Gold Star for Mangini's and Kokinis' First Transactions
by Chris Pokorny on Feb 11, 2009 12:30 PM EST
in General News
Email
PrintAs most of you know by now, the Cleveland Browns released several players on Monday. Monday was the first day that teams were allowed to start disposing of their players, and Eric Mangini and George Kokinis made moves towards improving the future of this team. In other words, they didn't get it "wrong".
- QB Ken Dorsey: After his performance at the end of the season, I don't think anybody would argue against Dorsey's release (except for Bernie Kosar, perhaps). He was only considered a mentor to Brady Quinn at first, but I think we're past the point of mentoring for him now.
- QB Bruce Gradkowski: He had a limited amount of time to show what he was capable of. Unfortunately for Bruce, he failed miserably.
- OL Eric Young: These type of guys come and go, with their only real chance of hanging on being if the head coaching position remains consistent.
- LB Antwan Peek: By far, this is the toughest cut to brush off, but it was a necessary one. Peek has been plagued by injuries almost more than Courtney Brown was. On top of that, Peek was never a Pro Bowl caliber player in the first place. This cut also means that focusing on OLB in the draft and in free agency remains a high priority, since the chances of Willie McGinest being retained are not too strong.
- CB Terry Cousin: The veteran defensive back definitely underachieved last year, as he was not the answer we had hoped for when DB Daven Holly went down. It's good to see Mangini dump him, considering he did take a crack at veteran DB Ty Law last season.
- K Jason Reda: Who knows; you might see him back in training camp.
- P Mike Dragosavich
SB Nation is in the process of compiling the most complete and accurate list of free agents in the NFL, as many sites have outdated or inaccurate reports. When that becomes available, I'll post it for everybody to see and discuss.
55 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
Cuts
Chris, love you man but please reserve gold stars for when substanitive decisions are made.
But then when a big decision comes, a little ol’ Gold Star won’t seem too meaningful. :-O
That’s when I bring out the monkey for bad decisions or…or…hmm, well it’s been so long since I praised a head coach of ours for good decisions that I don’t know what I’d give him for that.
Dawgs By Nature - Find out why Pittsburgh still sucks.
by Chris Pokorny on Feb 11, 2009 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
So, with Peek and presumably McGinest gone, does that open up much salary cap space with which to pursue replacements?
Should open up something. If I remember correctly, McGinest and Davis took pay cuts last year, and Peek wasn’t paid like an all star. It also depends on things like how much of the players’ contracts were signing bonuses and all of that jazz.
Every little bit helps, though.
I honestly think we will be able to go after one or two “key” FAs who we can hope will start and still sign our picks and fill out our roster. Canty and Bart Scott I don’t think will be out of the question if no one offers them ridiculous Gibril Wilson-type deals. There are a bunch of decent FAs at positions we need like CB and OC. They may or may not resign with their original teams, but the more that are unsigned when free agency starts, the better for us. I guess we will see.
I thought we had an offensive coordinator (OC), no?
by JulioBernazard on Feb 12, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions
You could teach Yahoo Message Boards......
……something.
I love the way after you open up and read the replys, they go from yellow to white.
Approcah YAHOO!!!!!! Maybe you could make a $$ on that.
That’s a tribute to the wonderful behind-the-scenes people at SB Nation (our network).
Dawgs By Nature - Find out why Pittsburgh still sucks.
by Chris Pokorny on Feb 12, 2009 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
Off-Season Moves
While these moves seem minor at the moment it’s good to see Mangini and Kokinis take the initiative and begin to get these scrubs outta here. I was constantly yelling at the t.v. everytime I seen Cousin get burned. Which was about 98% of the time he played. Peek can hardly be a questionable release also. I personally can’t wait for the draft and call me crazy but depending on the combine, I’d love to see the Browns get Rey Maualuga from USC. He has the tenacity, heart and passion that has been so desperately needed on defense.
I do not want the Browns to take Malauga at 5, that is way too high for him. He’s a mid-teens pick at best. Heart and passion is great, but he’s also easy to block and he misses a lot of plays. He’s overhyped because of all the big hits he gets and the media coverage of USC. From everything I hear, Curry is a much better linebacker and possibly the best defensive player on the board. I’m pretty sure the Browns will take either him or Jenkins at 5 if they stay there.
The best thing probably is to hit [Grady] 2nd -- Jay
by Buckeye Brad on Feb 12, 2009 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
someone’s going to take maualuga way too high. he’s a freaky athlete, but his fundamentals and general football IQ seem to be lacking. maybe you can coach him up, but 5 is way too high. personally, i’d rather take cushing AND matthews over him.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 13, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
If anyone is counting on me to coach him up then they’re in trouble.
The best thing probably is to hit [Grady] 2nd -- Jay
by Buckeye Brad on Feb 13, 2009 3:08 PM EST up reply actions
You can use the 3rd qb to your advantage on the roster, so I don’t think we would designate Cribbs as the 3rd QB (because he would already be active for gameday). He would probably play as the 3rd QB if the season started tomorrow, though.
Man we’re a skittish fan base if we’re wondering who the 3rd QB is on Feb 12th…
lowbrowsophisticate.com
heh…+1
Dawgs By Nature - Find out why Pittsburgh still sucks.
by Chris Pokorny on Feb 12, 2009 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
Well, it quickly comes into play if we flip DA, right?
by JulioBernazard on Feb 13, 2009 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, and I’m just assuming that if he’s traded the #2 isn’t currently on our roster, let alone the number 3. Sorry I wasn’t clear.
My point was that I just don’t see the point in wondering who are number three is “right now”, because the answer doesn’t have anything to do with who will be the number 3 or number 2 at any point in a Browns season.
lowbrowsophisticate.com
I agree that taking Mauluaga at the 5 spot is too high. I’m hoping that we can find a trade partner to add some more picks in the draft since Savage decided to trade away a few picks in this years draft to snag a TE and ILB that didn’t even see action last year. Those were some franchise altering deals right there. But anyways, taht would be my perfect world/ Trade down and get ATLEAST 2 more picks and still be able to take Mauluaga.
Mark me down as one that would hate a Jenkins pick at 5. Corners are not game changers, and we need at least two linebackers. And not Jacksons or L. Williams’. We need Farriors and Woodleys and Harrisons.
lowbrowsophisticate.com
hate’s a pretty strong word. if both curry and crabtree are gone, would you still be pissed at a jenkins pick?
i think jenkins is a good pick at 5, but if there’s a stud LB there (i just don’t know enough about curry to know if he’s great) i agree that we should go w/ that pick first.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 13, 2009 1:49 PM EST up reply actions
I’m somewhat convinced by your idea that drafting Jenkins gives us a plus-plus secondary that would allow for a lesser LBing corp (the “steelers 08 offensive line” approach), though I’m more worried about safety than corner at this point, to be honest. It really does depend on the player’s grade in my opinion, which is why scouting is far and away the most important part of any NFL football organization (and why I harped on Savage for so long). I’ll put it this way concerning specifically the needs of the Cleveland Browns and who to draft at 5, using a 1-100 grading scale:
95LB > 95CB
92LB > 95CB
97CB > 90LB
99WR > 92LB > 92 CB
And so on and so on. Now, those numbers are purely hypothetical, i just picked them at random to make my point (ie, that even a lower graded but impact LB is better than a stud CB for this team, and also that you never pass up a Jerry Rice or LaDanian Tomlinson despite need if they are sitting in your lap). So you’ve gotta fill in the grades next to Curry and Jenkins and Brown and Rey M. and Crabtree and etc etc etc. But without that kind of knowledge, all I can do as a fan is the above. And that’s why I’m of the opinion that CB is not the wisest way to go for us.
lowbrowsophisticate.com
just to elaborate on my jenkins thought…i definitely don’t mean to imply that picking jenkins would be a silver bullet for our pass defense, but i really do think it would alleviate some pressure on the front 7 if you have a “plus-plus secondary”, to steal your term. mcdonald has certainly showed enough ability to allow for additional pressure from safeties or even corners (w/ pool rotating over into coverage) in obvious passing situations, when wright, jenkins and mcdonald would all be on the field. and hopefully, w/ jenkins and wright on the pitch at all times, there would be more of those longer, “obvious passing” scenarios.
your point about the LBs, though, made here and elsewhere, is well-taken. especially in a 3-4 (i’m assuming we’re going to run a defense that at least resembles, in scheme, the defense of the last 4 years), the LBs are the most important players on the field—whether it be as edge rushers, or gap busters in the event that the DL does their job. as such, given the pathetic state of our LB corps (something that i put directly at savage’s feet…allowing a 3-4 team to take the field w/ these LBs), LB has to be priority number one…but as far as who we actually draft it has to come down to grades, i believe you’re right.
don’t be surprised to see D’Q Jackson go the way of Jonathan Vilma, who Mangina ran out of NY for being too small. D’Q is 6-0, 240…vilma 6-1, 230. this just makes our LB need even greater.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 16, 2009 4:43 PM EST up reply actions
You think that’s the case even though Mangini went out of his way to complement DQ before anyone else in his first comments on this roster? I bashed him during the season, and I’m not a “review the tape” person, but I’m beginning to be convinced that DQ’s problems had a lot to do with the guy standing next to him.
I thought Vilma’s problems was an overt preference for the 43?
lowbrowsophisticate.com
yeah, i saw those comments that ‘gina made, but for whatever reason i’m just not convinced by those. DQ is constantly around the ball, sure, but based on what i saw this year he seems to constantly be around the ball…only 6 yards downfield. having ‘dra davis next to him was no doubt a disaster, but i just can’t convince myself that DQ is big enough to take on guards in the NFL, and though i’m no scout, i’m having a hard time seeing ’gina put up with an undersized MLB.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 17, 2009 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
D’Qwell is good enough to make a lot of tackles and know where the play is going every time. If he played next to a LB who was above-average in terms of speed instead of the slowest LB in the league, he would look a lot better. Are there better LBs out there? sure. But replacing D’Qwell is really far down my list of “If I could do anything I wanted to with the Browns’ roster”.
Can’t you think of like 8-10 players you would like to cut before Jackson in a dream scenario?
i don’t think DQ is very good, but i certainly didn’t mean that ‘gina SHOULD send him packing anytime soon. i’m just positing a theory as to what i think will happen to the LB corps over the near-to-intermediate term.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 17, 2009 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
draft
A CB at 5 is too high. Maualuga can’t cover and is a mid 1st rouder. Both Curry and Crabtree will be gone by 5 but I would take either if there. Crabtree is another Warfield and WR is another big need. The whole right side of the line needs replacement and I would take a FA Center or use a 2 on that Oregon center that can play all the line positions if still there. You can get a can’t miss stud OT at 5. This draft could shore up the OL for years and make average RB’s look good. Your QB would also live to see another day. Make Cribbs a SS. This team needs (in no order) RB,WR,C,OG,OT,DE,OLB,ILB,SS.CB,DT
Funny. I remember thinking a couple of years ago that Cribbs might make a good SS, but it never materialized. I would have been all for it then, but not sure if it would be a wise move now, especially if the new regime means means we might see a truly creative ‘flash’ package.
Cribbs
If you look at Cribbs stats on offence, he was average…around 15th in everything. That could be because of his injury. He looked good because Lewis was so bad. The OL stunk it up too. He is a hitter tho, as his special team coverage shows that. Also, what’s the big deal about the “flash” package? I see it get stuffed all the time. Looks like a “flash in the pan” to me.
It definitely didn’t pan out this year, but that is why I said a truly creative package, which would mean making it unexpected. I don’t think the Browns lined Cribbs up in the backfield often enough without using him – but that could just be my poor memory for details. I think there’s a lot to be said for making your offense hard to read, as opposed to “Lewis up the middle for 1 yd.” Don’t get me wrong. I like a good running game, but even that has to have a bit of spice now and then.
The more I think about the Chiefs at number 3, the more I think they will trade down. It is completely characteristic of a former Patriot personnel guy to want to trade down and if there is one sweet spot for a trade right now, it is the spot in front of the Seahawks, the most likely team to take Crabtree. If you could think of one player in this year’s draft that a team would want to trade up to select, I would say that player is Crabtree.
Where does that leave us?
-Stafford and an OT will go 1 and 2
- Team will trade up with the Chiefs to select Crab
- Seahawks miss out on their guy, who are they looking at now? They have Tatupu, do they select Aaron Curry, when their offense is a mess? I don’t think so
I think Curry will be there at 5 if we want him over Jenkins
i agree with your list of needs and your assessment of maualuga…but are you suggesting that we take a second top-5 OT in 3 years? when Joe T has made 2 pro bowls and appears to be all-world? seems to me that that would be a MASSIVE reach at 5 for a RT. top flight RT’s can be had in later rounds, to be sure, and there seems to be a decent amount of talent at other positions (LB, DE) that we’d be passing on to take a RT.
by DontCallMeJoey on Feb 13, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
A great LT would make a great RT. I’m just saying that the OL needs a C, RG, and RT. I don’t care if one is taken early or not. We have needs everywhere and we don’t have the talent some people say we do. I saw Thomas get bull rushed by a guy 30 pounds lighter this year. How he made the pro bowl this year is a mystery. I think the OL need fixing but most others don’t think so. As for Mack or Unger, I would be fine with either one. I think that a QB has to be taken in the top four for Curry to fall to us. Crabtree should be gone by 5. We also need an enforcer at safety rather than a CB. That would shore up our learning CB’s. As for trades, DA is a 4th rounder at best (I wanted him dumped after his miracle year when he had value), and K2 is washed up. A 5 or 6 for him. BE needs to be coached up big time. ex wide receiver announcers kept pointing out how BE did about everything wrong last year.
5th or 6th for round pick for Winslow?? Are you kidding me? First of all, why in the hell would the Browns do that. Secondly, Winslow is much more valuable than that. Third….are you out of your mind?!?! He was our best reciever last year. We need to add playmakers on offense, not trade them away.
And O-line is the least of our worries this year. We have many more holes to fill first.
The best thing probably is to hit [Grady] 2nd -- Jay
by Buckeye Brad on Feb 16, 2009 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
K2 has no knee left. He is little more than a slow wide receiver since he can’t block either. He won’t finish the season again. This guy walks with a limp. He may simply be cut. DA would be better than a rookie from this class and that’s why someone may trade a 4 for him. He can’t run a huddle nor hit a crossing pattern. Of course, there may be a GM out there that will trade a 2 or 3 if the Browns pay off the contract.
This is all just wild, unfounded opinions. K2 has missed about 3 games to injury in 3 years. Of course his longevity is a question, but “5 or 6” is just comical. I bet every team in the league would offer their 4th rounder for him. Yes, every single one.
Who knows what DA’s trade value is, but based on your evaluation of K2, I feel a lot better about it now.
lowbrowsophisticate.com
Winslow games missed
2004 missed 14 games
2005 missed 16 games
2006 missed 0 games
2007 missed 0 games
2008 missed 6 games
that is 36 games out of 80. You don’t spend millions on people can’t play every game .
WOW
Waiter, whatever Paulbip is having….Bring me some.
Seriosuly man……A 5th or 6th for unquestionably a top 5 TE in the NFL??? You must seriosuly be taking some high doses of medication if that’s your evaluation of K2. Secondly, D.A will command more than a 4th round pick. I mean didn’t the Browns give up a 4th rounder to bring in washed up Dilfer? So, you can’t seriously sit here and believe that D.A isn’t worth more than a 4th. We’ll get a 2nd if we hold out long enough.
On to the important stuff. The more I think about it the more I like the Browns drafting Jenkins at 5 or an OT. The right side of our O-line was atrocious last year. I think Jenkins would instantly make our D-Backfield legit and take pressure off of our LB’s n DL. They must bring Jones back though for this to work. Also, bringing in Leonhard from BAL to start alongside Jones would be great.
What is DA worth?
Word out of Tampa Bay is that he is worth a mid 3 if the Browns pay off the 5 mil. I said he was a 4 without paying the 5 mil. The people in Tampa Bay seem to agree with me.
Ya, I do. I just don’t think he is progressing the way he should. We did use a 2nd rd pick on him. I’d expect a little more production. However, my judgement could be clouded because Pool and Jones are scrambling for their lives back there tryna defend recievers whose QB has 4 months of Sunday’s to throw the ball. I like Pool. I just don’t think he’s starter material right now. I see the potential, just a little too inconsistent.
Browns draft (what if ?)
Let’s say that whomever the Browns want at 5 is not there and the Browns trade down with Detroit. Detroit would get the QB and stud OT while the Browns would get the #20 first round pick and Detroit’s 2nd round pick plus a 3 for next year. That would about add up right. Say also that you could pick up another 2 by paying off DA the 5 mil and finding a sucker to jump on the trade. Who would you go after with those 4 picks? I would take …
RB LeSean McCoy (best RB in draft),Max Unger (can play C,OG,OT), Larry English (fast 3-4 OL with great character) and Louis Delmas FS,CB (also character guy). Problem is that these guys are starting to climb in the draft. But anyway, I would take any of these guys with our #2.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Non-stop coverage of the team with the best fans in the NFL, the Cleveland Browns.
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
Follow DBN on Twitter
Browns Links
Local Media Sources
Official Browns Site
Orange and Brown Report
Cleveland Plain Dealer
Akron Beacon Journal
Browns Communities/Blogs
The Watercooler
Waiting for Next Year
Dawg Scooper
Dawg Talkers
Dawg Bones
The Browns Board
In Association With
Shutdown Corner - NFL - Yahoo! Sports
- Deep Posts: Super Bowl Edition
- Smarter Stats: Super Bowl Edition — New England’s offense vs. New York’s defense
- Puppy Bowl VIII: The Scouting Report
- Giants get ahead of themselves with ‘Super Bowl Champions’ home page … on Saturday
- Smarter Stats: Super Bowl Edition — Giants’ offense vs. Patriots’ defense
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
