NFL Championship Sunday: Open Game Thread
by Chris Pokorny on Jan 24, 2010 11:49 AM EST
in General News
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PrintToday is the day that will determine which two teams will face off on February 7 in the Super Bowl. We almost had a rarity in today's NFL era where both the AFC and NFC Championships would have featured the No. 1 vs. the No. 2 seeds, but the New York Jets prevented that by stunning the San Diego Chargers last week. Will Peyton Manning be able to lead the Colts past the Jets' Darrelle Revis? Can Brett Favre lead the Vikings to a Super Bowl in his first season with the team by outshooting Drew Brees' offense?
If you would like to comment on either of the games, whether it be before, during, or after the game(s), please do so here. The brief previews are after the jump.
AFC Divisional: New York Jets vs. Indianapolis Colts (3:00 PM, CBS) [See SB Nation Coverage Here]
When you look at the New York Jets minus Braylon Edwards, you can have an appreciation for how they've been able to win two playoff games thus far against division leaders. Last week, they ended the Chargers' long winning streak on the road. Despite being down a little bit early, the defense held it together and did not allow the height advantage of San Diego's receivers bring them down.
CB Darrelle Revis continues to be amazing for the Jets; you'd think that one of these times, Revis would get beat on even a simple 10-yard pattern or something. Any time a throw goes his way though, it seems to get intercepted or tipped away. Will that be the case for Peyton Manning, arguably the league's best quarterback? Revis should be lined up against Reggie Wayne most of the day, but that could be a problem for the Jets. Manning has no problem not going to a receiver -- there have been times where he's thrown the ball to someone like Dallas Clark almost 10 times in one drive.
Offensively, the Jets have stuck to a sound running game. There entire gameplan revolves around their offense not falling behind by two possessions though, because if they do, odds are that Mark Sanchez will have to put more weight on his shoulders. He's done very well as a supplement to the running game, but if the ground game has to be abandoned, I still have my doubts in him.
These two teams met not to long ago. The Colts had a 14-0 record in Week 16 and were battling the Jets in Indianapolis. The Colts had the advantage in the third quarter, but the Jets were still very much in the game. Indianapolis then pulled their starters and watched backup quarterback Curtis Painter hand the Jets a win. It was a much-needed win for the Jets, but the Colts' coaching staff could care less.
The Jets have had a great run, but it ends today against the the Colts. Colts win by 14.
NFC Divisional: Minnesota Vikings vs. New Orleans Saints (6:40 PM, FOX) [See SB Nation Coverage Here]
I don't think there's any arguing that this is the best NFC Championship match the league could have asked for. Although both teams struggled the last few weeks of the season (compared to their red-hot starts), both teams were unstoppable against two powerhouses in the Arizona Cardinals and Dallas Cowboys last week.
Each team is led by well-respected, team-leading quarterbacks. Brett Favre has had the best passing season of his career, and Drew Brees has been Drew Brees.
The thing you have to appreciate about both teams, and the reason why both teams are so dangerous, is the amount of different weapons/playmakers they have. Since Adrian Peterson's struggles began, neither team has really had a "go-to-guy" (not including the quarterbacks) on offense.
The Saints can get you with any one of Marques Colston, Devery Henderson, Robert Meachem, Jeremy Shockey, Reggie Bush, or Pierre Thomas. The Vikings can get you with any one of Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Bernard Berrian, Visanthe Shiancoe, Adrian Peterson, or Chester Taylor.
Both teams feature an array of defensive specialists too, from the Vikings' Jared Allen to the Saints' Darren Sharper. These two teams are so evenly matched on paper that it's hard for me to break down why a particular team will win over the other. I'll ride with the home Saints in a down-to-the-wire comeback effort. Saints win by 4.
Chris' Playoff Record To Date: 3-5
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Feel free to share your own predictions on today's games in this thread as well.
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As much as I hate Braylon Edwards (and boy, do I HATE Braylon Edwards), does anyone else secretly want the Jets to win just a little bit, just for the upset set factor?
Haha, yeah me neither. :- /
Part of me is interested in hearing the media and players talk about Mangini if the Jets make it to the SB. It is such an amazing story.
Add in the twist that Rob Ryan is DC on the Browns and we should see more media attention on the Browns than any other team not in the SB.
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jan 24, 2010 1:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Part of me is interested in hearing the media and players talk about Mangini if the Jets make it to the SB. It is such an amazing story.
Add in the twist that Rob Ryan is DC on the Browns and we should see more media attention on the Browns than any other team not in the SB.
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jan 24, 2010 1:33 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I like the Jets and wouldn’t mind them winning – without any help from Braylon, of course!
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jan 24, 2010 5:30 PM EST up reply actions
I’ll be rooting for the Colts. The “New York team as scrappy underdog” leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
Rec on finding the irony
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jan 24, 2010 3:15 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I hate the Jets.
Cyborgs 35
Sanchezs 10
I am pulling for the Vikings because there is an outside chance that Favre is retiring. I can’t believe no one is talking about this.
Vikes 41
Saints 24
I would actually like to never see brett favre retire. I would like every team in the league to say “no thanks, we don’t want you.”
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 2:25 PM EST up reply actions
@Colts 24
Jets 17
Vikings 30
Saints 28@
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
Looking good on the first game, golanbatrac!
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jan 24, 2010 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
Colts: 24
Jets: 17
Vikings: 28
Saints: 31
We’ll see how off I am, haha.
by emily522 on Jan 24, 2010 2:29 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Not too bad on the first so far!
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jan 24, 2010 5:31 PM EST up reply actions
If the Saints kick a field goal your prediction will be dead on.
Holy crap.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
Best predictions of today.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:25 PM EST up reply actions
Good call on game 2.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 10:41 PM EST up reply actions
Only off by a lil’ on the Colts’ points.
Good job kido.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:56 AM EST up reply actions
Look for the Jets to run the Power over and over and over in their game. It is their go-to running play, and they might do it from the Wildcat with Brad Smith at QB in addition to the normal offense.
The pulling Guard will probably tell you it is the Power.
Who’d have thought that on the Jets’ opening drive that Edwards would catch the ball, and the kicker would screw up.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:19 PM EST reply actions
Why would the Jets try and run wide against the Colts?
What kind of douchebag kicker wears gloves indoors?
Does every single person in the stands own a jersey? Look at the crowd. I hae never seen more jerseys in a crowd in my life.
According to FO teams have more success running outside vs the colts than inside.
Which goes against everything you’d expect- go figure.
"The Braylon vaccine- one jab and you'll never catch anything ever again"
that is why i’m extremely wary of those stats
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 2:27 PM EST up reply actions
HEY Just read that Holmgren is going to cut Stallworth after reinstatment.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
I dont know how to make it a direct link, sorry
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
nm
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
You can type something, highlight it, and then click the little chain icon next to the tree icon and the bold/italics/strike icons. Copy and paste the link in there and you’re all set. Whatever you typed will be the link
As for the Yahoo article:
he Cleveland Plain Dealer is reporting the team will cut Stallworth immediately upon his reinstatement
…means “Tony Grossi said that cutting Stallworth is ‘likely’ and that ‘it is believed’ they Browns would not bring Stallworth back”. In other words, no one from the Browns has actually said any of it. Although it would make sense to cut him, none of it is news yet. Just speculation.
OH ok, thanks for the tip. Now I can be cool like you guys.
I never read the CPD. Based on what you say, I can assume Grossi is a gossiper.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 4:48 PM EST up reply actions
I mean, I don’t like him, but he’s just doing what ESPN and everyone else is doing right now; he’s trying to be the first one who gets the idea out there in the press.
He can guess wrong on a bunch of obscure things with little consequence but then brag when he gets one right. And in this case, I don’t think anyone would be surprised if Stallworth actually was cut.
But like the whole Mangini situation, I don’t even think Holmgren/Heckert know what they are going to do yet.
Simms is a joke. His route wasn’t good, it was the QB play that got Braylon open on the TD, you can see the defender bite hard on something in the backfield. It also looked like they blitzed, and didn’t get there. That’s just good protection, not good route running.
“OMG, after 1900 years of being a WR, Braylon can run an OK sluggo! His route running is so good!”
Quick refs, chack his hand and make sure there’s no glue on them.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
2nd coming of Antonio Bryant?
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
fuck that fuckstick
You are reading my signature.
by rolub on Jan 24, 2010 3:45 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Goddamn you Edwards!
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:45 PM EST reply actions
That guy would look great in Brown and Orange
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
I hope you’re talking about Sanchez…….
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:47 PM EST up reply actions
I was referring to the 10% of Edwards that can play.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 3:49 PM EST up reply actions
The other 90% isn’t worth the 10%
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:51 PM EST up reply actions
You have to know I was joking, at some point.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
My hatred for Edwards caused it to sail right over my head.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
Don’t worry fella’s, he’s just building up for an EVEN bigger drop in the Superbowl, that would have won the game.
Well, that was his best play in 2 years
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 3:52 PM EST up reply actions
Can’t trust the karma train.
"Nobody ever thinks, 'Hey, maybe I’m actually an idiot.'" - Jay
by woodsmeister on Jan 24, 2010 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
All of the Michigan hatred is starting to boil over… /sarc
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jan 24, 2010 3:54 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I get that Revis is good, but Nance nearly pooping his pants over Reggie Wayne catching a pass with Revis in coverage is laughable.
I 2nd that emotion
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 4:01 PM EST up reply actions
I think either one of these teams would lose to either one of the NFC teams, so this one doesn’t matter much to me.
“It’s a football.” “Who told you?”
or
“I can do this all day football star. It’s on fire! It’s on fire!”
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:01 PM EST up reply actions
Wow.
Underthrown, but still, how is the Colts D going to let him get out like that. I looked clear to me, by the way Smith was only jogging.
yes
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, a few years ago. Colts SB season.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
This could be the drive that defines the game.
"The Braylon vaccine- one jab and you'll never catch anything ever again"
All in all, decent game, I guess
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 5:37 PM EST up reply actions
I never thought I’d be happy seeing the Colts winning, especially after the last game of 07.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 5:43 PM EST reply actions
That *Surgie guy screwed us. He played like crap.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 5:46 PM EST up reply actions
Had to refresh my memory. Jim Sorgi
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 5:51 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn’t go that far. lol
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
Imagine this Colts team with a healthy Gonzo as the 3rd WR next season with Colie as the 4th WR.
Manning may throw for 5,000 yards next season.
By the way, anyone heard Bart Scott’s name this entire game?
If he doesn’t for the colts, he will for another team.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
Pierre Garcon is my man. Came from my hometown’s college. You would not believe the following.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:03 PM EST up reply actions
Matt Stover, oldest man to ever play in a Super Bowl!
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jan 24, 2010 5:57 PM EST reply actions
Colts are set to win by 13, not too far off my projection of 14! Despite the final score, it was still a fun game to watch.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
Now the big question is this: Will Braylon now thank Mangini and the Browns for giving him the opportunity to lose in the AFC championship game? He’s expressed his gratitude before ;)
"I’d like to thank Mangini in giving me the opportunity to help this team get a shitty draft number."
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:06 PM EST up reply actions
“I didn’t get enough balls thrown my way…”
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jan 24, 2010 6:06 PM EST up reply actions
"And I un-necessarily jumped for it."
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:09 PM EST up reply actions
Stan…
“My son is a great player when he’s happy.”
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:13 PM EST up reply actions
I hear ya. I never watch Sunday morning Fox
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:20 PM EST up reply actions
you're joking
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:28 PM EST up reply actions
Leave it to Fox to put American Idol in their pregame. F’ing tools!!!!
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
I thought this game was supposed to kickoff at 6:30. It doesn’t seem like they’re getting ready to kick…
6:40
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:33 PM EST up reply actions
So, 6:50 probably
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:34 PM EST up reply actions
Go up and put some foil on it.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 6:49 PM EST up reply actions
This is already better than the other game
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
What was the call on the hit on Favre there? It was a running play — why can’t you run over a potential blocker?
I think the rule is that after a QB hands the ball off, unless he is blocking, then he is “out” of the play. That is why they called it “out of the play”.
Until the QB tries to block someone or acts like he still has the ball, you are not allowed to hit the QB on a running play. It was a dumb play by McCray.
If you watched the Jets game earlier, Sanchez was tagged on a running play, and it looked like the official told Rex Ryan that Sanchez was acting like he still had the ball. Ryan disagreed.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 8:33 PM EST up reply actions
But if you are Ryan or Childress, you have to know your QB is vulnerable in that situation because they probably run PA fakes off of those plays where the QB actually does still have the ball.
I think that the QB should be hit-able until they clearly give themselves up as out of the play (i.e. thrown their arms up). Especially a QB like Favre who has probably acted like he didn’t have the ball while nonchalantly holding it out of the defense’s line of sight.
I’m not saying it is a good rule or not, but McCray had enough time to see that Favre didn’t have the football. McCray then lowered his head and drilled Favre.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 8:43 PM EST up reply actions
He should have been smarter than to do that, I agree with you. I think the rule sucks in addition to your original point.
I hate all of the rules about when and where you can hit a QB. at some point they’re either playing football or they’re not.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Looks like his fumblitis is contagious.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 9:06 PM EST up reply actions
That roughing the passer call was bogus, butit was nice seeing Fare roll around in pain two plays in a row.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 9:05 PM EST reply actions
Christ and another fumble, let’s go Saints!!
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 9:21 PM EST reply actions
An absurd amount of fumbles now.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jan 24, 2010 9:22 PM EST up reply actions
How the hell do you turn the ball over that many times in the playoffs and manage to make it to overtime? One thing is for sure, the Vikes can’t hold on to the ball and the Saints can’t capitalize on mistakes, neither has a snowball’s chance at beating the Colts.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:03 PM EST reply actions
Screw the damn Saints.
That PI call was bogus.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 10:20 PM EST reply actions
Personally I think all flagged plays should be reviewed by the booth to keep the bogus calls under control as they happen way too frequently, that being said the Vikes had some bogus calls go their way too.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Or officials should have the awareness to call a ticky-tack foul in overtime of a championship game.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
Horrible ending to a great game.
The NFL’s overtime is bogus as hell.
Vikings never got the football in a game that decided who played in the Super Bowl.
Peterson also shoulders alot of blame for this one.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:27 PM EST up reply actions
The Favre hate is dumb.
Plenty of players have had problems in deciding to retire. Hell, Jordan did it three times. Why doesn’t everyone crap on Jordan?
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:30 PM EST up reply actions
Cause Favre is a crybaby.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:31 PM EST up reply actions
I’m pretty sure Jordan cried more than Favre.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
I can’t say that I like Jordan or Favre, but I hated both long before their “unretirement” issues.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
I hate Michael Jordan.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:33 PM EST up reply actions
I agree. Farve has done nothing to deserve the hate.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 10:43 PM EST up reply actions
Eh. Nothing is a little strong.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:46 PM EST up reply actions
Nothing.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 10:47 PM EST up reply actions
Nope.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:49 PM EST up reply actions
What has he done?
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 10:49 PM EST up reply actions
Well, I think the fact that he played for a team for 16 years, retired, then went and joined their rival (almost taking them to a Super Bowl) kind of justifies some of it.
that is like if lebron ended up playing his whole career here, winning a championship, then near the end of his career, going to the lakers.
Favre Honestly meant about as much to green bay as Lebron does to cleveland…especially since the cavs are nowhere near as popular as the packers are in green bay.
For the last few years he’s purposely held teams to the very last minute until his decision, even taken the time to go on terrible talk shows and stir controversy and hearsay. And when is with a team he’s rumored to spend much of training camp at home practicing on his own in Lousiana.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:51 PM EST up reply actions
This too.
I think Favre has this “I’ve been in the league for a long time, therefore I can do whatever I want” attitude. Example: arguing with Childress. Did you see Peyton doing that with Caldwell against the Jets?
Peyton specifically called him out on that one.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
He also feels he has the power to “become” the coach and audible the offense to his preferences in – game.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
I have seen Peyton Manning tell his own punt team to get the hell of the field when the coach (Dungy) sent them on.
No one makes a stink about it because it is Peyton.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
How many times has that happened though? In the heat of the game a few times, maybe? As much as Favre has changed the plays to his liking?
I have no idea.
But based on how successful he was this season, I don’t see the harm in letting the man operate.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t suppose so. But how far until you let him become the head coach?
“Ass slap 88 on two. Go!”
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
By the way, it looks like Peyton tells his coaches to screw off and changes the plays also.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 9:54 PM EST up reply actions
I was under the impression that Moore always just threw a couple of similar concepts from the same series/formation down to Peyton. Which play/concept actually ended up being run was completely up to Peyton.
There’s a difference between being handed the keys to the car at 16, and taking your dad’s car against his wishes while he is not home.
He’s also been to two of the last three NFC Championship games.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
His all around douche-iness, better than you attitude, and I’m going to come back just to try and screw over my old team antics don’t qualify for any hate?
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:55 PM EST up reply actions
I think the whole Viking thing is overly dramatic though. It literally was the best team he could get to the SB with who didn’t already have a good QB.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly.
Did we expect him to come to the Browns?
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:59 PM EST up reply actions
As a QB coach, yes. Remember? haha
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
Hmmm, I guess you have a point on that. Although I would be pissed if a QB of Favre’s caliber for the Browns retired and joined the Steelers (almost taking them to the SB).
Oh. Of, course
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
What about the Jets? The team that he was on last year?
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
He was traded wasn’t he?
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
He was traded to the Jets.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
Right so he didn’t have the choice to find that already completed team. I’m pretty sure I heard him once say he always wanted to be a Viking in the first place after the GB fiasco.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
Only because it was already completed minus a good QB.
Jeez.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
I just don’t think you should say you’ve always wanted to be a Viking in the first place, when it’s your (former) team’s rival.
By Viking in first place, I meant after GB but before Jets.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:26 PM EST up reply actions
or maybe he had ulterior motives. look at how he has manipulated the media…do you think it was an accident?? I choose to think otherwise because it is pretty far fetched to believe he would have no idea about all the media frenzy he has caused. I believe it was more attempts at media frenzy around him.
He was traded to the Jets because he told the Packers he was going to retire, then changed his mind.
My point was that he was to traded to the Jets and then retired again after that one season. The Jets still held the rights to him but released him because he was retired. He then flirted with the Vikings but told them he wanted to stay retired.
He unretired and joined the Vikings.
The Jets just lost a game today to make the Super Bowl.
I think the whole Viking thing is overly dramatic though. It literally was the best team he could get to the SB with who didn’t already have a good QB.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
Half of that is why I think Favre is a douche. The other way was the fact that he used his douche – iness to get to that good team.
So. Half and half.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:23 PM EST up reply actions
That’s pretty much the only problem I have with Favre. I never understood why people said he was finished. He had the Jets in the Playoffs last year and then they collapsed. We now know that he was injured at the end of the year. This year he takes the Vikings to the cusp of the Super Bowl.
Brett Favre was and still is a damn good QB. How he handled the Packers and Jets situations made me lose a lot of respect for him. Michael Jordan retiring didn’t change my opinion of him. His acceptance speech to the hall of fame did.
In my opinion it’s ok to struggle with the decision to retire, walk away from something that has defined you your entire life.
It’s not ok to do so without class and to the detriment to those who have supported you.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
at the same time…no one had the foresight to think the jets would make it to the superbowl. I don’t think any serious analyst thought they would make it this far. many did not even consider them playoff teams and I saw many 8-8, and 9-7 projections that had them out of the playoffs.
It is easy to have perfect hindsight. it is kind of how we can criticize the browns for not seeing that Courtney brown, who was healthy in college, would become injury prone.
He left to go to a better team. period. the jets were not the better team at the time, by far.
I agree about the hindsight thing which is why i mentioned the Jets being a playoff team before Brett’s injury. The year before he came there the Jets were in the playoffs and i wish i knew the extant of his injury last year but i think they would have been a playoff team last year as well. The Vikings lost in the 1st round to the Eagles.
I think the Jets were just as likely to end up a Super Bowl team as the Vikings.
The Vikings finished 10-6 the Jets 9-7 after losing 4 of their last 5 games.
In my opinion by losing Favre and having Sanchez the Jets took a major step back from last year even if they finished the season better. That said it’s better to have Sanchez on your team than Favre if you’re planning for the future.
Heck you would probably do better heading into the offseason with me as your QB than Favre. I’m cheaper and will probably just as likely to give you production the next season.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
lol…I do agree. I think I just misunderstood your point. I do not say the jets collapsed though because, as you admit, favre did get hurt…but it was his responsibility to let someone know…people blamed mangini when it was favre really. even if favre was injured though and was detrimental to the team, you really think he would have stopped??? favre caused their collapse, plain and simple IMO…
I do agree with you on many of the points though. I do not credit however, the acquisition of sanchez to have any correlation to their better record. he wasn’t that great. they just didn’t have favre down the stretch which killed them before.
I don’t credit Sanchez with anything either I was just commenting on Brett’s current love affair with retiring. Basically saying that you know Sanchez will be there with Favre who knows.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I’ve disliked him ever since he continuously beat the 49ers in the playoffs. Mostly because he was good and not playing for a team I liked. But the way he plays the media, attracts attention to himself, can’t do any wrong according to the media, whines about calls, and dramatizes things in general kinda bugs me too. “Hate” is a little strong.
By no means did the Vikings play well. Childress crapped his pants in the last minute of regulation and they fumbled the ball over the place.
But the biggest factor in the Vikings loss was losing a coin flip. How stupid is that?
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
I think the last second pick was a bigger factor than the coin flip. Or even the failed 4 and 1 stop.
Yep.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:34 PM EST up reply actions
I completely disagree. I think it was an obvious factor, but hardly the biggest.
Favre throws it at Rice’s feet and the Vikings win.
Maybe 30
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
55 yards.
Vikings had the ball on the NO 38.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:38 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah. I was thinking what the actual yard would’ve been.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:39 PM EST up reply actions
I feel bad for Brett. Both his last throws in his last NFC Championships have ended in INTs.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
but favre could have dumped it off to the back for about a ten yard gain. sure, it wouldn’t have been a first down, but a 45 yard field goal is much easier than 55.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
agreed. he did not want to take the checkdown option. I watched it again and I saw the fullback wide open on the sideline. about a second or two before favre threw it, the fullback was at the 30 yd line. if he catches it, they are inside the 30 easily.
If we assume at the 30 (and they would be inside most likely) that sets up about a 47 yarder for ryan longwell. longwell is one of the best kickers in the league.
he hit 93% of his field goals this year with a long of 52
His season long was 52 (an incomplete pass would set up about a 52 yarder
He is a veteran
He is 91% accurate from the 40 onward.
It might not be a guarantee, but it is a good bet that inside the 50, longwell would make it.
It if favre’s fault for forcing it into coverage.
Are we really going this far to blame Favre for that loss?
Favre deserves some blame for that loss no doubt.
But name me another QB, not named Peyton Manning, that would have taken the complete ass whopping behind an offensive line, overcame 5 turnovers and riven his team down the field to put them in scoring position like that?
As for checking down the the FB, you really think that a guy who has 10 catches for the season is a sure thing? C’Mon, you are reaching to lay blame at the feet of Favre for this loss. If he had a decent HC that had a clue how to control a team or a clock, the Vikings would have won that game.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 9:51 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with a lot of your points. Favre up until that point was pretty darn good.
Yes, childress was an idiot and a bad coach.
I am not saying he would have been guaranteed to catch it (the fullback) but he was standing there wide open. I would call that more of a sure thing than trying to force it into coverage.
You cannot blame the loss solely on one factor. both sides were valiant but in the end, someone had to lose.
obviously not all of the blame is on favre, but 3 of those turnovers were him, so he gets a big chunk of it.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 27, 2010 12:30 PM EST up reply actions
He only took that ass whooping because he held on to the ball so long and trying to make the “Brett Favre magic” happen, which has always been his problem.
And don’t act for a minute like he wasn’t playing that “ass whooping” for every 15-yard flag it was worth.
Favre knows how to change plays. He could have audibled to AD to control the clock, and he didn’t.
Players make plays.
Childress’s head blew up in the last few minutes of regulation. He would’ve fucked it up.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
Childress should be stripped of playcalling after that final minute.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
Hell yes.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:43 PM EST up reply actions
A 55 yarder is not a sure thing.
Granted the INT hurt, but a coin flip (something that has NOTHING to do with football) is the reason on why a team gets the ball first in sudden death.
The Vikes already overcame 5 turnovers. Couldn’t overcome 1 coin flip.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:40 PM EST up reply actions
maybe not 6, but I have seen college games go on for 5 hours before.
This sums up college football overtime better than I can.
College football’s overtime system, which gives each team a first and 10 at the opposing 25-yard line, with the first team to have a lead after a pair of possessions declared the winner, is a crock, a bastardization of real football, a victory for the everybody-gets-a-trophy culture that says fans can’t be satisfied with a deliciously, tantalizingly frustrating tie because they paid their money and they must be granted closure, given a winner and a loser, even if that means subverting the very integrity of the game.
also, the coin matters almost as much, if not more in college football as in the pros. the team that wins the toss is on D first so they have the advantage of knowing if they need to score a TD or a FG.
It’s still a bastardization of the game if OT is played to points, not time. Even if it is 6 points, which would be much better than the current OT.
The end of normal football is determined by a clock hitting zero, not by a score.
As I see it, the “everybody gets a trophy culture” would reward not-first-place finishers, not make sure one team came out on top. College football and the NFLplayoffs need to have winners and losers by virtue of the processes of determining a national champion.
I don’t like the sudden death either but I do not see the 6 points as a bastardization. It is just like the normal somewhat sudden death except a field goal does not automatically win it. it has more coaching strategy involved and the coin toss has minimal effect on it. the coin toss does have a significant effect now (even in college). i believe the 6 point overtime is the fairest way to decide the winner and can get the closest representation of who the best team is. the 6 points though will still be decided by clock, like the pros are now. it will in fact, be projected to cause a few more tie ballgames.
I do not like the “everybody has a trophy culture”. That is why the college system does not work. Not only that, but in a way, the bowl system is that…“well you didn’t win the national championship but you still won”. the playoff system is the best way to decide the best team. it creates definitive winners and losers instead of 30 or so winners, just b/c they won a bowl game.
the 6 points though will still be decided by clock
No, OT games played to 6 points will not be decided by the clock. Whoever scores 6 points first wins, unlike normal football, where the team with the most points after a predetermined period of time wins.
I do not like the BCS.
The worst method is the California Tie Breaker. One 5 yard play could win you the game. But I don’t think it’s practiced any more.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 1:03 AM EST up reply actions
Ball starts on the 50. Each team has 5 plays on offense. Rotate offense/defense every play. If ball is on your side of 50 at the end, you lose.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 1:17 AM EST up reply actions
Don’t tell me the NFL wouldn’t love having that many commercials.
I love college overtime. It does bastardize the game to some extent, but playing an additional period to time (like the regular games are always played), not score would be better than the NFL’s current overtime.
maybe…it is a decent thought…
I honestly hate college overtime though. and contrary to what many believe, a lot there is hinged on the coin toss.
contrary to what many believe, a lot there is hinged on the coin toss.
No their isn’t. Yes it may be beneficial to go second, but if it goes to a second OT, it switches.
Saying the coin toss in college is even in the same zip code of importance of pro is crazy.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 1:29 AM EST up reply actions
but just like a significant percentage of pro games end in one drive, a significant amount in college end in the first overtime, often with the team winning the coin toss winning.
yes, the chances are significantly more of winning, when winning the coin toss in the pros. the chances of winning are 57 percent. the chances are a little over 52 in college, but that is the chances of winning in the first overtime. that means that the team that gets the coin toss wins in the first overtime 52% of the time. the team that then goes second in the second overtime has a slightly better chance at winning (also slightly over 52%).
the point is, it id definitely not the same, but like I said it plays a significant role. I NEVER said it played as big of a role as in the pros but it is true that the team that calls it wins 52% of the time in the first overtime. the percentage of the team that starts on offense first, winning in multiple overtimes is less than 30%.
Not saying these are correct or not, but where are you getting these CFB numbers?
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
I do agree that the NFL overtime is a terrible system.
But, I just think that the defense know’s the rules. Stop any fretting and step up.
There’s were a few other big plays too, I just find it hard to say the coin toss was the biggest factor. Hell, Vikings might have turned it over AGAIN if they won the toss.
Defenses are on their heels in a next score wins.
To me it seems that defenses always seem to play nervous. It is expected. Overtime is a completely different animal than regulation.
Yes it is on the defense to get a stop, but I would be shocked if you ever see a DC dial up an all out blitz in OT because a broken tackle means ball game.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:02 PM EST up reply actions
The overtime rules also don’t account for a high-scoring game in which offenses dominate, which is how the regular rules (pass interference, protecting the QB pansy-ness) dictate the game should be played.
So if overtime happens and one offense could dominate (and score TDs), but another team can play decently (and get a FG) they win.
The overtime rules don’t account for discrepancies between strong offenses.
I am not in total hatred of it. It has its cons, but it does have its pros. It is not as if the team automatically scores on the first drive. oftentimes they do not. the saints did have momentum after that INT though. it is also up to the defense to stop the other team.
Hatred of the toss is in some ways just a way to blame something that is easy to blame
here are some stats.
about 3/4 of all overtime games, both teams have at least one possession. this means that the coin flip does not matter in those games.
the winner of the coin toss wins the game about 52 percent of the time. the loser wins about 44 percent.
the numbers have shown that in the last few years though, it has been more of a trend towards first-possession wins. that being said it is up to the defense and in many ways, it is better than how college does it where many games end up lasting 5 hours because of overtime.
I saw an interesting proposal that is better than college and better than the pros. It is first to 6. you can either go for 2 field goals or the touchdown. it adds more strategy and takes away all effects of the coin toss. the probability with the coin toss is thrown completely out the window. the only downside to this is that it would raise the probability of a tie a few percentage points, but if that means better football…so be it.
that is a compromise I can get behind. I personally am not a big fan of the coin toss, but there aren’t many proposed options better.
the winner of the coin toss wins the game about 52 percent of the time. the loser wins about 44 percent.
That was before the rule change in 1994 moving the ball back 5 yards to the 30. Since then, it’s been over 64%
"I don’t dance too much." --Mike Holmgren
by johnnyphoenix on Jan 24, 2010 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
I saw an interesting proposal that is better than college and better than the pros. It is first to 6. you can either go for 2 field goals or the touchdown. it adds more strategy and takes away all effects of the coin toss. the probability with the coin toss is thrown completely out the window. the only downside to this is that it would raise the probability of a tie a few percentage points, but if that means better football…so be it.
An interesting idea.
"I don’t dance too much." --Mike Holmgren
by johnnyphoenix on Jan 24, 2010 11:54 PM EST up reply actions
the biggest factor were mistakes down the stretch. favre again throwing a pick in a key situation in the NFC championship game. if he doesn’t throw that pick, it is more than likely the coin flip doesn’t even happen.
It was a 55 yarder.
Doable, but it wasn’t a sure thing by any means.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
like i said above, if he throws to the RB like the play was designed, its about a 7-10 yard gain, and a 45 yarder is considerably easier than a 55 yarder. you can’t assume they don’t gain any yards on that play if favre makes a good decision.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
I think the coin flip thing is overblown. everybody says “the vikings didn’t even get a chance.” yes they did. their defense had a chance to stop the saints. that was their chance.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
That isn’t football.
A football team is made up of an offense and a defense.
It is like baseball having extra innings that are settled after 3 outs.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 6:38 PM EST up reply actions
i don’t like the coinflip, don’t get me wrong, but like you said, a team is made up of an offense and a defense, and minnesota’s defense lost. I think the most fair thing to do would be to give each team a possession, sort of like college football, but start from a kickoff rather than the 25.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 27, 2010 12:32 PM EST up reply actions
The outcome of the game was absolutely positively 100% under Minnesota’s control. If their defense comes up with a stop or a turnover, they can win. They knew the rules going in, and could have won the game at any point before OT, or made the plays on defense in OT necessary to win the game. Furthermore, to shift the blame of the loss to someone/thing else (referees, coin flips, etc.) is not a winning attitude.
That said…
The problem is that just based on the way NFL overtime is structured, Minnesota’s defense AND offense have to play well for them to win—or their defense has to do something extrordinary (i.e. a pick-6).
All the Saints had to do (or any flip-winning team has to do) is march the ball down on offense and score a FG. This is without a doubt an advantage.
Minnesota needs to make more plays and/or much much bigger plays in order to win, which is not fair. A 3 and out or a stop before the other team reaches FG range is not a big play for a defense, and sure, that’s all Minnesota needed to get the ball back. But then they would have had to make plays of their own to get in to scoring range themselves. No matter what happened, they would have had to make more plays than the Saints to win.
Furthermore, the OT rules discriminate against certain types of team structures and philosophies. The Colts, for example, can build their team to be good at stopping the pass and good at holding other teams to FGs, even if they can’t outright stop the other team from scoring. They can do that because they know for every 1 FG you score, Peyton will score at least 1 TD, and that will win them the game. It is a strategy that wins in regular football games, but not in OT, because a simple FG will win the other team the game.
Without making excuses for Minnesota specifically, it is clear that the rules should be changed to give each team an equal chance of winning the game, without discriminating against football philosophies that hold true in normal games.
by rufio on Jan 27, 2010 7:39 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
NFl overtime rules are terrible. I knew the minute that ref said “tails” the Saints had won.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:26 PM EST up reply actions
“Knew” is probably a little to strong. “Had a strong feeling” might be a bit more accurate. A lot of things could have happened. (i.e. 4th and inches spot was questionable)
But I do agree that NFL overtime is bad.
Um. Drew Brees “knew” also. So you lose.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:44 PM EST up reply actions
I say first to 6 and you have to make the 2 pt. conversion. Much like a 3rd overtime in college.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
I think both teams should get a possession in overtime, instead of sudden death, sure the games will last longer, but it will make the coin flip less relevant as to who wins.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
wow…I just researched that Idea just now. it is the perfect compromise. you still toss the coin but have it first to 6. even though there is a coin flip, probability does not even statistically matter.
Yep. Teams are forced to make tougher decisions than “heads or tails,” and it allows both sides of the ball to play, as long as one team can force a field goal.
yes. it is brilliant. I love the Idea. I hate the ppl that say that the college system is so much better…honestly, no stats have been compiled for this, but from my observation the team that wins the toss in college wins more often too. that team chooses to be on D so they know what to go for when on offense (go for 3 or 6).
Go Saints whoo!
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:25 PM EST reply actions
GOODBYE BRETT!!!!!
I am torn now, though. I really like Peyton, but at the same time it’d be nice to see the team who has never won a Super Bowl (like the Browns…) win one.
Same for me. I love Peyton but I also love Drew and the fact that the Saints fans are much like us.
Colts fans are front runners.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:34 PM EST up reply actions
This girl who is from NO but has never really watched the NFL is now a huge Saints fan. It goes both ways.
True but I think Colts more so. They’ve been better for longer.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
that is how I feel. I will probably root for the saints b/c of their fanbase, plus I want to see brees win a SB. either way, it will be an epic game.
I read somewhere that if the saints won today, the vegas odds last i heard were even if they faced the colts. the odds have never been even and the last time they were under 3, was in ’82 when you had an epic game btwn the 49ers and the bengals. that was an epic game and this one will be.
It amazes me how many superbowls were bad games and boring to watch (mostly blowouts)
espn said today the odds are the colts by 3, but that will probably go up.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
I hope that goes the other way around, the saints deserve a SB win as much as we do.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:41 PM EST up reply actions
I agree with this. And I respect Peyton more than any other player.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
Saints don’t deserve anything. They have been a garbage franchise that was rumored to move for years and years until Brees and Katrina turned the franchise around.
Vikings fans are closer to Browns fans than the Saints.
Plus, I never root for teams that I think backed in. The Saints backed into the Super Bowl. I have never seen a weaker PI called than that one against Leber.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:46 PM EST up reply actions
They have been a garbage franchise that was rumored to move for years and years
a) We moved at one point.
b) We’ve been a garbage franchise for quite some time.
I thought this too.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
They have been rumored to move for different reasons than the Browns.
New Orleans, up until Katrina, struggled to support the Saints. After Katrina, the NFL thought about moving the Saints to San Antonio on a permanent basis.
The Saints and the Browns possible moves had nothing in common.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 10:56 PM EST up reply actions
So you hate the Saints because a natural disaster, which destroyed the whole city of New Orleans, almost made the city financially incapable of hold an NFL franchise.
Nice.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Ummm… Bernie never said that, did he?
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 11:04 PM EST up reply actions
He’s basing his hate on the fact that the NFL was rumored to move a franchise due to financial problems which stemmed from a natural disaster.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:05 PM EST up reply actions
So, yes. He did.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:06 PM EST up reply actions
The Saints were rumored to be moving for years before Katrina.
I didn’t say anything close to that.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:08 PM EST up reply actions
New Orleans, up until Katrina, struggled to support the Saints.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 11:10 PM EST up reply actions
Is that what I said?
Not even close. What I said is that a franchise that has never gotten their collective sh*t together in over 40 years.
In the 42 previous seasons the Saints had 7 postseason games. Incompetence shouldn’t be celebrated. The Saints were a garbage franchise.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
So, why didn’t you say that the first time instead of just saying that they were going to be moved after a natural disaster? That was what you said
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
If that is what you took away from my comment, then I am sorry.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
Apology accepted. I’m sorry I kind of put words in your mouth.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
That’s a little much honestly.
And I kind of thought Leber gave him a push with some god acting.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
This is true. How pissed would we be had that call kept the Browns from a Super Bowl?
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jan 24, 2010 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
Who cares about the Saints. I want the Non SB winners’ list to stay at a high number, till we win one.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 10:51 PM EST up reply actions
We’re one of the few to be on the “never won one or hosted one” list.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 10:52 PM EST up reply actions
Half of the league has never won a Super Bowl. I bet you’re thinking o the never been to list, which is only a few teams.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
Yes the “Never been to or hosted one”
Excuse me.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:03 PM EST up reply actions
The one against Poteat in the Lions game was way worse imo, the QB was ut of the pocket which meant Poteat was aloud to push the receiver out of bounds so he couldn’t legally be the first person to touch the ball.
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:58 PM EST up reply actions
I’m sure there were worse calls in that MNF game where the Packers and Ravens amassed 2000 penalty yards.
…200?
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
Vikings fans are closer to Browns fans than the Saints.
You have a good point here. We share a similar level of hardcore support despite how good our team is.
Even though before Favre, Minnesota couldn’t sell out one playoff game.
So, yep. Almost the same.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:07 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, wasn’t there something about the Eagles game last year? How they weren’t selling like any tickets?
The economy was complete garbage this time last year though.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
But every other franchise really didn’t have trouble selling out games.
Minnesota has always had a selling out problem.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:13 PM EST up reply actions
The Vikings haven’t had a home game blacked out since ’97.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
No blackout problems but selling out problems.
We haven’t had a blackout in a while either correct?
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:17 PM EST up reply actions
I think the Browns had a blackout earlier this season.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:57 PM EST up reply actions
Nope.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:58 PM EST up reply actions
I think a tv station bought enough tickets to avoid the blackout.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
Yep. Which is still considered not a blackout.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 12:06 AM EST up reply actions
I’ve thought they’ve been kind of suckish personally.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:18 PM EST up reply actions
Yes, last season they needed a last minute extension to sell out the game.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 24, 2010 11:12 PM EST up reply actions
They were in the “L.A.” hunt.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:09 PM EST up reply actions
fanbase wise, I would say we are most like the bills. browns fans=bills fans.
If I had to say the top 5 fanbases in the NFL, the vikes would not be on there. they might not be in the top 15.
My top 5 would be
1. Browns
2. Steelers (though I hate to say it)
3. Bills
4. Raiders
5. Packers
(Jets get honorable mention)
All of these teams have devoted fan bases. the bills and raiders actually cause a true home field advantage big time b/c of how rowdy the fans are. cleveland used to have that, but it has died a little. as for what the browns have gone through as a franchise I would compare them to the bills. both have been close but no cigar.
Wide Right=The fumble/RR88
The Music City Miracle=The Drive
No Goal=The Shot
I see a lot of similarities.
Raider fans don’t get to watch their team in he Bay Area. Blacked out every week.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:34 AM EST up reply actions
I guess I forgot about that…thanks for pointing that out to me. they still do have passionate fans, but I would say that the jets get into the 5th spot then…
I don’t know if it is every week though that they are blacked out…they definitely are not worse than jacksonville at blackouts.
I’m from San Jose. The only Raider games that are shown (about 75% of the time) are away games.
Raider fans used to buy the Sunday Ticket thinking they could watch the home games, but they were wrong.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 1:09 AM EST up reply actions
A good chunk of their fan base are people who just like the colors and logo.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:38 AM EST up reply actions
I would not say at all that they backed into this game. Criticizing the calls is not only in many cases being a sore loser, but finding an excuse. blaming the coin toss and bad calls just doesn’t work. there were bad calls against the saints too. it came down to brett favre and his unclutch performance at the end of the game.
I have never seen a weaker PI called than that one against Leber.
Yes you have. It would have been a lot weaker if Leber had at least thought about looking for the ball. It was enough of a touch pass that if he never touches the TE, he has a shot at it. And you have to know that if you make contact without looking for the ball you are at risk of being flagged.
Almost 100% of the time. But Thomas did put a good amount of acting into also.
Which is why I think the call was fine.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 12:08 AM EST up reply actions
Didn’t he dive for an uncatchable ball? What acting?
Leber did touch him during the dive, but I thought it was a poor call.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:11 AM EST up reply actions
I think the idea was that if the PI didn’t happen, the ball was catchable. And he didn’t dive. He either tripped or felt a push and acted.
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 12:12 AM EST up reply actions
He dove, but he was <5 yards from the potential catch point, meaning it could very well have been catchable if he wasn’t tripped up earlier in the route.
He did a good job of selling the call, but you are going to get that a large % of the time if the defender doesn’t look for the ball.
I can never lose with Rufio on my side. Hah!
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 12:15 AM EST up reply actions
I went back and watched it.Thomas tripped over his own feet. No PI.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:26 AM EST up reply actions
He was running backwards
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:26 AM EST up reply actions
PHANTOM!!!
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 1:12 AM EST up reply actions
It was a poor throw too.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 25, 2010 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
I said it was the worst PI for two reasons:
1. From the replay that I have seen, it doesn’t even look like Leber touched Thomas. To me it looked like Thomas was adjusting to the pass and got tangled up on his own feet. Maybe there is a better replay, but this is the one that I have seen. (Fast forward to 6:29 in)
2. The PI ended the game. It gave the Saints the ball at the MN 29. The Saints kicked the FG from the 22 yard line. This was for a ticket to the Super Bowl and a PI call got a team into FG range. That shouldn’t happen.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 1:42 AM EST up reply actions
I really thought the contact occurred before where they cut in on the slo-mo replay. I could be wrong, but I really thought I saw some contact, as miniscule as it might have been.
I don’t understand why people get upset about calls at ends of games. If LeBron goes to the hoop and gets hammered with 1 second left in the 4th, it’s still a foul. If Leber pushes Thomas over (which clearly did NOT happen, just giving a hypothetical), it’s DPI. It didn’t “give the game” to the Saints, the rules were just being enforced, just like every other second of the game. I firmly believe Leber had control over the call; if he turns his head around to at least try to look for the ball, he doesn’t get flagged.
Obviously if it didn’t happen it shouldn’t be called, but it is just as important a call as any other in that game, which could have been different if any other call or non-call went the other way. If the refs call holding on one of the Saints’ scoring plays earlier in the game and they have to kick a FG instead of scoring a TD, the Vikes win.
this is exactly how i feel. penalties at the end of a game don’t mean any more than penalties in the first quarter. maybe it was a questionable call, but its one that is going to be made more often than not.
Since you brought up basketball, i absolutely HATE how the rules change for the last two minutes of the game.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Minimal contact penalty should not be called in either circumstance you are right, but especially not if a field goal wins the game. The current overtime rules are set-up such that it is such a distinct disadvantage for the team that starts on defense, that the refs do need to be more reluctant to throw a penalty flag unless absolutely certain.
I can see your thinking with that.
My contention is that the final minutes of a game should be called differently, because it is different. The NFL knows that, that is why they change the replay rules in OT and in the final two minutes. It is different than regulation. The officials reviewed three plays on the final drive alone. They don’t do that on a drive in the 3rd quarter.
PI rules are almost always ignored (Detroit) in jump balls, holding is called differently on the edge of the LOS than it is in the trenches. There are many examples.
IMO penalties should only be called at the end of a game when it is wildly obvious when a penalty has occurred. If Thomas was pushed over like you said, then for sure a penalty should be called.
I am by no means saying that the Vikings would have won if the PI wasn’t called, turnovers and stupid coaching took care of the rest, but the Saints should have earned their way down the field to earn a trip to the Super Bowl.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jan 25, 2010 6:51 PM EST up reply actions
this is going to sound mooncamping-esque but here we go:
they do those things differently at the end of games because of the perception that the end is somehow different, even though it isn’t. The replay system in the nfl is terrible, it should operate more like college football where the booth can review a play at any time.
I don’t think penalties should ever be ignored in any situation. Even though they are ignored on jump balls or in the trenches, i think those penalties should be called. we have rules for a reason in sports, and they should be followed. I guess what i’m saying is i’d like the human element taken out of calling penalties as much as possible. a person shouldn’t decide when a penalty matters and when it doesn’t.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 27, 2010 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
The replay system in the nfl is terrible, it should operate more like college football where the booth can review a play at any time.
Yes. I advocate this for Basketball as well. It shouldn’t take 5 minutes to see if Delonte West’s foot was on the 3pt line. Have one guy or a team of guys looking at every play.
Overtime of a game is different. Only in overtime, does any sort of points immediately end the game. There is no other point in the football game where this is true.
I know that calls will be made differently at the ends of games, but will agree to disagree about whether they should/not be.
The Saints should have earned their way to the Super Bowl by having to hold Minnesota on defense, playing to time just like how normal football is played.
Leber didn’t earn a trip to the Super Bowl, he should have and could have looked for the ball. He doesn’t deserve to have it handed to his team any more than the Saints do. But the call wasn’t under the Saints’ control, it was under Leber’s.
If I hear “Who Dat” one more f’ing time……………
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 10:31 PM EST reply actions
I hope you changed the channel than
The sporting gods hate Cleveland, they give us false hopes, then yank it out from under us like a tablecloth.
by North Coast Flea on Jan 24, 2010 10:50 PM EST up reply actions
As soon as Payton said it I was gone.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
i can’t believe they copied the bengals…
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 25, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Think the Saints had it first.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
didn’t the bengals have “who dey” a couple years ago? did the saints have it before then?
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jan 27, 2010 12:38 PM EST up reply actions
there’s a long history and Wikipedia, and I had read another link somewhere else. It seems more complicated than it should be, and it’s an annoying chant so i kind of stopped bothering to figure it out.
From what I’ve found Bengals did it in 1981 and it became popular among Saints fans in 1983. The problem is that it had been around in NOLA for awhile, and many Saints fans claim to have been saying but argue that it just wasn’t popular among most of the fans.
Beats me.
Who Dat Wiki
Who Dey Wiki
NYtimes
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
NFL claims trademark infringement
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
Has anyone enjoyed playoffs this season even more just because the Steelers haven’t been in it?
/raises hand
Yeah, I know this year’s Superbowl will not be nearly as excited due to the fact that I won’t have as much invested in the game. (Hating the Steelers.)
but in some ways I will be more excited and will want to watch the game more and truly pay attention. this figures, oddswise to be an epic game.
I’m excited to see if the Saints can stop Peyton and to see these two offenses go head to head. I joked to a buddy tonight that I wish that this year the playoffs became a round robin at the conference championships. I’d rather see that than the pro bowl.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
yeah…that would be interesting. all these teams though would be great and interesting matchups.
Jets vs saints…great game. 2 somewhat tortured fanbases (though not as tortured as the browns)
Jets vs. Vikes-Favre against his team from last year…a lot of hatred.
Saints vs Colts-Just the potential for a ridiculous game
Colts vs. Vikes- Worst combo but still good. manning vs. favre. “I have four words for you: Minnesotans, Hoosiers, South Beach”.
From an entertaining outside the game…jets vs vikes would be the most interesting matchup. think about minnesotans confronting jerse shore clones on south beach…that is just mind boggling…
plus with the vikes you always have the possibility that larry platt shows up…that would be an interesting halftime show…he does a duet with favre and favre gives him an ass slap…
btw, best quote ever
you don’t want to cup it. You want to smack it.
You know the Colts have only been to 4 SBs?
You know all those SBs were in Miami?
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 24, 2010 11:24 PM EST reply actions
Horrible picture of Rice, by the way.
If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.
by Brownie's Year on Jan 24, 2010 11:47 PM EST reply actions
In case anyone is interested the opening line in Vegas is Colts -4.
Ya know, if you are into those kind of things.
this line will get much closer to even.
Vegas Odds first of all, were predicting not as close of a game as we just saw with the saints. they were predicting a fairly close game, but it was closer than expected points wise…plus the overtime makes it truly a closer game.
the odds before today were for this possible matchup, even. yes, the line was a pick ’em.
the line I feel will get much closer to that as people come down to earth and realize the saints are better than a -4.
This is just an opening line. It could easily get much closer and it likely will. I am not really into betting but it can show at times, how close people think a game will be (if the line is really low). I feel this will be an epic superbowl that will rival the Giants Pats (but not beat it…that was a ridiculous game)
the odds before today were for this possible matchup, even. yes, the line was a pick ’em.
you get that from Bill Simmons? Because it’s wrong. Last week, various online books offered prospective Super Bowl lines, and the Colts were -3 (even) vs the Saints (+120).
I am not really into betting…
Then you probably shouldn’t lecture on it.
You are reading my signature.
Or praise him because the two week break was their secret weapon to staying fresh.
Ohh!
If I hear "There's always next year" one more time...
by SpecialBrownie on Jan 25, 2010 8:43 AM EST up reply actions
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