Devils Advocate: Why we should draft Tim Tebow
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 21, 2010 9:00 PM EDT
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"I do two things well, score TD's and pray. I don't see any churches Beyotch."
These are not necessarily my views, just the flip side of the coin.
Why should the Browns take Tim Tebow as the QB of the future?
- Tebow needs work. Alexander James Murphy didn't need this much work. He needs to clean up his footwork and especially his release. You know what he did about it? He attacked it. He didn't wait for a NFL team to draft him and then start to make changes. He realized that this was a problem and got started right after the Senior Bowl. He isn't done, and bad habits die hard. I can't guarantee that Tim Tebow will be good in the NFL. I can guarantee that it won't be because he won't work his ass off. Ask the Raiders if that is an important quality in a franchise QB.
- Aren't we the perfect situation for Tebow to be in? A team that in all reality isn't planning on winning big next season. Draft the kid, make him live with Mike Holmgren, Brian Dabol and Gil Haskell for the season, and bring him along slowly. Don't draw up exotic plays for him to use his feet, we have someone to do that kind of thing, and he happens to be damn good at it. Make him become a QB. Bring him along at a snails pace. Give him a series a game starting in week 4. Two series a game in week 8. Not only would it make the week 17 snoozer watchable, but it would allow Tebow to get game action in a somewhat controlled environment.
- Say what you want about the kid, but he is a leader. His speeches may be hokey, but the Florida Gators were Tim Tebow's team. There wasn't a question who was the captain. Don't the Browns need someone to take this franchise by the brass ones and take them into the next level of NFL franchises? All great dynasties had great leaders. Otto with the Browns. Bradshaw with the Steelers. Staubach with the Cowboys. Starr with the Packers. Montana with the 49ers. Aikman with the Cowboys. They may not have been the best player on that team, but they sure as hell were the leaders. Sounds like Tebow to me.
- Who cares that he played in a spread? This isn't 1999 anymore. Try finding an offense in college that doesn't run some version of the spread. It used to be that only the weirdo schools ran spread in college football. Not anymore. So what that Tebow took all of his snaps out of shotgun? The New England Patriots ran over 50% of their plays out of shotgun. Didn't seem to hurt Tom Brady. If learning the five step drop is the biggest problem he has, then sign me up. Sure he needs a lot of work, but who do you think is going to out work Tim Tebow?
- Intangibles. I know this is a touchy subject. I am not going to say "He's a winner!" But Tebow has "it". "It" is kind of like porn. I can't explain what it is, but when I see "it", I know. Tebow has "it". Clausen doesn't. I think McCoy and Bradford may, but the only QB I can point to for sure, is Tim Tebow. Maybe this is a cliche reason, but I bet if you are honest with yourself, you think the same thing. When the crowd is at its loudest and the Gators were facing a 3rd and 12, deep down you knew that Tim Tebow, somehow, some way, was going to pick this up and keep the drive alive. How freaking sweet would that be to have that in a Browns uniform?
- Wouldn't this be Mike Holmgren's greatest accomplishment? We are talking about a man who turned a QB from a 53% pass completion back-up into a 65% pass completion Hall of Famer. Who would you rather have shape a young QB? We already established that Tebow will work his ass off. Combine that with the QB wizardry that Holmgren has performed over his career, what are the chances that Tebow doesn't at least become a average starter?
- Clausen had Tate, Floyd and Rudolph. Bradford had Ryan Broyles and the fantastic rushing duo of DeMarco Murray and Chris Brown. Tebow had a H-Back and a white WR. Tebow was the leading rusher. Long story short, Tebow didn't have any surrounding playmakers this season. He lost Percy Harvin, yet his YPA stayed the same and his completion percentage went up. If Florida was going to move the ball, it was going to be because of the arm or feet of Tim Tebow and he did it.
- Don't hold Tebow responsible for others. So Vern Lundquist wants to have his children. Why is that Tebows fault? Thom Brennaman's life goal is to spend 10 minutes with Tim Tebow. Since when is being a great person a bad thing? Kurt Warner seems like a great God loving, puppy petting, hungry people-feeding person and he was one hell of a QB. Why do people hold this against Tebow? I sure as hell don't think it will hurt him at the next level. He had no problem fitting into the University of Florida locker room and that place is full of criminals and thugs. As long as he doesn't go Cerrano in Major League 2 (My second Major League 2 reference of the week!) who cares if he is a great guy? Here I thought we were trying to avoid a*sholes!
- Unlike Bradford, Clausen and McCoy, Tebow is probably not going to cost us a first rounder (and then some in Bradford's case). Doesn't the package of Berry and Tebow sound better than Clausen and Nate Allen? It sure as hell does to me. Not only will we be able to get a first round talent at seven, but we will be able to sit still in the second round and nab the QB of the future.
- Sam Bradford is accurate. His Heisman winning season he had a 67.9 completion percentage. Tim Tebow's completion percentage last season was 67.8. Insane right? You're probably thinking that Tebow was throwing easier routes in his offense. Sure that may be true, but Tebow was putting the ball right on the money, allowing his weapons, the few he had, to catch and get upfield (9.2 YPA). That sounds like something that Mike Holmgren and Gil Haskell will be looking for in a QB. Just because Tebow wasn't asked to throw deep on a consistent basis, doesn't mean he can't. As we know, a strong arm doesn't make you a good QB in this league. Right? Give me accuracy and a smart head instead.
- Tebow takes care of the football. He is 88-16 in TD-INT ratio. I don't want to hear about system. Chris Leak threw 13 INT's in one season under Meyer. Tebow doesn't do dumb things with the football. Isn't that the hardest thing to teach a young QB? Hell, Brett Favre still has trouble with this lesson. We need a QB that will take care of the football and allow our running game to do the damage. McCoy had 12 INT's last season. Sam Bradford career-wise has the same amount of INT's as Tebow in two less seasons! When it comes to ball security, Tebow is far and away the best in this draft class.
- If we take Tebow, Jaws' head will explode.
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I’d say his draft range is between the mid 20s and 41 or so. I really think the Browns should trade #38 and a third rounder to get up into the late first and eliminate all the intrigue of the night between the first and second rounds. If we sit at #38 I’d be terrified that someone would trade ahead of us in the second in order to acquire Tebow.
"Smokescreen."
If McCoy is gone before our 2nd round pick, regardless of where Clausen is, then I say take him.
A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright
by Kimble_79 on Apr 21, 2010 9:22 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
This is where I went. My QB preference:
1) Bradford
2) McCoy
3) Clausen (DA on this subject actually made me a believer. Now THAT’S good writing!)
4) Tebow is a close fourth. If it weren’t for the DA, he would have been third.
by BrownDawg1409 on Apr 21, 2010 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I would say the same thing but now on the day of the draft, after having read so many aricles on these guys, I can’t decide. At the beginning I was sure that I wanted Bradford and no other. Especially not Tebow since I’m against FLA QBs. I was against Clausen for being from Notre Dame and how some scouts say that he has already topped out. I wonder if McCoy can win big games.
I’ve read two articles now about Tebow and Clausen that have made me ok with them. I won’t be overly dissappointed if they’re chosen. I’ve read some negative things about Bradford that makes me glad he’ll be gone before the browns pick.
In the end, I’m happy that the guys making this choice are Heckert and Holmgren. The biggest expert on QBs in the NFL is Holmgren. Whoever he chooses, whether we like the pick or not, lets give him a chance. Big Show knows what he’s doing.
The Drive, the Fumble, the Shot, the Meltdown...still hopefull.
All I can say on the eve of the draft is this; Ryan Leaf (#1 overall) or Josh Cribbs (UDFA)?
Who really knows how these guys will pan out?
If the other guys are gone, sign him up and give him a shot. No NFL exec or scout thought Warren Moon would cut it as a QB in the NFL either.
Please Lord, Just one Browns Superbowl in my lifetime.......
that had a lot to do with him being a black quarterback
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Apr 21, 2010 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
For a second there I thought you were talking about Cribbs.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 21, 2010 10:37 PM EDT up reply actions
that would have been quite the misunderstanding indeed!
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Apr 21, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Ryan Leaf was number 2 overall. Some other dude was number 1 that year.
by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 21, 2010 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions
At least he showed a little wisdom in not accepting the invite to be physically at the draft. May be the first guy ever to be in the green room until the 3rd round.
by DisplacedBuckeye on Apr 21, 2010 9:25 PM EDT reply actions
Difference being Brandon Ghee wouldn’t have a camera on him after every pick.
by OSUMoneyball on Apr 21, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I’d like to add this – the “Rah-Rah” attitude and preachy-ness may have been tolerated in College – but that’s not gonna fly in an NFL locker room or huddle. Just look to the Tebow / Wonderlic story for proof. Or ask Butch Davis.
Please Lord, Just one Browns Superbowl in my lifetime.......
by DaveDawg09 on Apr 21, 2010 9:31 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
It doesn’t hurt Philip Rivers.
If he walks in the door at gets in everyones face with that noise, I agree. But he proves himself, works his ass off and becomes the QB that we need, I think his team mates will fall in line.
He needs to earn the right to be rah-rah in-your-face.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 21, 2010 9:43 PM EDT up reply actions
If we take Tebow, Jaws’ head will explode.
Made me laugh.
I voted for option 4, but could be convinced to pick option 3 as well.
by emily522 on Apr 21, 2010 9:36 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I will have the same reaction as Jaws.
by OSUMoneyball on Apr 21, 2010 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes.
A couple of things:
First, yeah I wouldn’t mind if Tebow became our primary wildcat Ballcarrier later on this season, once they have a few plays in for him, especially in short yardage. Cribbs could still be on the field in a “percy Harvin” type role wherin he could run the bubble screen or take a Jet sweep. Tebow already knows how to make all the run reads that would be required for us to do all sorts of stuff in the wildcat. It would be a good way to get Tebow on the field in a “controlled environment” Think Tebow’s freshman year at florida.
Second, the offense is going to have to meet Tebow half way. He just isn’t ever going to be a top 10 NFL pocket passer. The dude represents the next evolution of the quarterback position in my opinion, just like Vince Young and Michael Vick before him. Its time to start nudging the Browns toward being team that is on the very cutting edge of offensive football.
Third, Tebow actually was asked to throw the ball down the field, and was very successful at it. In fact Florida’s offense depended on it. Spreading the field and pounding the run essentially forced other teams to drop both safeties in the box to help stop the run, and when Tebow had Harvin and Louis Murphy on the outside, he was able to go down the field more against single coverage.
Tebow’s underneath accuracy has been probably his biggest weakness. He delievers the ball a little late and his poor footwork takes some zip off the ball underneath. His arm is probably stronger than Bradford’s and definitely much stronger than McCoy’s, when he sets his feet and throws. His best quality is his ability to throw a strong, accurate deep ball as well as anyone in SEC history. I think that accuracy could improve with his footwork and throwing motion.
Point is: don’t believe the media bashing. Tim Tebow doesn’t need to be “rebuilt” or something. He needs an offense that is going to adapt to him, because it is much more difficult for him to be asked to adapt to an offense that just doesn’t take advantage of some of his best qualities. Tebow had somewhat larger windows to throw into in college precisely because of the threat of him running the football. Because of the threat of Tebow’s legs, he was able to pass more effectively. Don’t think for a second that this doesn’t translate to the NFL: Tebow doesn’t have to lead the team in rushing, he just has to be a legitimate threat to run. If he had 6-10 designed carries a game he would probably end up with 300-400 yards rushing a season but the real benefit comes in the playaction passing game.
Tebow’s main competition comes from Colt McCoy, who I would like quite a bit in any other year. Unfortunately for him, he is an inferior prospect. McCoy comes from a spread offense that was quite limited by his inferior arm strength. Moreover, McCoy also lead his team in rushing, and his smaller body most certainly will not be able to handle this in the NFL, where Tebow’s could handle a modest workload. Most importantly, because of his running ability, McCoy was the beneficiary of the same larger windows that Tebow had, something that simply cannot continue into the NFL. McCoy’s major argument over Tebow is that he has better underneath accuracy, but Tebow’s career completion percentage is 67%, just 3% worse than McCoy’s who was mostly much shorter and safer routes.
As for the argument that his attitude wouldn’t work in an NFL locker room, give the guy some credit. he isn’t going to preach anyone, and he isn’t arrogant like Clausen is claimed to be. I’d put my money on him being a great influence on a locker room (especially one that is supposed to be stocked with “character guys” per Mangini) especially if he were to start by keeping his head down and demonstrating his habits of hard work and improving himself to the point where he can make an impact on the field. Say what you will about his attitude, but if he can get the job done on the field, other players will follow him. (Also the wonderlic story isn’t true. Totally debunked. Tebow isn’t that big of a moron.)
I apologize for the Bross-like length, but this is my pet topic.
"Smokescreen."
this is my pet topic.
You don’t say?
by emily522 on Apr 21, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
The dude represents the next evolution of the quarterback position in my opinion, just like Vince Young and Michael Vick before him.
Disagree.
You could have said the same thing about McNabb when he came out. Tebow will have to adjust his game. If he can’t then we need to go to someone else. Same for McCoy.
Tim Tebow doesn’t need to be "rebuilt" or something.
I have an open mind about this, but you really need to temper this thinking. Urban Meyer did Tebow a massive disservice.
I have said it before and I will repeat it.
Remember when a teacher would ask you to show your work when you did a math problem? Tebow has aced his math test (college), but he is getting the answers in the wrong way. It isn’t going to hurt him now, but when he gets to calculus (NFL) he is going to be up sh*ts creek.
Now I think he can learn, and to be completely honest, I would be more than willing to wait for Tebow to learn. But if you think that Tebow will be anything more than a project in season one, you are setting yourself up for a major let-down.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 21, 2010 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t see where your thinking comes from. Don’t put the NFL on some sort of pedistal like the game is some sort of idealist utopia where only a certain brand of football exists. It quite simply isn’t the case. Urban Meyer is probably the best coach in college football and might run the most schematically well-developed gameplan of any coach anywhere, including the NFL.
The NFL isn’t calculus. It isn’t even any more schematically interesting than a lot of the college game. The biggest differences is that the players are faster (essentially shrinking the field) and the teams have unlimited practice and preperation time, so you are able to practice a wider variety of plays, so long as you continue to do your core stuff well.
Urban Meyer didn’t do tebow any disservice, he did exactly what he should have done: Put Tebow in the best situation to win games and perform at his best. Trying to shoehorn a player into a system that doesn’t take full advantage of his talents is the real Disservice (ask Terrelle Pryor circa the 2009 USC game, most disgusting offensive gameplan I’ve ever seen on a football field, and I’ve coached 9th graders)
"Smokescreen."
I don’t see where your thinking comes from. Don’t put the NFL on some sort of pedistal like the game is some sort of idealist utopia where only a certain brand of football exists. It quite simply isn’t the case.
This is the problem. You don’t understand the jump in levels. Going from CFB to the NFL is like night and day. Add in the fact that QB is the hardest position to play in all of sport, we are talking about a HUGE difference. You can’t just dismiss it.
Urban Meyer is probably the best coach in college football and might run the most schematically well-developed gameplan of any coach anywhere, including the NFL.
Sure, that works in college. No QB can run in the NFL as much as Tebow ran in college. If you think you can just plug in Meyers offense at this level and be successful, you are smoking dope. Tebow will not be a successful QB in the NFL unless he becomes a much better pocket passer.
The NFL isn’t calculus. It isn’t even any more schematically interesting than a lot of the college game.
Disagree. Tebow may have seen a lot of defenses in college but he hasn’t seen the complexity of a Rex Ryan defense or the camouflage ability of Dick LeBeau blitz. To compare CFB defense to the NFL is insulting to defensive coordinators.
Urban Meyer didn’t do tebow any disservice, he did exactly what he should have done: Put Tebow in the best situation to win games and perform at his best.
Urban Meyer did what is best for Urban. He let Timmy win him a crap load of football games. But when it comes down to it, he didn’t prepare Tebow for the NFL one bit. He knew that Tebow’s mechanics were a mess, but he didn’t change anything. Maybe it was because it could have cost him a win against Arkansas, or maybe he just doesn’t care. Either way, Meyer did do Tebow an injustice.
(ask Terrelle Pryor circa the 2009 USC game, most disgusting offensive gameplan I’ve ever seen on a football field, and I’ve coached 9th graders
Terrelle Pryor is being taught to be a QB, not just an offensive dynamo. There will be some rough spots. If everything goes as planned like with Troy Smith, ask me who the more prepared QB will be.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 12:28 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t even know what to say to you, you’re completely mistaken. The jump in levels of the NFL doesn’t change the rules of the game ( all that much) the defense is going to be faster and more athletic, but it still is 11 on 11. All the same possibilities are available to college defenses.
Given that he has faced Nick Saban and Monte Kiffin – coached defenses I’d say tebow has seen practically everything he can see for the most part. Charlie Strong probably ran as much stuff on defense at florida as they do in the NFL. There are only so many coverages you can run, and nothing on any level is all that exotic or rare. all the added complexity in the NFL is just re-packing stuff and moving guys around pre-snap to make things a bit more confusing. At first it is confusing because the good defensive co-ordinators can disguise coverages pretty well but they don’t have magic wands. The one thing the NFL defenses can do is run a wider variety of stuff in one game (and probably run a little more combo coverage). Having more practice time you can prepare more material week to week and adjust to the offenses gameplan more.
Frankly the best part about Urban Meyer – style offense is that it can force the defense into being very vanilla and bland and yet they still have trouble answering the versatility of Tebow, who is a threat to run and pass on every play. You can’t leave a wideout uncovered to stack the box (as USC did against Pryor) because Tebow sight-adjusted to throw uncovered. You can try and bring both safties down into the box and play cover 0, but you leave yourself vulnerable to getting beat over the top (worst outcome for the defense)
Get the notion of the “platonic ideal football” out of your head. Just because the pro game generally has a certain look to it right now doesn’t mean that there is only one effective way to play the game. The best passing clubs are dominating right now because they are spreading the field and running tried and true concepts, many of which originated with Bill Walsh or Paul Brown. They have even had some help in the running game (think Westbrook et all.) It really is only a matter of time until the “power running” teams realize that spreading the field and using your quarterback to control one defender (with option reads) can improve your rushing attack immensely. In a well designed offense, the quarterback wouldn’t need to run much, but just enough to be a threat on every play.
The point is the game is constantly changing and evolving. Ten years ago there were about 4 teams that ran any 3-4 at all. This season 15 teams run the 3-4 as their base defense in one form or another. The singleback zone blocking schemes were initially ridiculed quite a bit (you mean run inside? without a fullback? WHAT?) Now the inside zone, outside zone and counter trey are all staples in virtually every NFL playbook, and at some point helped give rise to the various shotgun spread-to-run offenses you see run by the likes of Rich Rodriguez and Urban Meyer.
Continuing to claim that “no QB can run in the NFL” or “You simply must have a pure pocket passer” to win in the NFL is silly and shortsighted. The best offenses already spread the field and run lots of shotgun. The NFL has already started to move to meet the spread half way. Dismissing something so effective as a “college gimmick” is just a big mistake. The wildcat is just scratching the surface. It isn’t just a silly looking gimmick, there is solid reason why it works and is here to stay.
"Smokescreen."
Continuing to claim that "no QB can run in the NFL" or "You simply must have a pure pocket passer" to win in the NFL is silly and shortsighted.
Have you been up close to a NFL game? I have been on the sideline for an ACC CFB game and a NFL game. I cannot put into words at the pure physicality of the NFL. If you don’t grasp this, the rest of this conversation is a waste of your and my time.
Everyone is fast. Everyone is big. Everyone brings the wood. A NFL QB cannot take 15-20 hits a game. Do you remember the beating Favre took in the NFC Championship game? That was the toughest QB ever to play the game. He was beaten into submission. You think Tebow can take that PLUS 10-15 carries? Sweet Jesus, he wouldn’t last 10 games.
Running Backs, players who train their entire careers to carry the rock, only last 7-8 years in this league if they are lucky. Yet you expect Tebow to do this, plus be a sitting target for 30 other downs and come out the other side alive? Do you not see the problem in this logic?
Dismissing something so effective as a "college gimmick" is just a big mistake. The wildcat is just scratching the surface. It isn’t just a silly looking gimmick, there is solid reason why it works and is here to stay.
Hate to bring facts into this fairy tale, but the Wildcat was nowhere near as effective this past season.
Wanna know why? Because the NFL defensive coordinator’s have adapted. It no longer takes anyone by surprise.
If it is “here to stay” the Dolphins may wanna try and figure something else out. They lost a full yard off their YPC from ’08 to ’09. How much you want to bet that it will go down next season as well?
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:14 AM EDT up reply actions
I have given him small chunks of the arguments as to why all “college” offenses don’t necessarily translate to the NFL.
He has not listened to what I have had to say.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Just read this. I can’t explain it any better. Pay close attention to the part about Bruce Arians.
"Smokescreen."
From your article:
Now this gets into the question about letting some team hit your quarterback, and involves other questions beyond the scope of this article.
This is my exact point. You mention Bruce Arians, he has been in and out of the NFL since 1989. He has coached Tim Couch, Peyton Manning and Ben Roethlisberger. How many read option plays has he called?
He never has, probably because he doesn’t want his QB dead.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:44 AM EDT up reply actions
When you posted your article discussing QBs and beating the house, I proposed the idea of the running QB, but I even admitted you’d probably need 2-3 of them who could all replace each other. Getting 2-3 guys who can both run and kind of throw at an NFL level is pretty tough, unless you hit on lower round picks.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Or you could get one Tebow and protect him on running plays using pitch phases and bubble screens. I think he could manage 6-10 carries a game, especially if half terminated in slide downs. Against the pass rush the QB might be at even less risk than a standard pocket passer because your varied offensive gameplan can prevent pressure with screens, draws, and the option. The offense doesn’t have to use as much time creating pass protection schemes and the defense doesn’t get to use as much time coming up with the most effective pass rush stuff.
"Smokescreen."
Defenses will already have blitzes installed in TC, and have endless time to prep, one reason being different in college is more effective than the NFL.
Offenses have to pass pro, I don’t care how much you run. That will be in too.
Tebow or any other QB could get annihilated as the pitch man.
Screens and draws don’t work if you can’t pass.
Any option plays where the QB could end up carrying the ball (the whole point of wanting a running QB) means the defense will dictate to the offense who will get hit. This means the QB. So maybe by running the ball the QB can stand less pass rush, but he can still get plastered.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
But what Arians hinted at is something a lot of coaches believe: instead of focusing all your energy on trying to scheme your way out of all that crazy, myriad blitzing from everywhere that causes you to drop everything week to week and focus solely on that to the detriment of the run game, then why not focus on what might deter that kind of blitzing in the first place? Like option, or certain spread sets, or other things that college teams do a pretty solid job of right now. Sometimes, rather than bang your head against the wall, there’s a better way.
thats the operative paragraph i was talking about. Glad you read the whole thing.
"Smokescreen."
I did read the whole thing. You don’t have to be a jackass.
I think the main issue is that you have a problem hearing things you don’t like to hear.
This will be my last comment of the night because I honestly can no longer keep this up.
The NFL has taken drastic measures to keep QB’s safe. Yet you want to run yours all over the field putting him in harms way.
What is the more probable conclusion. The entire NFL is wrong, or running your QB as a RB is a suicide mission?
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not saying the whole NFL is wrong. That is what you don’t get. I’m saying that there is more than one solution to the problem. The NFL guys find pocket passers when they can. Then they scheme their asses off to try and protect the pocket passer. Here you have a guy who isn’t and probably never will be a great pure pocket passer. But he has other skills that are absolutely just as effective. Why not take him and scheme for what he does well?
"Smokescreen."
I did read the whole thing. You don’t have to be a jackass.
but, but, but, but, YOU DISCREDITED TIMMY T AT LEAST A LITTLE BIT!
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
I apologize for the Bross-like length, but this is my pet topic.
At least he acknowledges that he’s being nearly as annoying as you.
by Western Reserve on Apr 22, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, you have to get the ball out quick and try and keep your qb from taking hits. Thats one reason why the spread is effective in the passing game. The defense is much more limited in their ability to blitz and confuse your lineman and cause pass pro breakdowns. Moreover, you have more hot receiver options in the case you do have the blitz.
As for the wildcat the degradation comes from more defensive cordinators actually respecting it and game planning to stop it and it specifically. It still isn’t perfect and that is my argument. A guy like Ronnie Brown or Cribbs isn’t much of a threat to throw it. When the threat to throw it is there then you’ve really got something. The wildcat is an interesting caveat though, because it demonstrated to the NFL the power of having a numbers advantage in the box for the offense (no “pocket quarterback” who stands like a statue watching the play) Check this out to see why the wildcat is such an interesting development in the NFL.
"Smokescreen."
Yeah, you have to get the ball out quick and try and keep your qb from taking hits. Thats one reason why the spread is effective in the passing game.
+
Deconstructing article you just linked to below
=
???
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
You know well enough that your offensive line and wideouts have to make their hot reads. His left tackle got beat and his wideouts didn’t read pressure. No scheme is going to get it right every time, sometimes the defense “guesses right”
"Smokescreen."
They brought 6 on an empty formation. LT getting beat is almost irrelevant, there was someone getting there untouched.
Tebow saw the blitz pre snap because they were showing, he needs to have some sort of check there to his WRs. If the WRs don’t read pressure, he can read it for them.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
As for the wildcat the degradation comes from more defensive cordinators actually respecting it and game planning to stop it and it specifically
This would be what I mean when I said they figured it out. They know how to stop it.
Check this out to see why the wildcat is such an interesting development in the NFL.
I find it funny that you point out that particular game as why the Wildcat works. Two weeks later, when the Jets and Dolphins played again, the Dolphins gained 7 yards on 6 carries, including a 13 yard run by Ronnie Brown.
It took Rex Ryan one look to figure it out. The SEC still can’t stop it. Just another example of the NFL being on a different planet compared to CFB.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Christ, give Rex Ryan more credit will you? Yeah you’ve got film of it you can prepare. It helps when you just played it two weeks ago. It’s not necessarily a weakness in the wildcat, but rather possibly a weakness in the Dolphin’s application. Perhaps they were giving away their plays with formation or didn’t threaten the pass enough. Fact of the matter is the wildcat has a solid mathematical base (in that ‘single wing’ numbers advantage) and isn’t only effective because it is unusual or surprising.
"Smokescreen."
Given that he has faced Nick Saban and Monte Kiffin – coached defenses I’d say tebow has seen practically everything he can see for the most part. Charlie Strong probably ran as much stuff on defense at florida as they do in the NFL.
Those defenses didn’t have 11 NFL players on the field.
Frankly the best part about Urban Meyer – style offense is that it can force the defense into being very vanilla and bland and yet they still have trouble answering the versatility of Tebow, who is a threat to run and pass on every play.
Or at least until he gets the Jesus knocked out of him.
Continuing to claim that "noQBTebow can run in the NFL"
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
only one QB has ever been a successful running threat on every play, and he hasn’t been the same since he got out of prison.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Apr 22, 2010 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions
As for Terrelle Pryor, I disagree again but you make a pretty good point. Terrelle Pryor only came to Ohio State because Tressel sold him the idea that he would be more prepared to become a professional quarterback if he went to OSU over Michigan. I find it a little bit repugnant that that was Pryors biggest selling point but I digress.
I feel that Pryor would be most prepared to play in the NFL if he were asked to maximize his talents as a football player. Trying to force him into a sub-optimal system that mutes a large part of his immense talent is akin to cutting off the nose in spite of the face. I think both OSU and Pryor would be better off if the offense was designed around what Pryor does well and how that can help you win games, not around what other people do well in the professional league. You use his abilities as best you can and then let the NFL figure out how best they can employ him. That is exactly what Urban Meyer did with Alex Smith and Tim Tebow and the NFL has been too boneheaded to use Alex Smith properly so far. Tebow has even more natural ability than Smith and I can only hope that someone unleashes his talent as well as Meyer did.
As for Pryor, I have a bit more hope for him now, because the offensive gameplan improved in the Rose Bowl from earlier in the season. In that USC game it wasn’t just a boring pro style attack but it was in fact just dreadful all the way around. Click the links for some really nice analysis. (start with the USC game.)
"Smokescreen."
I think both OSU and Pryor would be better off if the offense was designed around what Pryor does well and how that can help you win games, not around what other people do well in the professional league.
How dare Tressel win football games AND prepare his football players for a huge financial windfall in the NFL.
The nerve.
I bet Chris Leak wish he went to Ohio State/Notre Dame/USC.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:17 AM EDT up reply actions
I bet he doesn’t because Meyer made him a better quarterback.
Alex Smith was probably pretty happy he played for Meyer too.
"Smokescreen."
Yep, Urban Meyer sure has done Alex Smith a lot of good.
Did he teach him to hold a clipboard?
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:50 AM EDT up reply actions
He taught him well enough to be the #1 pick and get his big payday in the draft. That’s all he is expected to do. Pro style QBs have busted too, nobody blames their coach for “not preparing them well enough”
By the way, Alex Smith has virtually perfect mechanics throwing the football.
"Smokescreen."
Jaws, if you’re so much smarter than everyone in the NFL, why hasn’t anyone offered you a coaching job yet?
by Buckeye Brad on Apr 22, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t see where your thinking comes from. Don’t put the NFL on some sort of pedistal like the game is some sort of idealist utopia where only a certain brand of football exists. It quite simply isn’t the case. Urban Meyer is probably the best coach in college football and might run the most schematically well-developed gameplan of any coach anywhere, including the NFL.
He has had some successful college QBs.
The NFL isn’t calculus. It isn’t even any more schematically interesting than a lot of the college game. The biggest differences is that the players are faster (essentially shrinking the field) and the teams have unlimited practice and preperation time, so you are able to practice a wider variety of plays, so long as you continue to do your core stuff well.
How about Pre-Cal and Calc?
Urban Meyer didn’t do tebow any disservice, he did exactly what he should have done: Put Tebow in the best situation to win games and perform at his best. Trying to shoehorn a player into a system that doesn’t take full advantage of his talents is the real Disservice (ask Terrelle Pryor circa the 2009 USC game, most disgusting offensive gameplan I’ve ever seen on a football field, and I’ve coached 9th graders)
The disservice was in not setting aside sometime to make him a better QB, and solely focusing on winning games.
Would that have been your gameplan?
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
Urban Meyer did Tebow a massive disservice.
That’s an interesting observation. If Florida hadn’t won a billion games the last few years, would Tebow even be being discussed?
by Western Reserve on Apr 22, 2010 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions
Remember when a teacher would ask you to show your work when you did a math problem? Tebow has aced his math test (college), but he is getting the answers in the wrong way. It isn’t going to hurt him now, but when he gets to calculus (NFL) he is going to be up sh*ts creek.
I love this analogy. I was like the tebow of math. I had that problem with calc b/c of this…granted i pushed through…eventually…but not with a great grade.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Good points about Tebow but I still like McCoy better. I would take Tebow over Clausen though. Plus, I’m way more nervous than most about Bradford because of the shoulder and lack of play last year. He looked really bad in the BYU game BEFORE he was injured. Bradford started in only 28 games which is around half of what McCoy started and only 2 partials last year. There is a lot of downside risk there with Bradford and I did not like how he talked in the Gruden QB camp. His whole countenance was like a 15-year-old. So my order is McCoy, Tebow (I know… probably opposite of everyone else but why should I conform now?) and I wouldn’t take either with the first pick.
Brownsyup
Second, the offense is going to have to meet Tebow half way. He just isn’t ever going to be a top 10 NFL pocket passer. The dude represents the next evolution of the quarterback position in my opinion, just like Vince Young and Michael Vick before him. Its time to start nudging the Browns toward being team that is on the very cutting edge of offensive football.
um
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
alright…who picked take him in the 1st round FFS….gotta be some steelers fans weighing in here.
It would seem to me, that you feel threatened by the Eric Ghiaciuc acquisition.
Wanna bet Jaws is voting over and over?
by BrownDawg1409 on Apr 21, 2010 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Problem
I really don’t think Tebow will be there in R2. Hell the National Football Post has him going #9 BEFORE Clausen at #10. Even if that’s not realistic, with that can you really expect him to not go in R1?
I can’t find anyone that debunked the Wonderlic story other than the guy that scored a 22 on it.
Please Lord, Just one Browns Superbowl in my lifetime.......
Thats good to know, makes me like Tebow even more now.
by OSUMoneyball on Apr 21, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmm perhaps you shouldn’t use the term “Devil’s Advocate” when speaking of drafting God’s grandson.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Apr 21, 2010 10:09 PM EDT reply actions
Voted for the third option. Take him if Bradford, Clausen, and McCoy are gone.
But if all three are gone by our second pick, I say take someone else. If he’s there in the third, take him. Or if we happen to get a lower second-round pick by trading down in the first round, consider him there. Basically, take two higher-rated players first.
If we were going to be a Run First team, then get him.
If you love something, let it go. If it comes back to you, you own it. If it doesn’t, you don’t own it. And if it doesn’t, you’re an asshole. Just like you.
by Brownie's Year on Apr 21, 2010 10:29 PM EDT reply actions
That hair is awesome. His helmet doesn’t even ruin it. I bet you he goes to God’s hair stylist.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 10:38 PM EDT reply actions
where’s the picture of him with the “physically gifted fan?” the one he allegedly didn’t date or tap.
…I like that picture.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:02 PM EDT reply actions
Umm, yeah, because if you have your picture taken with a woman with large breasts that means you must have slept with her, right?
by Buckeye Brad on Apr 21, 2010 11:24 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s the general consensus.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Indeed.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
The whole thing was and is still pretty crazy. It amuses me how many different stories people can make up just over one picture. When it’s all said and done, it was just a harmless photo, and there’s nothing to be embarrassed about.
Quote by Erin Drewes, when she was posing for playboy after gaining notoriety by being photographed with Tebow.
"Smokescreen."
Dude. Are you really that close minded? Was it not sarcastic enough for you?
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not pissed at you or nothing, just putting the info out there so nobody is confused.
"Smokescreen."
We went over this before you came to DBN. Nobody is confused.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe it is just me, but if I was the starting QB at the University of Florida, I would be getting more ass than a toilet seat.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Tebow was absolutely horrible when facing top defenses this year. I believe against his best 4 opponents he went 2 TD’s – 4 INTs, and around 150 yards per contest. 4 TDs dont mean much against Cincinnati
by The Licensed Pessimist on Apr 21, 2010 11:03 PM EDT reply actions
and he was terrific against the best defenses in 2008. The difference was having no Harvin and no Louis Murphy. The Tennessee game (and Monte Kiffin’s great gameplan) exposed a bit of a weakness in the florida offense (outside pass receivers)
Nick Saban’s squad had a good gameplan and a lot of talent and it slowed the florida offense down.
"Smokescreen."
exposed a bit of a weakness in the florida offense
Um, everybody knew their weaknesses. It was an offense based on “Crap, Tebow doesn’t know how to read his progressions. Run damnit, run!”
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions
No, it is.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions
itWe should be asking Tebow this. I don’t understand what it has to do with me.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions
How can you decide if he can or cannot read a progression without knowing what one is yourself?
"Smokescreen."
who says I don’t?
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
And that still has nothing to do with this.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know if you do or don’t, so I’m asking. You claimed that he doesn’t know how to read a progression, so I’m asking if you even know what a progression is in order to judge if he can or cannot read one.
"Smokescreen."
You’re clearly just doing this to shift the conversation to something I may not know about instead of talking about how your man crush definitely doesn’t know it. You’re not being subtle about it either.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
your deflecting my question because you don’t know the answer. You can’t possibly say that Tebow doesn’t know how to do that without knowing at least a little bit about how it is done. You simply can’t judge it whatsoever. You either made up some bullshit because you heard it somewhere else or you know how progressions work. Which is it?
"Smokescreen."
Dude, you just described yourself bravo. I know what a progression is and I don’t need to explain it to you. I’ll save your boyfriend some embarrassment. Just drop it. Heaven forbid I made a joke about your BFF and you flip out. remember, you and Bross are the ones who make up things. Don’t go being a hypocrite on me now.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Think before you talk.
About anything.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 22, 2010 12:00 AM EDT up reply actions
No because you are being a jackass. Even the casual fan can see a QB in the pocket and not throwing the ball.
Everyone knew Florida’s offensive weakness, which was Tebow throwing the ball and throwing it wide, after making tough decisions about where to throw it.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Doesn’t mean he can’t identify MOFO or MOFC, man or zone and realize which side of the field had the appropriate “beater” Getting greedy and not taking every underneath route isn’t “inability to read progressions” necessarily.
"Smokescreen."
As a quarterback, reading a progression means going through the progression in game situations while DL are flying at you and the secondary is trying to confuse you.
If you can do it in the classroom and not on the field, you can’t read progressions but you can be Ken Dorsey.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Ok, so not only can Tebow not read progressions, but he can’t adjust his protections or make hot throws either.
And then you can blame it all on the line.
Did you watch Gruden when talking with McCoy about Drew Brees? Brees checked to a protection knowing that he would leave ATL’s best pass rusher untouched. Brees knew that the DE was dropping in to zone, and if he didn’t he had a hot throw and the ball was going to come out quick to an uncovered WR. If Tebow knows his OL isn’t going to get it done, he needs to take command of that offense and get the ball to someone who is open.
And if anyone besides you—because I know you love Tebow and nothing anyone says is ever going to change your mind—believes in the unflappable work ethic of Tebow being able to overcome all adversity:
Tebow must begin getting rid of the ball more quickly — something he said he was going to improve upon from past years, and really hasn’t.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Finally, somebody actually makes a good point and points out a little bit of a weakness in Tebow’s game.
That is absolutely right. One thing to remember is that it is tougher to read blitz and such down in the red zone, where Florida had most of its offensive problems last year. Their wideouts didn’t get open very quickly and Tebow didn’t always get his protection set properly.
In the play in question there really isn’t much you can do besides get a receiver to read hot and break early but nobody did and Tebow was basically sunk.
"Smokescreen."
Get the ball out to someone who was open, throw a ball into the stands or the dirt, take a sack.
All things Tebow could have done even after he saw the blitz coming.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
yeah he had a bad play. Threw off his back foot trying to throw it either to the corner our out of the endzone. Didn’t get enough air under it and ended up with a tipped ball. Shit happens.
"Smokescreen."
I’ll remember that next time a Browns QB throws an INT that goes 100+ for a TD.
Take the sack if the ball isn’t 20 yards into the stands. Live to fight another down or get your 3 points and go from there.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
You do know he’s saying the same thing I am right? You’re just agreeing now because you know you’d never beat Rufio in an argument about anything. Also, he’s a minion, which means he’s more powerful than you. This is the last thing I’m going to say but that’s the definition of a coward, kid.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 22, 2010 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
obviously…How many times has jaws done this involving Tebow? the idea is to shift the topic so it is questioning the validity of another’s argument. while I may make some dumb arguments at times, I almost never (if ever) use this tactic.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Did you watch the Gruden show? There he was, with 10 hitches before throwing blind right to the CB.
If he went through his progressions, he would have hit the underneath option, got 5 yards, and been done with it.
One play, I know.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
who gives a shit, please bring her anyway.
by Dawg Nuts on Apr 21, 2010 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
STFU.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Not his girlfriend. Not even the girl in the picture with him.
Jealous much?*
*Why else would it be a bad thing if that was his girlfriend?
by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 21, 2010 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m just gonna say it.
I love boobs.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
After looking at this picture jaws lost his Teboner.
Is replying to my own post bad DBN etiquette?
One picture is worth 128K words.
Not if you forgot something to put in the original that was corny but with a little hint of awesome.
…So you’re within those guidelines.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
My reaction – “Holy crap, she’s hot!”
Jaws’ reaction – “That’s not his girlfriend!”
Very interesting.
If you love something, let it go. If it comes back to you, you own it. If it doesn’t, you don’t own it. And if it doesn’t, you’re an asshole. Just like you.
by Brownie's Year on Apr 21, 2010 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think Jaw’s insulted because everyone confuses her for Jaws.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 21, 2010 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Wouldn’t you be mad too if there were pictures of the two of you all over the internet? People should know by now.
If you love something, let it go. If it comes back to you, you own it. If it doesn’t, you don’t own it. And if it doesn’t, you’re an asshole. Just like you.
by Brownie's Year on Apr 21, 2010 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I am quite disappointed that 17 people would draft Tebow in the first.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
/tip toes in on eggshells/
Beyond the talk of his ability to make it at QB, there’s almost no discussion on any potential impact of his religious beliefs & potential impact from that.
Is this considered off limits to media? Or simply less of an issue in the States?
/tightens tin hat. Hopes moderators come to rescue soonish)/
Go Seneca!
That makes my vote a “No Way” #4 but I think I’m seeing a red flag where there isn’t one.
Go Seneca!
People are concerned about it in the locker room, especially if the wonderlic story is true.
If there are grumpy old linemen who just want to do their jobs and are going through camp and they’re banged up and sore I don’t think they’ll want Tebow talking their ears off about religion.
I do think a lot of people view it as a positive character trait, too.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I’m afraid he’d use the Browns as a medium to shove Religion down people’s throats. No thank you.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 22, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
right. I don’t care what he believes and i’m sure his teammates won’t either. But I don’t want the cleveland browns to be a platform for anything like that.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Apr 22, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I sincerely doubt this is even possible, with any NFL team.
by Western Reserve on Apr 22, 2010 3:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Apr 22, 2010 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Okay, well, you better bunker down then. Seems a bit alarmist to me.
by Western Reserve on Apr 22, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
You’re exactly right. There is absolutely nothing wrong with Tebow promoting his religious beliefs on his own time, but there is no reason to think that his beliefs will negatively influence the Browns team. If Tebow wants to do missionary work in the offseason then I say great for him. I don’t really see what the big fuss is about this; plenty of athletes are openly religious and it doesn’t interfere with their team or their play on the field at all.
by Buckeye Brad on Apr 22, 2010 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Is the Wonderlic story true?
Because no other athlete does that, really.
Oh well, Colorado Springs will be happy he’s here.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I guess I’m not familiar with the Wonderlic story.
by Buckeye Brad on Apr 23, 2010 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions
McCoy described getting drafted by the Browns as part of “God’s plan.” Prepare to have a logo next year: the Cross.
by Western Reserve on Apr 24, 2010 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions
I do think a lot of people view it as a positive character trait, too.
Yeah I’m sure they do.
I’ll let this one lay.
Go Seneca!
by LondonBrown on Apr 22, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
If Tebow proves that he is a good player on the field, then people won’t care what he believes in off the field.
Kurt Warner is a Jesus freak and no one minds because he throws a crap load of TD’s. Ricky Williams believes in weed and no one cares because he can run the rock.
If a scrub back-up came in talking about the healing power of Jesus, I am pretty sure he would be told to shut up in a very adult manner.
Just like everything in the NFL, it is going to come down to can he produce on the field?
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Right, it’s all about production. Fans have immortalized plenty of jerks; they’d do the same for the (seemingly) good guy, too.
by Western Reserve on Apr 22, 2010 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions
The point I keep trying to make is, decide who you want at quarterback and pursue him. In other words don´t overqualify Tim Tebow so you can take him at an assumed bargain.
If you can´t imagine him as the guy for quite a while, you don´t deserve him.
You must overcome the rankings. The days where they laud you for getting them cheap are over. Entitlement costs honest appraisals.
#5. I don’t give a flying **** how hard he works. You know how many guys go to training camps every year trying as hard as anyone? Effort doesn’t mean anything if you aren’t ready to play. I’m not spending anything more than a late third on a guy whose admittedly massive talent is qualified by his equally massive mechanical flaws. That is, I don’t want a project QB on day 1. I don’t think that’s unfair.
Actively seeking inspiration for a new handle
You had a hard time writing about why we should draft Spiller, and then you come up with THIS mess?
Columbus til I die, Columbus til I die. I know I am, I swear I am, Columbus til I die!
"Turner, at midcourt...inside it, at the buzzer, GOT IT!!!!"
by Andrew Tolliver on Apr 22, 2010 8:55 AM EDT reply actions
Exactly. I didn’t even consider that the difficult DA article was going to be anyone other than The Chosen One.
You are reading my signature.
No kidding. What is the world coming to?
Columbus til I die, Columbus til I die. I know I am, I swear I am, Columbus til I die!
"Turner, at midcourt...inside it, at the buzzer, GOT IT!!!!"
by Andrew Tolliver on Apr 22, 2010 9:30 AM EDT up reply actions
I think wasting a first round pick on a RB is wasteful.
Go back to the ’08 draft.
The Titans selected Chris Johnson in the first round.
The Ravens selected Ray Rice in the second round.
Chris Johnson is the better RB, but by how much? Personally, I think Ray Rice is going to be a great RB for awhile.
The big difference was that the Ravens selected Joe Flacco in the first round.
The Titans used their second rounder on Jason Jones, a DT with 3 career starts.
RB’s can be found anywhere, first round picks cannot. Why waste a first round pick on something that can be found anywhere in the draft?
This is why I hate RB’s in the first round. That being said, I would be intrigued by CJ Spiller.
by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 22, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
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