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Reboot! DBN Draft Board Try 2

Star_20trek2_medium

Captain Picard disproves of poor instructions.

Star-divide

Due to confusion, we are hitting Ctrl+Alt+Delete on the 2010 DBN Big Board. 

We are starting over using an awesome new script into which Chris poured his blood sweat and tears, and I will try to explain the concept of what we are trying to do in a more clear way.  And best of all, thanks to Chris' work, all votes will be collected, tallied, and factored in to the board.  It just didn't feel right to start things off by counting less than 1/8th of the votes.

 

 

If you don't want to read the rest of this, you can skip to the "Our Draft Board" section below.

 

 

Terminology

Draft Board or Big Board

In real teams' war rooms, they probably have a physical board.  Through countless hours of discussion, debate, film study, and philosophizing, teams will rank the players in some sort of order.  They might simply chart the players from best to worst.  They might use some sort of "tiered" system.  They might rank all players at all positions.  They might rank their needs.  They might have several different plans for several different scenarios. (e.g. if Eric Berry is gone at our pick, trade down and wait on a Safety.  If he is there, pick him and get other positions later.)

The bottom line is that somehow, someway, teams develop a plan for the draft beforehand so that they don't make multimillion dollar decisions that impact their entire franchise in the pressure-packed environment of the draft.  Plan what you can now, make small adjustments and react later.  The Big Board is a team's plan.

Need

This is a mostly self explanatory term.  "Needs" are positions where teams need to draft new players because the players they already have just don't cut it.  Some of the Browns' (mostly agreed upon) needs are CB and S, for example.

Every team has needs, but the questions are:

1. What, exactly, are the Browns' needs?

2. How badly do we need new players at each of those positions?

3. How much of a boost should players get on the draft board because they play a position where we have a need?  For example, if Eric Berry and Taylor Mays are gone when the Browns pick at 7, should they pick Nate Allen because he is the best Safety left?  Should they turn to another need? Trade back? Take the best player available?

Value

Different people have different views on the value at different positions. For me, value comes down to two things:

1. How big of an impact can a player at a given position have on the game? Bernie19Kosar has some great thoughts on drafting QBs (h/t). A lot of people think that Quarterbacks have a big impact on the game.  Some might think players at the Center or Guard positions don't have a very big impact on the game.

2. How rare are good players at a given position?  Great quarterbacks, for instance, are extremely rare.  A lot of teams seem to be looking for great LTs and NTs too.  Will good players at this position come around twice every draft?  Once a year?  Once every couple of years?  Is it worth taking a flier on a player at this position in the first round, or can we wait until later in the draft for a solid player?

Character

Another buzz word this time of year.  To me, character can play a big part in deciding whether a player reaches his potential or not.  Will he be in and out of jail?  Will he be distracted by fame, fortune, etc?  Will he be routinely suspended from the NFL? Is he a hard worker who will give effort in practice and the film rooms to improve, or will he take his huge signing bonus and be content?  Does he really care about football?

Character may or may not matter to you with regard to the draft.  Whether or not it matters and exactly how much it matters should be reflected in your rankings.

 

 

Our Draft Board

Our draft board will be a ranking of the players that are draft eligible, from best to worst.  It should also take need, value, and character into account--if you think these things should be taken into account at all.  If you always want the best player available, just rank them from best to worst.

Instructions

Rank the top five available players. Take talent, value, need, and character into account if you think the Browns should take these things in to account when drafting.

Players will receive 5 points for every first place vote, 4 for every second place, and so on.  They will receive 0 points if they are unranked.  Total points from all ballots will be added, and the 5 players with the most votes will be taken out of the pool of available players and put up on the big board.

This is not a mock draft. 

Don't predict what will happen

Don't think about other teams

Don't worry about who is available. (I will take players out of the vote-able pool once we put them on the board)

Just rank your guys in the order you would like to see them drafted by the Browns.

For instance, I think the top five players purely in terms of talent are:

1. Ndamukong Suh, DT

2. Eric Berry, S

3. Gerald McCoy, DT

4. Sam Bradford, QB

5. Anthony Davis, OT

6. Russell Okung, OT

Because of need, value, and character, my first ballot will look like this:

1. Suh

2. Berry

3. Bradford

4. Earl Thomas

5. Rolando McClain

 

Please vote only once. 

VOTING HAS ENDED. PLEASE VOTE IN THE NEWEST POLL

 

Using the Scouts Inc. rankings (yes, I am aware of how much you hate Todd McShay) I will compile a pool of 25 draft eligible players.  We will take a poll and rank players five at a time. New polls will happen every two days or so until the draft.

If there are players you think I should include in the draft-eligible pool--especially if they aren't coming up in McShay's rankings, let me know and I will put them in for the next poll.

Comment 413 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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Thanks for doing this again, Rufio. And thanks to Chris for writing the script.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 7:14 AM EDT reply actions  

Picard>Kirk

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 7:57 AM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Stop.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 8:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wow. Lighten up.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

Just kidding around :)

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

Haha good because I was bout to lay the smackdown on you!

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

You mean Battlestar Galactica > Star Trek? I’d tend to agree.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

+1

A Cleveland Browns game was aired in France, the French surrendered to Joe Thomas just to be on the safe side...

by Mr Orange on Mar 29, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Great sig.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Thomas > Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Best song ever. I so forgot about it!

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 10:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Trekies > no one

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

recced

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

I completely agree.

There are FOUR lights.

by Simmsinns on Mar 29, 2010 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Man, no wonder he keeps his head shaved.

by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Mar 29, 2010 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions  

There’s my cue to ignore this thread.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

It’s that easy to get rid of you? Noted for future reference.

by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Mar 29, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh and remember, NEVER WEAR RED AROUND KIRK.

YOU WILL DIE.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m disappointed in you SB.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Those are the only two lines of Star trek I know. Picard>Kirk and to never wear red.

My father was the Trekie buff. I’d just watch a few snippets with him.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah right. I know you have a Leonard Nimoy fathead in your room.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

who doesn’t?

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not me. I have Chubaka.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have a Klingon forehead though.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

chewbacca?

I would rather have Admiral Ackbar.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn internet. Fooled me on the spelling. lol

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

Its okay…the internet is just a trap

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

By far the best line in Star Wars.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah. Ole Miss (the school) has a campaign to have Admiral Ackbar as their mascot…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d vote Sandra Bullock.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s no mascot…..it’s a space station!

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s not the mascot they’re looking for

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Its not a mascot…IT’S A TRAP!!!

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

how old are you that you didn’t just know how to spell chewbacca without looking it up?

by Dawg Nuts on Mar 29, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m 29 and don’t know how to spell it. Oh well.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

i t.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

?

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Play on words.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still don’t get it.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ed McMahon… Johnnie Carson show… Bueller…

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

lol I get that, but not the “i t”

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I’m 29 and don’t know how to spell it. Oh well.

You said this earlier.

Golan took it in the literal sense that you could not spell the word IT.

So he showed you how.

I-T.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is the second time in as many days that an easy to understand post of mine has required an explanation. Am I typing in Mandarin?

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I got it.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I got it too, it was funny

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Color me red. haha

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uhura never died.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

I never watched the original Star Treks in-depth, I just know of them and the general aspects about the characters. Are you referring to the infamous “the redshirts get killed” theme? Did that originate from Star Trek?

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yep.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 11:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

That and never be a green-skinned alien babe that sleeps with Kirk.

YOU WILL DIE.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

By the way, not to try to influence the vote too much, but anyone that’s less than psyched about Delhomme and Wallace at QB might want to prioritize a QB that can be expected to step in within a year.

/cough Bradford /cough

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 8:37 AM EDT reply actions  

What happened to Derrick Morgan?

Essentially, my board was the same as last time:

1) Sam Bradford

2) Eric Berry

3) Joe Haden

4) Kyle Wilson

5) Ndamukong Suh

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 9:00 AM EDT reply actions  

Bradford
Haden
Suh
Berry
Okung

Columbus til I die, Columbus til I die. I know I am, I swear I am, Columbus til I die!

"Turner, at midcourt...inside it, at the buzzer, GOT IT!!!!"

by Andrew Tolliver on Mar 29, 2010 9:06 AM EDT reply actions  

You are one of the theoretical Haden over Suh and Berry crowd? Care to expound?

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

the Suh disrespect is astounding.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

yeah, Suh should definitely be #1 or #2 on our big board. Srsly.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 29, 2010 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really. The guy is an undeniable monster.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Suh is about as “clean” as a prospect, at a premium position, as you will find now a days.

What is the worst thing about him? That he doesn’t weigh more?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

and whether that’s a bad thing or not really depends on what position you want him to play.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Knee injury history.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

Also its exceedingly rare that a DT goes in the top 3 picks. DT isn’t as valuable a position as edge pass rushers and OT and QB.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think a pass rushing DT is even more valuable.

IMO, Kevin Williams is the best D-Lineman in the NFL.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

I disagree. Also disagree with Williams being the best DL in the league.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

I should clarify. I think a pass rushing DT is more valuable than an edge pass rusher. Coin flip on the OT. Edge to the QB. Reason being, if a pass rusher is collapsing the middle every down, a QB will be no good. Even if he isn’t getting the sacks, pass rush in a QB’s face is 10x more disruptive than an edge rusher.

Who ya got as the D-Lineman?

The reason I named Williams is because I think he is a plus pass rusher and a plus run defender. Yes he is helped out with Pat Williams, but I think Kevin is fully rounded.

I would listen to an argument on Mario Williams and possibly Jared Allen. Haynesworth is consistent from down to down let alone year to year. Same for Julius Peppers. I don’t consider DeMarcus Ware a DLineman.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 1:35 AM EDT up reply actions  

Also, Haden at #2? You aren’t the only one Andrew. I’ve seen it a few other times on here. I don’t get it. He is a nice CB, but if you would seriously consider him as the 2nd best player in this draft, I just cannot understand.

Sure he gets a little bump if you think CB is a gaping hole on the team (though I’d argue that there are more obvious, bigger, and deeper holes to fill), but #2?!

I draft Haden at 7, IF my top 6 are all taken AND we can’t trade down. Even then, I’d probably consider 4 or 5 guys equal to Haden’s value.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes…the problem is still people rating guys purely on browns needs and considering too much what is available. i didn’t put haden in my top 5 and Okung made it. We don’t desperately need Okung but he is EASILY one of the top 5 players in the draft.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Some people like to rate based heavily on need. That’s their prerogative. If the rest of us are not rating as much based on need, it won’t really matter.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

maybe it isn’t a problem. I understand why they do it. I do take need into consideration but I want to envision what Holmgren and heckert think are the top 5 players in the draft and if they were building a team from scratch, the first 5 guys they would take.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t have Haden in my top 5. I think we can find as good a corner in the 2nd round. I think Haden is more Florida Hype than actual talent.

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 30, 2010 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

The top 5 in total points right now are pretty clearly separated from the pack, and they aren’t ridiculous IMO.

If enough people think BPA is the way to go, and they agree on the BPA, that will show in the results. Same with need. I tend to think that BPA would be the best option right now (like you), but that’s why this isn’t my board, it’s our board.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

exactly…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

BPA works with a few exceptions this year (left tackle, center, long snapper, return man, and mediocre linebacker all come to mind). If BPA is a left tackle that we don’t think work work on the right side, or is a bad value at right tackle, then we should skip down to the second best player available. We have lots of holes, but also some very solid career guys.

by rebuilding year on Mar 30, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would say draft on needs. Look what
Cincy and Baltimores did. They signed some solid receivers oh yea and Boldin. I think we should draft to our conference. Mason killed us last year. Now they have Boldin too?!! Bradford or Barry is a toss up to me. Aftervthat I think defense needs addressed.

by The naome40 on Mar 30, 2010 4:11 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

It was damn tough for me to decide between Suh and Haden. If we could get back to back picks I’d take them both. I just figure our need is greater in the secondary.

Columbus til I die, Columbus til I die. I know I am, I swear I am, Columbus til I die!

"Turner, at midcourt...inside it, at the buzzer, GOT IT!!!!"

by Andrew Tolliver on Mar 30, 2010 5:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

but that doesn’t explain Haden over Berry. Berry is the far better prospect, and plays in the secondary.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Chris, this program looks awesome. Nice work!

by Roger Dorn on Mar 29, 2010 9:07 AM EDT reply actions  

Agreed. I like the Browns colors.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bradford
Berry
Wilson
Bryant
Suh

Go Browns 09!!!

by deemac3248 on Mar 29, 2010 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

WTF? Kyle Wilson over Suh?

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Browns will trade to get the Redskins pick at Number 4 over all

If Suh, Gerald McCoy, Berry are available the Browns will trade the number 7 pick over all and the 71st and the 85th or 92nd picks to get the number 4 pick overall , that is if Sam Bradford is not available at number 4 that belongs to the Redskins. Washington will select Bradford if he is there (He wont be). Washington can trade down and still get Claussen.

I like one of the offensive tackles, but they wont select them, I still think they need defensive help.

by champion64 on Mar 29, 2010 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

In this scenario, Suh, Berry AND McCoy have to be available when the Redskins pick at 4?

That is quite a task my friend.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

I meant if any of the three are available not all three available. Most likey it will be Berry. The Browns would take any of the three who are available at the number 4 spot. I did not think all or even two would be available at that spot.

Lets say the Rams take Bradford, that means Washington can trade down to number 7 and still get Claussen and pick up one if not two third round picks. The Browns have 3 third round picks.

I saw they go after Berry if her is there. I again like the OT, but I dont know if they will use that pick for an OT when they need so much on the defensive side of the ball too.

by champion64 on Mar 29, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

I rule out a Washington trade down. Claussen might be there and they shouldn’t take the risk of trading it to us especially. With all the smokescreen going around who knows if we took Claussen and spoiled the Redskins plans instead?

by skipkirk on Mar 30, 2010 5:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Random question

but as a QB option is there anything wrong with Lefevour? I haven’t seen a whole lot of discussion on here about him.

by navycavsfan on Mar 29, 2010 9:46 AM EDT reply actions  

We did talk about him a lot before our discussions switched mainly to the first round pick. Plus there isn’t anything saying that Holmgren is interested in him right now.
I personally like the kid.

If you're at the table and you don't see a sucker..... you're it.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 29, 2010 10:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

To add on to what BY is saying, one of the minions (B19K) did some research and came to the conclusion that QBs outside of the first round have and impossibly small chance of becoming quality starters. So, anyone that wants a new starter should look at round one QBs.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

But Holmgren likes to take QBs in the later rounds. He said he thinks it give them time to develop and not be pressured to become the starter. I kinda think that if Tebow is there for our first third round pick we would grab him.

by The Brown Note on Mar 29, 2010 8:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right.

Always remember when people do mock drafts and the like- huge difference in what you think WILL happen and what you think SHOULD happen.

We may all think drafting a QB late is dumb, but we might as well evaluate guys like LeFevour, Tebow, McCoy, Pike, Clark, etc. because our President has basically said we are drafting one of these guys.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Out of this list, I want Colt.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 29, 2010 9:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

John Skelton. I have a feeling that that’s our guy.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 9:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like it.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

That’d rock if he was #10. Time to tape over my Quinn jersey!

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes.

I don’t know much about Skelton.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed. But, I think there is a good chance Colt goes way earlier than the others. I heard one of the ESPN guys say some are considering him late in the first round and second round for sure. I wouldn’t mind him early in the second, but it seems clear that Colt is separating himself from the rest of the pack as the #3 QB in this draft.

And since I see Claussen doing a Quinn-like drop, they might be drafted a lot closer than most of the mocks currently have them.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

If we traded back up into the late first to draft him would that make him fit into Bernie’s draft a QB in the first only policy? Bernie?

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 29, 2010 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sure.

I don’t want the 32nd pick be some sort of invisible barrier. I think it would be more of a moving barrier.

In a loaded draft like this one, many players that will be picked in the middle of the second round would be first rounders in other seasons. I am not going to think that McCoy will be a star at pick 32 but a bum at 37. The draft is a fluid study from year to year. The first round was just a natural barrier. You start getting around 10 picks into the second, I would think you are probably out of the comfort zone.

I personally think that McCoy is a top 15 player in this draft and the second best QB in the draft. I would be elated if we could get him in the second round.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

I too would be elated if we picked him in the second. I’m just worried with all the hype he’s starting to get as draft day approaches. I’m not sure what team picking towards the end of the first round would need a first round backup QB. I think they have too many other needs.

Do you think he’s worth our 38th then?

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 30, 2010 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Minnesota would be a sneaky pick.

Stash him for a year (or six) behind Favre.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

Damn. That’s a very real possibility.

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 30, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe we could give up a 3rd and 4th and move up a few spots. Although, that sounds awful Brady-esque.

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 30, 2010 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t see it. He doesn’t have the arm to go that high and just isn’t an improvement at all over Jackson or Sage.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

disagree on all of this.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

I keep hearing that Colt McCoy doesn’t have the strongest arm.

I think this is overrated at every turn.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree. Sure he’s no Derek Anderson, but he can make all the throws. anything above that is nice, but not essential.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

he’s no Derek Anderson

If we’re drafting him, let’s hope not.

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I laughed a little when i typed that

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’ve seen video of McCoy flicking a 45 yard pass.

I’ll take a very accurate, smart, high character QB with decent arm strength over someone like DA again.

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is somewhat overrated, but watch his deep (er) throws (there are hardly any). They all float and I am concerned that he doesn’t have the strenght to make all of the necessary throws.

His size is a small concern too. (no pun intended)

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have watched a lot of tape on McCoy.

From my amateur scouting view, I see a QB who doesn’t possess an arm cannon. This being said, I almost never see a throw he can’t make. He doesn’t have the same snap of a Clausen, but he isn’t throwing lollipops out there.

He throws the ball on the run better than anyone in the draft and he is very good deep accuracy. He throws the ball with great touch even deeper down field.

If McCoy was 2 inches taller and had a stronger arm, he would be battling Bradford for the number one pick.

As for the small size concern, he never had an injury issue until the NC game. He ran the ball and took some good licks. I think he is tough kid.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 31, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

The real thing to look for would be a throw that should have been zipped in to a tight spot between a receiver and the sideline and was too slow getting there.

Or difficult completed throws to the field side of the field.

Just because a guy has touch on all of his throws doesn’t mean he can’t throw it hard. Especially when he is completing 70+% of his passes.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

If McCoy Brees was 2 inches taller and had a stronger arm, he would be battling Bradford Vick for the number one pick.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 8:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Wishful thinking, likely, but intriguing…

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 8:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

If McCoy was 2 inches taller and had a stronger arm, he would be battling Bradford for the number one pick.

But he’s not.

From my amateur scouting view, I see a QB who doesn’t possess an arm cannon. This being said, I almost never see a throw he can’t make. He doesn’t have the same snap of a Clausen, but he isn’t throwing lollipops out there.

I guess we’ll have to agree to disagree on this.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

still want to say McCoy can’t make all the throws after that pro day?

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 9:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

F’’’ pro days.

If prodays mattered, Jamarcus Russell would be the best QB in the NFL. ALMOST EVERY QB prospect has a “good” pro day.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think you’ve won that point.

by Western Reserve on Apr 1, 2010 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

but a pro day doesn’t grant you more arm strength. he still had to throw deep outs, and he did it.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Apr 1, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

TRSS’s post also highlights the ridiculousness of looking at arm strength too closely.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 1, 2010 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would be elated if we could get him in the second round.

Agree.

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

McShay doesn’t have Clausen in the top 32 overall player rankings. Maybe Walterfootball should lecture him.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

movethesticks.com, written by a former scout, keeps saying that Clausen will fall out of the first round.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah…plus we all know all the work McShay did in the field as a scout…so this scout must be wrong…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 12:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

what? they agree with each other.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 12:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

true…I meant to say Kiper I think…then I started making a joke on the account of McShay, and now it looks stupid

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 3:13 AM EDT up reply actions  

if claussen falls to the 2nd, i think i’d still rather pick mccoy with our 2nd than claussen.

by Dawg Nuts on Mar 30, 2010 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

I do remember seeing that, and not believe it.

Yet, agreeing with it.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 30, 2010 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

McShay is clearly an irrational Notre Dame hater

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, give us a break. The door swings both ways around here on this, and I suspect you know it.

by Western Reserve on Mar 30, 2010 10:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

No thanks. I am tired of the overreactions. People are allowed to disagree, so to come up with these phony reasons for being biased is my objection.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

I hear you, just was pointing out that you can witness varying degrees of irrationality from not just one side but from both sides.

by Western Reserve on Mar 30, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes agreed. My comment was facetious though. The opponents are dead serious when they call Clausen doubters irrational.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Probably likes Ohio State too.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would say that a person who says Clausen is too short to be an NFL QB that is 6’2.5 is irrational.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ewww

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who would you suggest out of that list then?

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

That doesn’t mean I have to like it.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

1. Clausen
2. Berry
3. Graham
4. Suh
5. Wilson

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 29, 2010 11:34 AM EDT reply actions  

So if we take Berry over Clausen are you going to be really upset or will you be relatively pleased?

by Roger Dorn on Mar 29, 2010 11:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Probably be kinda pissed. I would probably actually rather have Graham over Berry now that I think about since getting pressure on the QB does more for a secondary than a good S ever could. But I would probably be upset since the the difference between the later round QB’s compared to Clausen is huge, and the difference between Berry and Earl Thomas or even Nate Allen isn’t as great

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 29, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

But I think either berry will be taken and clausen will be available or clausen will be taken and berry will be available.

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 29, 2010 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Way to be in lockstep with Walterfootball. Does he spoonfeed you your applesauce too? He could write an article that fullback was the best position with witch to use a high pick and you would be on here the next day claiming we should draft a fullback.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 29, 2010 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

fullback was the best position with witch to use a high pick

Well, a witch with a fullback does sound like an interesting pick. . . . Fullback jumps on his broom with the ball and goes right over the d-line. Also, if the NFL outlaws brooms, the FB could cast a spell on the defense allowing Jerome Harrison to rush for 300 yards/game.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Mar 29, 2010 6:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

hahaha

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 29, 2010 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

lol. I was thinking the same thing. He could just cast a shield charm in front of the running back or an impediment jinx and knock someone backwards…no unforgivable curses though, that would be a personal foul.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Supposedly, all wand related bans were written after the first game when there were over 600 fouls.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Quiddich Through the ages???

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is there any other book that J.K. Rowling originally wrote for charity before it was officially published for public market?

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

actually yeah…I believe fantastic beasts and where to find them was also like this.

I can’t find my copies of either though…I did buy the charity copies but I don’t mind a rebuy.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Let me clarify. Is there any other book that J.K. Rowing originally wrote about Quidditch for charity before it was officially published for public market?

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

nope…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who the hell do you think you are? You don’t have the right to address me with that hostility. For one, I’ve never even had an exchange with you for you to act like you know me. And two, aren’t you the idiot who keep talking about bringing in Troy Smith in every one of your posts on this board? I’ll turn the question around, are you Troy Smith’s butt-boy? STFD

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 30, 2010 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

It’s okay, nobody likes him.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 30, 2010 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

eh, I’m indifferent to him. He gets fixated on certain players but he’s never more than a minor annoyance, and usually he’s ok.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 5:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

You’re one to complain about people not having a right to address you with hostility. In a different thread you called me an irrational hater, which isn’t anything to be upset about, but then you said: “you’re reasoning is shit.” and launched into a diatribe about how I couldn’t read and had a small vocabulary.

so in summary, your comment is a prime example of the pot calling the kettle black.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I just call it hypocrisy.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’ve never even had a conversation with the man before, and I’ve just recently seen him post on the board. So its strange for him to call me out like we’ve debated before or something. You on the other hand came strong at me first, and I was just responding to your attacks and silly logic.

If Rufio, Dorn or you came at me this strong I wouldn’t be surprised

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 30, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s all for the spirit of debate. I am trying to avoid personal stuff and focusing on the arguments themselves.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

It hard when there is such a group-think and gang mentality that goes on with the board. So much instigation and ganging up. So it’s not hypocrisy because I don’t have a problem with people being hostile towards me. But If some brand new guy who I’ve never even seen calls me out and acts hostile, especially when its not even a debate, its a little uncalled for

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 30, 2010 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

there is definitely a bit of group-think, but i think you’re making it out to be worse than it is. there are plenty of differing opinions here.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

…as well as well-defined opinions. I think it’s safe to say that most of the regulars here do not make bold declarations without at least attempting to back them up with reason and are willing to admit when an opinion is just a gut-feeling. That is, it’s all debatable.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 30, 2010 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree to an extent about ganging up, but that is the territory when someone is in the minority opinion. I’ve seen group think accusations on LGT and here as well, and I tend to think that is just how the minority opinion likes to portray their opposition, but I can see why you would think that way.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 30, 2010 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

exactly. I rarely try to attack another. personal stuff just isn’t cool. it doesn’t win arguments anyways, it just makes you look like an ass when you use them.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

rec

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

You have 0 room to talk. He supported Clausen before that article. At least he doesn’t have a hard one for a certain former buckeye QB.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 7:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

at least jaws isn’t going around throwing out ad hominems irrationally like rocland.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

he has a hard one for a notre dame player, how is that any different?

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who? ROCLAND?

IF that is what they you are saying, you are very hipocritical.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 11:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

At least he doesn’t have a hard one for a certain former buckeye browns QB.

I think this is what he meant.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

by Villeslgr on Mar 31, 2010 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

he has a “hard one” for clausen. he defends Clausen with as much vigor as jaws talking about Smith.

how am I being “hipocritical?”

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Among the bugs I intend to fix before the next poll gets released…

-Preventing the “DE/OLB” position label from being truncated to “DE/”
-Having the list arranged in ABC order by first name.

If people see other bugs, let me know. As of this post, 173 people have cast votes.

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 11:35 AM EDT reply actions  

Thanks for doing this, btw. If you’re going to alphabetically arrange the list, maybe it would be better to do it by last name. Makes it easier from a name recognition standpoint.

by navycavsfan on Mar 29, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought about that, though in my initial design (and my attempt to make the form shorter for rufio), I only included a “name” box. I could still do the ABC order thing on last name by searching the name field for the first SPACE it encounters, but then data entry errors (i.e. forgetting to put a space) are subject to not being sorted correctly. I’ll see, since typically players are sorted by their last names…

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

SELECT Concat(SUBSTRING_INDEX(pname, ’ ’, -1), ’, ’, SUBSTRING_INDEX(pname, ’ ’, 1)) AS formatname, position, college FROM `player` WHERE sid = 2 ORDER BY formatname ASC

(reference to myself of query for when I get to the PHP file later)

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn’t mind doing another box for the last name if that is easier for you. I almost put some people’s last names as their schools.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Na, the code I wrote above should work, as long as you always do a name like this:

Eric Berry

…and not like this…

EricBerry
Eric-Berry
Eric.Berry

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Okay, I fixed the bugs listed in the first post I made in this tree. Names in the poll are sorted by last name.

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok, now you’re just showing off. ;-)

Fooootball has been beary beary good to me.

by doggrad87 on Mar 30, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

Indeed :-D

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 30, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

1. berry
2. haden
3. iupata
4. balogna
5. okung

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 11:50 AM EDT reply actions  

No Suh at all?

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nah. I’m all about taking O-line in the first every year. It’d be all O-line if it weren’t for the very real possibility that we could head into next season with Brandon McDonald as a starter.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 29, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

that possibility keeps me up at night. I can’t watch tackling like that for another 16 games.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have O-Line behind S, LB, WR, and QB on my list of needs. Plus, Suh is good enough to blow your needs list up.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 8:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

This was my thinking.

Suh and Berry are too good to pass up. Best players bar none in this draft. If Bradford is there I wouldn’t hate taking him.

After that, the only sure thing I see is Iupati. We need a sure thing. Suh, Berry and Iupati who I fully expect to be a Pro Bowler.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly, after those three I start thinking about all kinds of reaches.

Which is why trading down would be awesome if none of them are left.

I have Clausen, Thomas, Graham, Dan Williams, Bulaga, McClain, Iupati, and Haden all in that next group, and I’d love to be sitting at 11-12 to scoop up the best one of them left.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

My dream situation is that San Fran decides they have to have Player X and gives us their two first rounders.

I can dream right?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

they would literally surgically remove their own testicles before they made that trade… if they were smart. Plus I don’t see them doing such a bold move with a new GM who just got promoted a month before the draft.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

replace Clausen with Dez Bryant and I’m right there with you.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

there is no sure thing. Any player can bust. You’re awful high on Iupati. Granted i love the guy too but he is pretty raw in pass pro. And he is only a guard.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

He is a beast. Put on any tape of his and he just dominates. Look at the Boise State game tape from this season. Idaho ran for 150 yards behind him. In a game they lost by 40.

You can go back to ’07 against USC. He is a man amongst boys. He is so strong at the POA. His footwork is great and he moves like a man who is 75lbs lighter.

Everytime I watch him, I see Steve Hutchinson. I keep saying it, we will look back in 5 years and wonder why the 3 time Pro Bowl RG/RT was passed over for a CB. Would you trade our first rounder for a 23 YO Steve Hutchinson? Add in the fact that offensive lineman are almost always worth their draft pick, I see him as a no-brainer.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

If nothing else, this is a good sell job. Iupati is probably 6 on my (meaningless) board and my 4-10 is pretty mushy right now. He might be moving up.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 30, 2010 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

I should be his agent.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 1:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Its simple: Guards don’t effect the outcome of games nearly as much as CBs

He could be the greatest guard of all time and still not have all that much effect on the Browns record. Not as much as a LT, QB, pass rusher or CB. Thats why those positions make vastly more money. Granted, I still love iupati if we trade down, I’d hate to see him go to the steelers at #18

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Its simple: Guards don’t effect the outcome of games nearly as much as CBs

Guards don’t, but great guards do. Iupata has the stink of Steve Hutchinson all over him. If he’s not a game changer at guard inside of three years, I’ll eat my hat.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Operative words: game changer. The vikings need their pass rush and Brett Favre much more than they need steve Hutchinson.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wrong.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 9:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Browns have the best LT in the league. And a bad record.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 30, 2010 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but they also spent most of the year with Quinn under center. Not even Joe Thomas can overcome the South Bend Suckage.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

This argument has real potential. Enlighten us, gentlemen.

by Western Reserve on Mar 31, 2010 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

hahaha, I can’t wait for the rebuttal

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

joe thomas can overcome anything. including your insult.

by Dawg Nuts on Mar 31, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Have you been pancaked yet Golan?

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 31, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

seriously though, i agree. the best OL in history won’t win games with a historically awful QB, but they can damn sure win a ton of games with an average QB.

by Dawg Nuts on Mar 31, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

What an ignorant statement.

Look at the Seattle Seahawks.

2005 (with Hutchinson) Shaun Alexander had 1880 yards, 5.1 YPC and 27 TD’s and won the MVP.

2006 (without Hutchinson) Shaun Alexander had 896 yards, 3.6 YPC, 7 TD’s and couldn’t do anything on the ground.

Only change was Hutchinson.

But please, by all means keep up the thinking that a guard can have no effect in winning football games.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions  

don’t forget the career high in rushing yards chester taylor had in 2006.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 10:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

I should have mentioned that.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

You weren’t arguing for QBs or DE/OLBs. You were arguing for CBs.

Its simple: Guards don’t effect the outcome of games nearly as much as CBs

I’d take LT, QB, or pass rusher easily. But we already have JT, there probably won’t be a QB at the pick, and the pass rushers that are elite in this draft scare me (Morgan with transitioning, JPP with bustitude).

And it isn’t a straight positional battle, either. I bet Iupati is way better at his position than Haden in the NFL.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 12:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

This is the one reason I like Iupati. If we can’t get berry I’d be all for trading down to 13-15 and taking either Earl Thomas or Iupati, but not at #7. We’d have the two highest paid guards in the NFL on totally immovable contracts.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Apr 1, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Its simple: Guards don’t effect the outcome of games nearly as much as CBs

False. You can game plan around a CB. You can run the ball. You can throw away from a CB. Guards would be essential on every snap.

Thats why those positions make vastly more money.

Tell that to Steve Hutchinson, Eric Steinbech, Leonard Davis etc., etc., etc.

I still love iupati if we trade down, I’d hate to see him go to the steelers at #18

Again, if you think he is the BPA, then who gives a damn where everyone else thinks he should be drafted?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Again, if you think he is the BPA, then who gives a damn where everyone else thinks he should be drafted?

Honestly, I would probably rather “reach” for Graham at 7th than take Morgan or JPP at this point.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would be fine with Graham at 7.

Considering I had him at 5 on my Big Board, this shouldn’t be a surprise.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 31, 2010 1:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

hahaha…I dunno if you misspelled some of the names on purpose but the misspellings are funny. I don’t care that much about spelling mistakes, but who wouldn’t want balogna on their Offensive line…next we can get salami and terkey and we can have the Deli meat blocking scheme.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

we’ve already got porkchop

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

thats true…I forgot about him. man him and balogna…what a tandem if they both play guards…we can mack on a balogna and porkchop sandwich…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

(and forgot) wash it down with a nice cold boch.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 9:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

1. Suh
2. Berry
3. Iupati
4. B. Price
5. Graham (I have officially switch bandwagons after Morgan’s pro day. I still really like Morgan, just not at 7.)

Reason I didn’t select a QB is because I think we should clean the rest of the house before we bring in a QB. If I was forced to pick a QB from this draft class it would be down to Bradford or McCoy.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 12:04 PM EDT reply actions  

Looking at the results page thus far (not shown to you guys yet), it’s fascinating to see how a player with way more first-place votes than another play is just about tied with a player without any first-place votes since they have so many second-place votes. It clearly shows the feeling fans have toward either wanting to address a position in the first round or not wanting to address it until later rounds/next year.

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 2:08 PM EDT reply actions  

I am guessing it is Bradford and Suh for the top spot?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was guessing Berry and Bradford.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Bradford and Suh. That’s what I went for anyway. Followed by:

Berry
Thomas
Haden

by skipkirk on Mar 30, 2010 5:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Suh
Berry
Haden
Earl Thomas
Iupati

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 29, 2010 2:18 PM EDT reply actions  

I get a Glenn Dorsey feeling with McCoy

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 29, 2010 2:24 PM EDT reply actions  

For a second I was confused about Glenn/Ken Dorsey and Colt/Gerald McCoy. Interesting similar analogy.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 3:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Weeiird. I agree about G. McCoy, but it’s just a gut feeling.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bradford
Suh
Berry
Okung
McCoy

This was submitted before I read about Bradford’s pro day today. He is a no brainer for me now at this point.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 29, 2010 3:14 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m sad that he’s gone from decent chance of being available and not many wanting him to no chance of being available and a lot (or at least some) of DBN fan’s #1.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

From what it sounds like, he cemented the deal to go number one.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

What’d he do at the pro-day?

I still think we take Colt McCoy. I don’t see how the Rams don’t take Bradford.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn. Rams would be dumb not to take him in my opinion.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yup. And in the extremely unlikely event he gets past the Rams, he ain’t getting past the Redskins or Seahawks — at least not with us giving up a ton of value to get there. His stock is up.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Mar 29, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Actually, if he gets past St Louis, I wouldn’t be shocked by us trading with Detroit — they apparently want to trade down. But again, it would probably cost us next year’s first rounder and at least a 3rd from this year. Worth it? If he’s the next Peyton Manning, yes. But that is a huge “if”, and I’d be really nervous about such a move.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Mar 29, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d rather take a defensive player at #7 and roll the dice on a 2nd round QB, either McCoy or Tebow.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 29, 2010 6:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think there will be another Peyton Manning, he’s a different breed. There will be other great QBs obviously, but I don’t think anyone will ever bring his approach to the game. For some reason when I think of Manning I see him as growing up an adult in a child’s body, he just always seems so mature and composed.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

by Villeslgr on Mar 29, 2010 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Really? I see a robot with a laser/rocket arm.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

I see an awesome mustache….

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

AAAAHHHH!!! It’s an evil robot come to destroy our playoff hopes by not playing. RUN FOR YOUR LIVES.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

It has been rumored that we have a trade option with Detroit lined up.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 9:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yep. I’m afraid.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Of drafting Bradford?

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Of the havoc we’d reek. So many options!

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Could we be trading up to 2 so KC doesn’t grab Berry? That’s a possibility, right?

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 9:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

Suh>Berry

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

As far as BPA, sure. But as far as what the Browns should be looking at,

Berry > Suh

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

So wrong.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

If he thinks secondary’s our biggest need, then he’s right. It’s kind of an opinion thing.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s more than that. I don’t know how Suh would fit into our 3-4 scheme. And after the Corey Williams fiasco, I don’t want to be giving top 5 money to a guy that has the great potential to be a great misfit in our system.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 29, 2010 10:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

He’s a perfect fit for our DE. Huge with speed.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he’d be perfect, too. So strong at the POA. Clearly good at drawing/defeating double-teams. Can rush the passer a little without having to vacate his run responsibilities.

G. McCoy is the player more similar to Williams, IMO.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Absolutely right. Of the two only Suh really fits our scheme. He would be perfect as a 5tech.

McCoy is much more of a tampa 2 DT, hence the reason some people have tampa taking him even over suh.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

That’s also another eason I don’t trust either top DT in this draft. I remember reading about the schemes of each player played in at their respective schools. Suh’s was tie up blockers while McCoy’s had him penatrating more per scheme. Suh would be the better fit, sure. But I’m not sure better translates into ‘can play in’.

I don’t have anything against Suh, but I really don’t see him as a 3-4 guy.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 1:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Suh’s was tie up blockers

He did way more than that though. He threw the blockers off him and got to the QB as well. Joy to watch.

by skipkirk on Mar 30, 2010 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

But I’m not sure better translates into ‘can play in’.

can you elaborate on this? It seems to me he proved he can play in that type of system if he did it in college.

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

I suppose it’s hypocrosy to support Haden, Berry or Bradford over Suh seeing as how I’ve never seen any for myself, but I’m just not believing all they hype that Suh is producing.

But I reserve the right to say that I’ve never seen Suh for myself while having seen plenty of guys who were splitting double and triple teams (Glenn Dorsey or B.J. Raji anyone?).

Again, this is probably hypocracy, but it’s easier to believe the stuff that’s being reported on guys like Haden, Berry and Bradford than Suh.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Raji is going to be good for quite some time in this league.

I was 100% against him last draft also, so what do I know?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 30, 2010 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Granted, the juries still out on Raji. But I just havn’t heard anything about him any time I was listening to ESPN talk radio. Nadda, zilch. Other than the hold out of course…

I’ll admit that my stance isn’t one based on logic, no matter what points I’ve come up with. I just really don’t like Suh.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

Does ESPN talk radio ever venture outside of Manning, FAvre, Brady talk? I would be shocked if they had a discussion on D-lineman once in an entire season.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 31, 2010 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

i like colin cowherd.

by Dawg Nuts on Mar 31, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cowherd is so clueless that it is hilarious.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah. I used to get the thundering herd podcast…I had an order of podcasts the day I would listen to (and would sometimes skip some). I would listen to my least favorite first. the thundering herd was my most skipped and was always first so I decided not to subscribe anymore…now for me it is fantasy, mike and mike, and PTI, and ATH.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 11:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I got Mike Golic’s autograph at the ND-Nevada game this year. Just sayin.

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

thats pretty cool. he seems like a cool, laid back guy. plus he is a very good former player analyst. most of the talking heads were QBs but its cool for one of the intelligent analysts to be a hard nosed player (like stink…and I happen to love both’s analysis)

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Apr 1, 2010 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

plus golic is a browns fan.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Apr 1, 2010 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

Dorsey was very up and down over his career and from game to game, and from play to play. Dominant one play, lazy the next. Hurt often.

Dorsey is the “penetrating 3 technique” that G. McCoy is supposed to be, and he is playing in a scheme that is probably a bad fit (a 2-gapping 3-4)

Suh just threw people around. Teams were double and triple teaming him and he was still winning blocks. He’s ridiculous. He is very strong and should be able to do everything asked of him in a 3-4, and be versatile enough to rush the passer a little on passing downs.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Suh was absolutely dominant this past year, like I have never seen before. I watched a lot of Raji in college and he came nowhere close to that.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 31, 2010 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

“tie up blockers” is the job description of all 30 front linemen. Suh is the absolute IDEAL fit at 3-4 DE

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

I still won’t believe it till’ I see it.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

and the argument can be made that Berry is the BPA. I don’t believe so but they are almost like 1 and 1A now when it comes to talent and how scouts look at them.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 29, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly, I’d be ecstatic if we got either.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly, I like that idea more than sitting at 7 and picking someone like Bulaga, Rolando McClain, etc.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 29, 2010 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Refer to comment right above yours…

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 9:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

where did this rumor originate? is it something I could reasonably expect to occur or is it just a crazy pre-draft rumor?

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe it is… maybe it isn’t.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

i shouldn’t have asked. It should be obvious that its a smokescreen

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 29, 2010 10:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smokescreen… haven’t heard that word in awhile haha.

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

That was a smokescreen as well.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

by Villeslgr on Mar 29, 2010 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Smokescreen consulting.

You need help.

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 29, 2010 10:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I believe Mangini said something about “not ruling out” trading up to Detroit’s pick.

Obviously, take everything with a huge grain of salt this time of year.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

What would it take? A 3rd rounder and next year’s first?

by skipkirk on Mar 30, 2010 5:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

What if it is for Clausen?

Could the servers hold up?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d renounce the Browns for good.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

1. Meh. Bad trade, risky-ish pick that could turn out to be huge.
2. No.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

ugh.. I don’t want to pay #2 money to anybody. Not even Suh. On top of that, to get to the #2 pick would be ludicrously costly in terms of draft picks.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think we would be giving up draft value chart equivalent picks. I think we would move up for less than that.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

even so, the highest I’d want to move up is #5. the higher picks are just too costly, especially for defensive players. every pick before #12 is overpaid.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think the Browns will work a deal to get Berry.

If Bradford is gone. Washington wants Bradford if they can get him at the number 4 pick. If not they will trade down.

by champion64 on Mar 29, 2010 3:48 PM EDT reply actions  

No chance they take Clausen?

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think that even Al Davis is that crazy.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

speaking of al davis…did everyone hear they are (supposedly) are working out a deal for mcnabb?

by brownsMania on Mar 29, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

McNabb will never agree to an extension with the Raiders.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 29, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Never underestimate the value of a crap load of dollars.

Right DeAngelo?

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

this picture is frickin hilarious

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 30, 2010 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Berry
Suh
Bradford
Thomas
Haden

by emily522 on Mar 29, 2010 5:58 PM EDT reply actions  

I’m agreeing with most everybody else, having Berry at 1. My reasoning is that unless we plan on switching to a 4-3 (which as far as I understand we aren’t) we need to build up with our DB & LB… so my list is as follows
1. Berry
2. Suh (still a best)
3. McClain
4. E Thomas
5. Okung

Why has no one ranked McClain at all??

by brownsMania on Mar 29, 2010 6:29 PM EDT reply actions  

Because not many people think he’s a top five player.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

obviously, but what are their reasons for him not being a top 5 player.

by brownsMania on Mar 29, 2010 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

There are others that are better: Suh, Bradford, Berry for sure. Okung is more valuable but not really to us. McCoy is also a better prospect by most accounts, though he’s not necessarily a great fit here. ILB just isn’t a hugely valuable position that high in the draft – you need a player of epic potential (kinda like Berry is for safety).

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 29, 2010 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

MLB just doesn’t have that much effect on the game anymore. Not nearly as much as QB or pass rusher or offensive tackle.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Ray Lewis, Patrick Willis.

But there are only two MLBs alive who can make that kind of impact.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

I knew we should have picked patrick willis.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

If the 49ers were a playoff team, he’d get so much hype.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 30, 2010 12:32 AM EDT up reply actions  

They are also 3-4 backers, where they take on more important roles than their 4-3 counter parts.

by BrownDawg1409 on Mar 30, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Once again:

1. Suh
(big drop-off)
2. Berry
3. Bradford
(gigantic huge drop-off)
4. Bryant
5. McClain

After my top 3 nobody excites me in the top 20. If we come away with one of the top 3, I’ll be pumped.

Also, still think Haden is overrated.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 6:32 PM EDT reply actions  

I don’t see how Bradford gets behind Berry. Also, McCoy? Do you know something that everyone else doesn’t about him?

by TheDriveStillHurts on Mar 29, 2010 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Most people on here are not fans of Gerald McCoy.

I have been crapping on the dude for almost 6 months now.

by Bernie19Kosar on Mar 29, 2010 7:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Can’t quite put my finger on it, but something is holding me back from being as sold on Bradford. His ceiling is obviously higher than Berry’s, but since Berry is so safe and QB’s carry so much extra risk (and cost), I have Berry over Bradford.

Won’t really argue if you have those two flipped.

McCoy? I don’t know. He didn’t stand out to me in the games I watched. Not as much as Suh or even Terrence Cody. Any mention of McCoy in the same tier as Suh is crazy. Think of it this way: look at Suh’s numbers, then look at McCoy’s. They played in the same conference. Suh was probably triple-teamed more than McCoy was double-teamed. So my thought? Top 10? Fine. Top 5? Maybe. Top 3? No way.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 29, 2010 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

McCoy is a different kind of player. Could be an elite Warren Sapp type of player in the tampa 2 scheme. Slightly undersized but fantastic speed and jump off the ball. He could be a major force in the defensive line in one gap schemes.

Suh has the Knee injury history and could end up being just an average player in the NFL. You never know what might happen.

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions  

Suh’s floor might be an average player in the NFL. Fine.

But I don’t see the McCoy upside. Warren Sapp wasn’t undersized. And he was really freaking fast for a 300 lb-er. He dominated at the highest levels in college. McCoy is averagely fast, not overwhelmingly strong and disappeared for entire games against good competition.

Maybe you meant to say “Suh” in your first paragraph. Much better comp for Sapp, actually.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 30, 2010 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

Gerald McCoy is 6’4" 295, pretty similar size to sapp.
McCoy isn’t the strongest lineman, neither was sapp.
McCoy and sapp both relied on speed and agility and getting off the ball quickly.
McCoy and Sapp both fit the tampa 2 scheme perfectly ( slightly undersized pass rush oriented one-gap DTs)

"Smokescreen."

by jaws. on Mar 30, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sapp was 6’2 and his playing weight was around 310-315 pounds and at one point got all the way up to over 330 (and he was still effective). He was quick but he was also an extremely strong lineman. He had great speed and agility for his size but he was also a huge dude. He was stout against the run and was a big, hard hitter type of lineman.

Imagine Kevin Williams’ Body and body type, combined with the speed and agility of a pat williams. this was a guy who could play the 3 tech or 2 tech. he could stop the run, bull rush, or just flat out use his agility to get to the QB.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think you have the Williamses switched.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah. I just noticed that when you said it…why do they have to have the same name?!?!?!

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

I couldn’t tell ya.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 2:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

yeah…I hope you understood what I meant anyways.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

brothers from another mother

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

Here’s the thing. You’ve compared McCoy to Sapp’s weaknesses (though Sapp was much heavier, lower to the ground and stronger). On Sapp’s high points (speed), McCoy doesn’t even come close. Check their 40 times, check their sack numbers in college, check their accolades in college, check their gamelogs in college, check the tape.

McCoy may be a good players someday, but that is a lot of projection for a guy talked about in the top 5. There just isn’t much to back it up. What part of his game or physique is elite? Point me to a time when he dominated in the Big 12.

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 30, 2010 11:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

1. Suh
2. Bradford
3. McCoy
4. Berry
5. Okung

That’s how I think I voted, but now I would consider switching 1 & 2 — the reviews of Bradford at his pro-day are off the charts.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Mar 29, 2010 6:37 PM EDT reply actions  

I hid that chain of comments that caused controversy above. It should be obvious to everyone to refrain from unnecessary comments, or else (Dun Dun Dun). Carry on.

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.

by Chris Pokorny on Mar 29, 2010 11:31 PM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Haha, I was starting tho think that whole thread was just a figment of my imagination…

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 30, 2010 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

me too

She only has one disease. And it’s named after me.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 30, 2010 9:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

You know, I was sure your sig was going to end up being “I spread Gonorrhea like no one’s business.”

by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Mar 30, 2010 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

Funny as hell, but a little nasty. No one wants to see that everyday.

She only has one disease. And it’s named after me.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 30, 2010 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

Actually, I’m just gunna delete what I have now and wait till something better comes up.

She only has one disease. And it’s named after me.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 30, 2010 10:46 AM EDT up reply actions  

Before you vote – check out the write up about SAm Bradford in PD. I will repeat – I hate Oklahoma with a passion – but Sam Bradford is the truth. His accurAcy and athleticism just scary.

by realmccoy on Mar 29, 2010 11:57 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Did you just suggest we read a PD article?

One picture is worth 128K words.

by StuckInPa on Mar 30, 2010 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

you can’t make me!

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 30, 2010 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Beats the hell outta the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette or Tribune Review.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 30, 2010 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Quarterbacks

Besides Bradford, I dont see a quarterback worth taking in this draft. I would be more in favor of drafting one of the Offensive Tackles. I also am not so sure how deep this draft is. I like McClain but I dont think the Browns will draft him. He is a smart player. Berry would be a good pick. Haden if Berry is not there.

by champion64 on Mar 30, 2010 6:51 PM EDT reply actions  

how can any one vote to take a defensive tackle or a safety over a consensus #1 QB?

by rockybrown on Mar 30, 2010 7:18 PM EDT reply actions  

20/20 hindsight being what it is, I wish we had taken Champ Bailey instead of the consensus #1 QB back in 1999.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 7:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

the question is, is there a champ bailey in this draft? to look at the current draft, it doesn’t help to look in hindsight at others. you have to go by THAT year.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haden.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

I cannot believe you just compared champ bailey to haden. Haden is NOWHERE NEAR the talent champ bailey is. champ bailey was one of the best players at his position in college football in decades. he was the same in the pros. champ bailey was smarter, better, and more polished coming out. he had skills haden could only dream to have. Looking back, if Bailey was being looked at as a prospect in this years draft, not only would he be by FAR the best CB (and DB) but he would pretty much be a lock in the top 3. the only thing stopping him from being #1 was QB need in St. Louis, and if Detroit would take Suh. However, detroit does need CB help so I would say with Bailey’s skills he would go #2 overall…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think he’s implying that Haden is at that level now, just that he could be in a few years.

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 11:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t see it, thinking Haden is too slow at this point.

by Roger Dorn on Mar 31, 2010 9:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t pay much attention to measurables. The guy plays fast and smart and physical.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

yes (and this is to you below too golan) but Haden was nowhere near the level that Bailey was SKILLWISE and polished-wise coming out. I think haden can be a #1 CB but he doesn’t have anywhere close to the skills that champ bailey did. bailey is great at reading a QBs eyes and shutting down a receiver in many ways that aren’t completely reliant of physical skills, however his physical skills are miles ahead of where haden’s were. there isn’t a comparison at all. it is like jaws trying to compare gerald McCoy to Warren Sapp. 2 completely different styles of players…on 2 completely different levels.


Golan, I think haden could have a very good career and develop into a #1 CB, but look at who you are comparing him too…a future HOFer…

That is like comparing derrick morgan to Michael Strahan.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 11:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

And I’m telling you that he will be every bit the player Bailey is. Watch and see.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

so I am supposed to just go on your word and he must be as good as Bailey? I just don’t know what evidence there is to support it…Am I supposed to believe…Is he a fairy like tinkerbell and if I believe, he CAN succeed? please tell me how he will be like bailey?

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Am I supposed to believe…Is he a fairy like tinkerbell and if I believe, he CAN succeed?

?

by emily522 on Mar 30, 2010 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

I am merely commenting on how golan says that this guy is champ bailey and he gives no evidence on why this guy will be the next champ bailey. he just says I need to watch…so do I need to believe too? (that was the joke)

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think Tinkerbell is one of the Disney princesses now.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 30, 2010 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

hahaha.

oh by the way, you still haven’t given any evidence or reason why joe haden will be the next champ bailey…I would love to here it.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

There is no evidence. Haden is just hyped.

Who's Cartwright?
I'm Cartwright.
You're not Cartwright.

by Brownie's Year on Mar 31, 2010 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

my thoughts. I want to hear however how he is like champ bailey.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

I never said that he’s the next Champ Bailey. I said that he’ll be just as good. His game will be different than Bailey’s. He’ll be more physical at the LOS, he’s already a better tackler than Bailey and already has better field vision. He’ll see a few more balls thrown in his direction than Bailey, because he’s not a lockdown corner like Bailey, but at the same time, he’ll force a lot of fumbles, get more INTs and get to the QB more than any other CB in recent memory.

In short, there’s more than one way to play the position, and I think he’ll develop into the best all around CB in the league.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

what makes you so high on Haden?

by The Licensed Pessimist on Mar 31, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gut feeling.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

so we should just draft him on your gut feeling? call up holmgren, I think we have a lock with that pick!

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

My gut is right more often than not.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha oh god here we go

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

even if it is, you still admit it is wrong. there is a good chance here your gut is wrong.

And I don’t know how much value I put on an opinion on a player based on someones gut feeling.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

You should put more value in golan’s gut. Learn to live a little.

by Western Reserve on Mar 31, 2010 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

okay…so I should live a little and believe the next champ bailey is in this draft?

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I recommend this post.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

No. You should just live a little.

And challenge golan’s gut to a game of chess. En garde!

Just my two cents.

by Western Reserve on Mar 31, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

My gut beat Deep Blue.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

True but that wasn’t a really fair game of H-O-R-S-E now was it?

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know how much value I put on your opinion on a player. Zero.

Even if we had game tape on every player, and enough free time to study it, and access to the players’ pro days and interviews and background checks and police records, we’d still be left making, at best, an educated guess as to who will be and who won’t be a great player. And short of having all of the above information, what it comes down to is either a gut feeling or parroting what you’ve read elsewhere and pretending that you’ve actually done the work.

I go with the gut. It saves me time, and I’m usually just as likely to be correct as anyone who pretends to study up on the draft.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

I go with the gut. It saves me time, and I’m usually just as likely to be correct as anyone who pretends to study up on the draft.

This dovetails nicely with my sneaking suspicion that all draft talk is really just the sports fan equivalent of talking about the weather on a slow news day.

That's just noise.

by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Apr 1, 2010 1:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes. Ultimately we have a bunch of amateurs trying to second guess professionals who get paid to spend their entire day figuring these things out.

by Roger Dorn on Apr 1, 2010 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Very well put, RDC.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Apr 1, 2010 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks. Don’t get me wrong, I can see why people find draft talk entertaining – and it’s clear that it’s a hugely popular topic here – but to get too serious about it just seems silly.

That's just noise.

by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Apr 2, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

No, I’m not a lesbian.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah…you look more like a bearded old man.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t know Butch Davis was a lesbian.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Mar 31, 2010 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly… throw a wig on him and throw him into YWCA and I’m not sure I’d be able to pick him out.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hmm, good point, just don’t yell out “Hey Butch!”.

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Apr 1, 2010 1:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

My neice just informed me that Tinkerbell is, in fact, still a fairy.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

I could’ve told you that haha.

by emily522 on Mar 31, 2010 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Oh, like Bross.

instantrimshot.com

"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."

by SpecialBrownie on Mar 31, 2010 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

rec

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah…you know it!

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 31, 2010 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I highly doubt this. Time will tell.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Mar 31, 2010 1:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m sold on the guy. We’ll have to revisit this topic in a few years.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.

by golanbatrac on Mar 31, 2010 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m marking it on my calendar for 2013

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Champ bailey comes around once in a generation. I don’t believe there are ANY players (especially in the defensive backfield) who run a 4.28 40, have a 45 inch vertical leap, 3.8 second 20 yd SS, AND won the Bronko Nagurski award as the nations best defensive player…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

by bross09 on Mar 30, 2010 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Perhaps they don’t think he is the number one QB.

by gahnki on Mar 30, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

He almost certainly is the number one QB in this draft. But if you consider this to be a weak QB crop, what does that really mean? Nothing.

When investing in a first round QB, the comparison isn’t to other QB’s in the draft. It is to the QB’s on the team now, available in trades, in FA, and probably, more importantly for the Browns, in the next couple drafts. You only draft a QB in the first round once in a great while (once a decade, ideally).

fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com

by Ryan Kelsey on Mar 30, 2010 11:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not arguing this, but there are plenty of people who like Jimmy Clausen the most. They would not draft Bradford first.

by gahnki on Mar 31, 2010 7:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

these people all have posters of him in their bedrooms

I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.

by notthatnoise on Mar 31, 2010 9:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is it a crime to have a different opinion?

Scientific research has proven that you lose exactly 5.37 billion brain cells every time you listen to Todd McShay.

by TheRealSlimShady on Mar 31, 2010 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Depends on the opinion. That one is close.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think someone needs to send an email to Walter just ripping him.

by emily522 on Apr 1, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

We could just write an open letter

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 1, 2010 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bradford
Suh
McCoy
Berry
Graham

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Mar 30, 2010 10:58 PM EDT reply actions  

Bradford, Berry, Okung, Bulaga, Haden

by rockybrown on Mar 31, 2010 1:14 AM EDT reply actions  

Am I confused or are the Eagles really only asking for a top 40 pick for McNabb? Would our 2nd be too much to give up for him?

Depending on who we get in the first and/or other moves we might make (trading down for extra picks,trading Rogers/DQ) would a 2nd be worth it if we were able to acquire another pick in the 2nd or 3rd?

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

by Villeslgr on Mar 31, 2010 1:30 AM EDT reply actions  

I would pull that trigger. We’d be a good team.

Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle

by danvail on Mar 31, 2010 8:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

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