is good or bad)
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 15, 2009 9:00 PM EST up reply actions
I am torn on Royster
He has had an average year. Granted there O line is young. However on the flip of that PSU has played no one this year except OSU and Iowa and he struggled. He is a junior so who knows what he will do. If he comes out, maybe in the 5/6 round area.
I have no idea what you’re talking about with regards to OSU, but their defense this year is fantastic. They’re near the top of the rankings nationally in almost every category, and they dominated USC the whole game except for that last drive. They didn’t play well against Purdue, for sure, but much of that had to do with the offense turning the ball over all game long.
And I don’t know what an Illinois game from two years ago has to do with anything.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 15, 2009 9:32 PM EST up reply actions
First of all, let’s not be making this about OSU right now. If you want to talk about OSU then fine, let’s do it, but email me or something. Let’s keep it about the Browns on here.
Now what I was saying is that doing well against OSU doesn’t always translate to talent at the NFL level, and as the years go on and OSU is no longer the consistent undefeated powerhouse that wins a bowl game every year/other year that they used to be. The Illinois game two years ago proves the point that doing well against OSU doesn’t always translate to NFL talent. The case in point is Juice Williams. He did well against OSU in that game, but I haven’t heard anyone saying that he will amount to anything in the NFL. Thus, an example that doing well against OSU doesn’t automatically mean great things in the NFL.
i don’t know about you, but i consider being ranked in the top 10 5-6 years in a row being a powerhouse. and of course doing well against one team doesn’t automatically translate to success at the next level, but it is one indicator.
by notthatnoise on Nov 15, 2009 11:19 PM EST up reply actions
OSU is a top 5, probably top 3 program over the last 5 years.
There may be 2 starters that played against Illinois that year and that start this year. It is a completely different defense. With different strengths and weaknesses. On top of that, you are comparing what a QB did to what a RB did- very different.
I honestly don’t think your point has any merit to it at all. OSU has an excellent defense this year and playing well against them is a good thing. It doesn’t instantly make a player NFL caliber, but it can be fairly looked at as a positive point when considering a player’s future.
by Ryan Kelsey on Nov 16, 2009 12:52 AM EST up reply actions
Good thoughts… Especially on the whole OSU being a powerhouse thing. Top 10 for the last 5-6 years is pretty impressive. I may deal with a jaded view of reality, but what I was going off of was that I remember for so long OSU did nothing but win, and as of late it seems like they haven’t been quite as dominant as I remember them being. That’s what I meant when I said they’re no longer the consistent powerhouse they used to be.
The point I was trying to make is that doing well against OSU doesn’t automatically translate into NFL success. And if it helps to clear the air, I would say the same thing about a Florida or USC program. I wasn’t trying to down OSU (although I will admit it looked like I was), I was simply saying you have to look at more than just the OSU game to determine how talented a player is. Maybe we can agree on that?
yeah i can definitely agree on that, and i think a lot of college football fans get a distorted view of their team. if their team isn’t going to the national title game, or even winning their conference, they see it as a failed season, even if their team is ranked in the top 25.
by notthatnoise on Nov 16, 2009 9:32 AM EST up reply actions
You’re the one who brought up OSU, buddy.
OSU is no longer the consistent undefeated powerhouse that wins a bowl game every year/other year that they used to be
When were they ever? No team in college football is ever consistantly undefeated. But OSU is definiately in the top 5 of college programs this decade and that hasn’t changed recently. And they’ve always sent many players to the NFL, even going back to the Cooper days in the 90’s.
The case in point is Juice Williams. He did well against OSU in that game, but I haven’t heard anyone saying that he will amount to anything in the NFL.
That’s because he’s a quarterback, not a running back. Quaterbacks who can run but can’t throw never do anything in the NFL.
an example that doing well against OSU doesn’t automatically mean great things in the NFL.
You can say that about any team in college football. No college defense is anywhere close to the caliber of an NFL defense, so doing great in college is never an automatic indication of success in the NFL.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 16, 2009 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
To continue, my confusion mostly comes from why you would even bring this up. Someone mentioned the performance of a running back against OSU this season, and you bring up the performance of a QB against OSU two years ago with pretty much a completely different defense. I just don’t get what your point was.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 16, 2009 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
I think I’ve said my point 2 or 3 times. You can go back and read the posts, I’m not going to go through it again.
Did you even read my last post? It doesn’t look like you did at all, because you basically went through and restated most of what I already said.
I wrote my reply after reading your reply to me; I didn’t read anything else you had written elsewhere. I see that some people made the same points which I also made above. I am still confused as to why you even mentioned it in the first place, but it doesn’t really matter.
by Buckeye Brad on Nov 16, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
I like Spiller a lot. I think he runs a lot like Darren Sproles and the Browns can use some speed. I’m also a fan of Dwyer and we couldn’t go wrong with him. But I think Gerhart is the real gem. Big, great feet and balance, excellent work ethic, hard to bring down… he’d look great in orange.
Brownsyup
I like Sproles, but don’t want him or a player like him as the centerpiece of our rushing attack. He is not the type that can be effective game-to-game. We need a large bruising back in the mold of Steven Jackson.
I agree. I like Gerhart over Dwyer though because I think Dwyer might be more a product of a better offensive line. What I’ve seen of Gerhart is that he seems to do a lot more on his own after contact. It is pretty amazing what he did against a decent USC defense.
Brownsyup
Interesting. It is hard to get a read on Dwyer sometimes because he plays the full back in an option attack. But almost all his runs are coming between the tackles with 9 guys in the box. He is bigger and stronger than Gerhart, I think. And probably close to the same speed. I guess it isn’t a sure thing that Dwyer even comes out this year, and if he does, he might go in the first round. I don’t want a RB in the first round (pretty much ever), but if he was there in the second, I’d take either.
by Ryan Kelsey on Nov 16, 2009 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
Dwyer is faster than Gerhart. Dwyer might run about a 4.45 at the combine
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 16, 2009 6:56 PM EST up reply actions
Do you have any reason to say this? Just what you have seen? Or just because Gerhart is white?
All I know is that the reported 40 times I’ve seen (and cited) have been pretty close.
Because Dwyer ran a 4.44 coming out of high school.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 16, 2009 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
I think Spiller is bigger and stronger than Sproles, but not as fast
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 16, 2009 6:55 PM EST up reply actions
wow i can’t believe scout.com thought gerhart was only the 40th best HB in the nation coming out of high school.
considering he holds the career high school rushing record, with 700 more yards than emmit smith
by notthatnoise on Nov 16, 2009 3:34 PM EST up reply actions
With all this draft talk, I can’t help but feel we’ll get nonna these players (Spiller, Suh, Berry) with Mangini at the helm. His last draft approach, well, we couldn’t predict all of that. He goes in for smart, tough guys at the expense of more talent. Now that might or might not be a good thing.
We might be talking about the wrong names here.
Browns Should Have Drafted Beanie
They had their shot this year to draft Beanie Wells and passed on him. Beanie is already starting to assert himself in Arizona. He’s going to be a premier RB in the NFL within the next couple years.
We really need a runningback. I would be surprised if any RB on our current roster is here next year.
by TheRealSlimShady on Nov 22, 2009 5:43 PM EST reply actions
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