Cleveland Browns Training Camp 2010: QB Preview, Part I (New Setting for Delhomme)
It's Week 1 of our training camp preview coverage for the Cleveland Browns. This week, the theme is "offensive attack," meaning we'll highlight the quarterback and running back positions. First, we start with the quarterback position.
A lot of things have changed at quarterback heading into this year's camp. First off, Brady Quinn and Derek Anderson, the two players who battled each other over the past two seasons, are no longer with the team. Quinn was traded to the Denver Broncos for a fullback, and Anderson signed with the Arizona Cardinals as a free agent.
If the Browns had not brought Mike Holmgren on board this offseason, we probably wouldn't have either Jake Delhomme or Seneca Wallace on the roster. As a starting quarterback, neither of these players would have much of a chance at starting on any other teams in the NFL. There was some initial disappointment from fans that we seemingly settled on a quarterback that no other teams wanted, but I think most fans have already started to "deal with it," understanding that we're not projected to be a prolific passing offense anyway.
1. JAKE DELHOMME - STARTING QUARTERBACK
Jake Delhomme (#17)
Height: 6-2
Weight: 215
Age: 35
Experience: 10 years
College: Louisiana-Laf.
Note: Lost his confidence last year, looking to rebound with Cleveland
I've always been a fan of Delhomme's. I remember the first game in which he saw his first real NFL action, and it came in a Week 1 game in relief of starting quarterback Rodney Peete during the 2003-2004 season. Down 14-0 at halftime, Delhomme started the second half and led the Carolina Panthers to a 24-23 victory, including the game-winning touchdown pass with 16 seconds on the clock. A recent Panthers FanPost here on Dawgs By Nature mentions how Delhomme has had quite a few fourth quarter comebacks. Although they've become far and few between over the past couple of seasons, the guy has shown that he can be a leader in the huddle. His teammates respond to him.
From 2004 until a few weeks into the 2007 season, Delhomme had a stretch where he threw 78 touchdowns to only 43 interceptions. That's nothing to sneeze at in the NFL. Three games into the 2007 season though, Delhomme suffered an elbow injury. He later opted for Tommy John surgery and did not play the rest of the season. In 2008, Delhomme came back from his injury fairly strong. His touchdown passes for the year were down, but I think that can be largely attributed to the fact that the team had begun relying on their running game to score touchdowns in the red zone. When the playoffs came though, Delhomme's downhill spiral in Carolina began.
In the Divisional round, Delhomme had one of the worst meltdowns in playoff history. He had six turnovers against the Arizona Cardinals -- 5 interceptions and 1 fumble. He had a few other passes that could have been picked off as well. There's such a thing as it not being your day, but this was beyond that -- Delhomme looked like he had no confidence, which was a surprise considering he did a fine job in the postseason a few years earlier when Carolina made the Super Bowl.
Last year, Delhomme never seemed to regain his confidence after the postseason meltdown. In 11 games, he threw 8 touchdowns and 18 interceptions, with a Browns-like accuracy of just 55.5%. The Panthers couldn't stay with Delhomme's lack of production for another year, so they released him. The teams interested in him were the Saints (as a backup) and Cleveland. It was an easy decision for Jake -- he went where he would be getting paid a lot of money, and on top of that he had quickly found another starting job. Not many quarterbacks get that opportunity after having the season he had a year ago.
When the signing first occurred, I wrote a piece highlighting some of the positives on signing Delhomme. With those positives in mind, let's take a quick look at Delhomme's best and worst attribute...
Worst Attribute: Lack of Confidence - As described above, this is the biggest issue with Delhomme. Over the past season (plus the one playoff game), Delhomme has been a headcase at the quarterback position. It's almost the same thing we saw with Derek Anderson last year -- he began thinking that the answer was to start slinging passes just for the sake of slinging them. He lost faith in his ability to make reads on the fly and adapt to what the defense was showing him.
Hopefully this is an attribute that can be wiped clean by coming to not only a new team, but a new conference. Expectations are low for him in Cleveland, whereas expectations were high for the Panthers. Perhaps not having that weight on his shoulders has allowed him to clear his head. Also, it has to help his confidence that amidst Holmgren's massive revamping of the Browns, he believed that Delhomme was the right player to lead the team this season. If Delhomme absorbs the confidence that Holmgren has shown in him, then maybe he can return to his roots and be a decent quarterback again.
Best Attribute: Veteran Leadership - Delhomme has led the Panthers to playoff seasons, and he's done so without having a strong receiver besides Steve Smith. Whatever situation he has been placed in though, again excluding last season, he has always been able to get the players around him to look up to him as their leader. He has seen a lot more NFL action than Anderson and Quinn did and should have more knowledge, and therefore leeway to make some of those "veteran" adjustments on the fly.
I think he also has a better understanding that he needs to approach certain receivers differently when throwing them the ball -- he might have enjoyed the plays where he could lob a ball in the vicinity of Steve Smith, but he'll understand that until some of the Browns' receivers come along, he'll have to tone his game down and reduce himself to making safer throws that suit the individual abilities of players -- no more situations where Anderson rockets a fastball to Robert Royal or Lawrence Vickers.
Various Concerns / Comments - Even though Delhomme has had some Pro Bowl caliber years statistically, he's really never been more than an average to an above average quarterback. As the Browns continue to rebuild, that's really all we need this year -- someone who can manage the ship; someone who can get the ball in the vicinity of our young receivers so they can gain some experience; someone who has tasted victory and would love nothing more than to prove all of his doubters wrong. I don't think Delhomme will be as bad as he was last year, and I'm not even sure he'll last the whole season as the starting quarterback. If his throws are kept to a minimum though and he continues to buy into his new role in Cleveland, then I can live with him being a one- to two-year holdover.
Some of our receivers have reportedly looked better this year in minicamp already, particularly Brian Robiskie. I have to believe that part of that has to do with Delhomme. If someone knows how to deliver a football in your vicinity, apparently it's easier to catch. In camp, it's important that Delhomme gets as many reps with the first team. There's no use in doing what we did last year -- forcing rookie receivers to learn the playing styles of two erratic quarterbacks, and then expect them to build in-game chemistry with both of them. I think the most important one-two punch in the passing game will inevitably be between Delhomme and Ben Watson due to their experience.
Job Security: A
Player Quality: C-
Final Roster Odds: 100%
For the record, I rated Quinn a B last year, and Anderson a B- in my training camp previews. I've learned from that mistake. My ratings this year will be tougher on players, especially if they need to prove themselves, which is why Delhomme received a C-.
2. SENECA WALLACE - BACKUP QUARTERBACK / WILDCAT OPTION
Seneca Wallace (#6)Height: 5-11
Weight: 205
Age: 29
Experience: 5 years
College: Iowa State
Note: Follows Mike Holmgren from Seattle; Wildcat threat at RB/WR
I've always been intrigued by the thought of Wallace being a full-time quarterback in the NFL. In the past, I wondered, "what team would give Wallace a shot, because Seattle seems sold on Hasselbeck?" Little did I ever realize that the Browns would be the team to give Wallace that shot.
For all intents and purposes, Delhomme is the starting quarterback. Mangini didn't officially label him as the starter, but this isn't like last year where we legitimately don't have a clue who "the guy" will be. Wallace was brought in to be the fail-safe key for Mangini should Delhomme's ineffectiveness continue. Holmgren knows there's a chance that Delhomme is simply done as an NFL quarterback. If that's the case, he'll have the same backup from his former team ready to come in and run a system that he's at least vaguely familiar with.
Worst Attribute: Long Dropbacks + Pressure - Although he's never been a full-time starter, Wallace has enough starting experience under his belt to be evaluated. In watching him, I've always noticed the extra-long dropbacks he takes from under center, especially if he's running a playaction fake. In Seattle, a porous offensive line would force him to be worrying about evading a pass-rushing defender because too much time had been wasted on his dropback, and he doesn't have a clear view of where his receivers are on the field. Reports have indicated that he's actually more effective when throwing on the run than when he stays in the pocket, but that's more so on rollouts in which he chooses to roll out on his own. Maybe this wouldn't be as big of an issue with the blocking on the Browns' offensive line, but then again the right side of our line isn't something to brag about.
Best Attribute: Utility Role - This is a funny one, because I'm basically saying that Wallace's best attribute is that he's capable of throwing a football. He might not have enough assets to be a full-time starting quarterback, but it looks like the Browns plan on getting creative with him and taking his quarterback abilities and mixing them into the offense. It is an extension of the Wildcat, because Wallace can pass, run, and catch the ball. It's almost as if the reps that Wallace has taken at receiver the past few years with the Seahawks was a set-up for his eventual pairing with Joshua Cribbs in Cleveland.
Various Concerns / Comments - How the utilization of Wallace unfolds throughout training camp will be one of the top stories of camp. Will the Browns run plays with both he and Delhomme in the game? Will there be a lot of situations where Delhomme is running the offense and then Wallace enters the game for a play when we're within five yards of the end zone? If the front office thinks that Delhomme and Wallace are equally effective near the goal line in terms of passing, then why not take advantage of Wallace's extra threat of using his legs? I just hope that all of this "hype" surrounding the utilization of Wallace doesn't turn out to be some "reverse psychology gag for opponents to gameplan harder for us." That wouldn't make any sense to me -- if we're not going to use formations that include Wallace during a game, then why waste valuable practice time on a decoy?
Player Quality: D+ (does not include Wildcat abilities)
Final Roster Odds: 99%
Part II of our training camp quarterback preview will feature rookie Colt McCoy and the only quarterback returning from last year's roster, Brett Ratliff.
It's not really fair to try to compare Quinn/Anderson last year to Delhomme/Wallace this year. In terms of comparing current NFL starters, neither tandem would draw praise from the media. The major difference though is that this year's tandem has a more defined purpose: we're not looking for a long-term starter between either of these guys. We're hoping that we have a veteran leader, and a backup who is serviceable and won't force Delhomme to be looking over his shoulder. If it doesn't work out, then it doesn't work out -- at least it's not like we invested the near-future of our franchise on either guy. That investment will come in a year or two. Until then, all we can do is hope for the best and cheer for whoever is under center.
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Assuming we don´t assume Colt McCoy won´t play:
a) Do you want Kerry Meier, Darrell Hackney and/or Isaiah Stanbeck to totally potentiate your possiblities for a creative offensive backfield according to mooncamping?
b) Do you also want the scatterbacks? A smattering of the lightning bug mighty mite running backs to create the type of chaos in the offensive backfield that would make mooncamping proud, such as Devin Moore and Quentin Griffin?
c) Would you like to see Delhomme holding the clip-board, because you think you´re not alone in believing that he was never that good and cost the Panthers dearly, as mooncamping also suspects it?
Kerry Meier is on another team and hasn’t played QB since high school.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
and i have a feeling he has a suspension looming

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Hi, I’m Chris Hansen. Please take a seat.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 21, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Can you explain the possibility/likelihood that JD doe not start the entire season? Are you saying he will be replaced due to performance or change in offensive priorities?
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jun 20, 2010 10:50 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
We’d be wrong to think that Delhomme won’t make any mistakes this season. As long as he is not forcing the team into horrible situations every game (i.e. the running game gets all the way down to the red zone, and then Jake throws an interception every time, or if he keeps trying to force the ball into double coverage when he’s told to stay safe), then he should start the entire season.
You have to consider his past struggles, injuries, and the chance that we’ll have a poor record when thinking about Delhomme starting later in the season. I know there hasn’t been a lot of buzz about Colt McCoy getting a shot this year, but if we’re in the cellar of the division with a few weeks left in the season, maybe we begin the transition to where Delhomme accepts a mentoring role behind Colt.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s refreshing to see that McCoy is not getting any attention; let him develop without any needless pressure. On the other hand I think that if we are so deep in the cellar to allow Colt a few starts at the end of the season, then the season is probably a failure. We need Jake to provide stability to the offense for this team to develop and grow. Maybe he accelerates the development and we reach the next phase more quickly? Otherwise, I hope we are not at that point when we can throw a couple wasted games to the Kid.
"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin
by Spidey on Jun 20, 2010 6:07 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Seneca Wallace (#6)
Height: 5-11
Weight: 205
Age: 29
Experience: 2 years
College: Iowa State
Note: Follows Mike Holmgren from Seattle; Wildcat threat at RB/WR
Typo.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
Thanks, fixed. I used Brady Quinn’s mini-grey-profile-box from last year as the template and neglected to change that.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
these are some scattershot observations about Delhomme:
LY the Panthers had all 11 starters back & were in the 2nd year of the zone blocking scheme. The players noted that OC Jeff Davidson (yup the one that used to be here…CAR has a lot of ex-CLE assistants) was reinstalling plays from 2007 instead of going over new stuff.
the problem for Delhomme was he faced the absolute worst team in Wk 1. PHI was jacked cuz it was the 1st regular season game since DC Jim Johnson passed away due to cancer. They put 2 Wks of gameplanning into figuring out blitzes for CAR. If you go to NFL.com you can see the highlights of the game & how they spread out CAR’s OL and killed the A-gaps. That game just had a snowball effect on him. He lost his LT then RT midway thru the season within 3? games of each other.
Bob Papa who does the Giants games/NFL games on Thursday Nites/Sirius NFL radio has stated that Delhomme wears his mood on his sleeve. You can walk into the lockerroom & the players know what type of day he’s going to have on the field within 10 min.
CAR’s WR’s outside of Steve Smith arent that much better than CLE’s but CLE’s are younger & more coachable. Also CAR doesnt rely on its TE’s much. Yeah Rosario & King had 25 or so rec’s each but Fox uses them as blockers mainly.He has since Wesley Walls retired.
sorry i know this is bouncing around but i’m still half asleep
sorry i know this is bouncing around but i’m still half asleep
No worries, thanks for the insight. It’s always better to hear some more specific observations and how they could translate to Cleveland.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
your user name is appropriate apparently.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 20, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I love these pro-con/grade writeups. Thanks Chris.
I’m excited to see this new "Great Lakes", "North Coast", whatever you guys want to call it, offense that’s being implemented. Speed kills and we’ll be the ones on a spree. Well, when Jake’s not on the field. And when he is, our line will protect him. He should do fine.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 20, 2010 12:13 PM EDT reply actions
I usually have the Pro/Con things for just the quarterbacks and sometimes the running backs, but after that I usually just do a general write-up on each player (as I’m sure you’ve seen in the past). The reason for the change is that when it comes to a position like LB, I usually find myself repeating the same Pros/Cons for multiple players, and it feels like I’m just repeating myself.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions
True, but you do give grades and roster odds for each player. It’s very insightful. Especially for the new players.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 20, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Holmgren’s massive revamping of the Browns, he believed that Delhomme was the right player to lead the team this season.
Actually Holmgren went after David Carr first
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 12:37 PM EDT reply actions
He pursued Carr a few years ago in hopes that he could be Seattle’s backup. While we showed an interest in Carr this year, I don’t know if they necessarily means Holmgren settled for Delhomme. There were other options out there — such as McNabb — but Holmgren went a different direction.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
There’s little reason to believe we aggressively pursued Carr if you look at the contract we gave Jake compared to what Carr got to be a backup.
I would rather have Quinn as a backup over Carr. I’m sure you would too.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 20, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
If I were Holmgren, I would have asked Minnesota what they would want for Sage Rosenfels
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 12:38 PM EDT reply actions
probably a lot, since Brett can’t play forever.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 20, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Sage is the backup to Tarvaris though and he is on the wrong side of 30 (I think).
I bet he could’ve been had for the same price as Campbell.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Part 2? I never get any respect…..
by BrettRatliffisBeast on Jun 20, 2010 2:35 PM EDT reply actions 8 recs
Wow, you’re freakin hilarious Malor
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Heh…little do you know who it really is.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Are you gonna tell us?
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions

Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Its u.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions
do you actually have that power?
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Yea, he revealed that I was BQiB
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions
My guess is that it’s one of us well known veterans. Golan *cough cough
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 21, 2010 1:53 AM EDT up reply actions
LIAR!!!!
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 21, 2010 1:56 AM EDT up reply actions
I’ll bet it was you, and you accused golanbatrac as a cover!
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 21, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Or maybe you because you just jumped in to put blame on someone else!
Oh, the username-gate scandal…
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 21, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
haha
And for the record, it’s not me.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 21, 2010 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s Kwoog.
"Spartans never die Jorge. They're just missing in action."
by SpecialBrownie on Jun 21, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
isn’t he licensed pessimist now?
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 21, 2010 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions
thats right, how silly of me!
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions
wishful guess: mooncamping
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 20, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Oxymoron? How can you be a great leader when you lack confidence? If you don’t have confidence in yourself – the team won’t either. How likeable you are or how aware you are in the huddle won’t change that fact. If Jake’s confidence does not come back – the leadership is a non-plus.
Now if you want a QB that exhibits leadership – Colt McCoy has tremendous leadership capabilities.
I agree, looking at the best/worst attribute for Delhomme in combination doesn’t make a whole lot of sense — how can a guy whose confidence is shot end up being a good veteran leader? I guess it’s best to think of each attribute as worst [potential] attribute and best [potential] attribute. He can’t hold them both at the same time, because one negates the other.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
College leadership doesn’t always carry over. You have to earn respect all over again. Just sayin.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 4:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Colt McCoy has to do something in the NFL before he can start leading his teammates.
by Buckeye Brad on Jun 20, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
exactly what i was getting at.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions
JaMarcus Russell has the capability to be the best QB in the NFL.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
We are talking about leadership though, an intangible quality. I would say Jamarcus Russell has lower leadership capability than McCoy.
It is still capability vs ability. Capable of being a leader ≠ being a good leader.
I agree that McCoy is capable of becoming a leader, but that doesn’t really mean much. He still isn’t one yet.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I don’t fully agree with this statement. He certainly needs to do something in the NFL before he can gain the full respect of his teammates, but simply by virtue of stepping onto the field in the QB position he will become their leader. It’s essentially positional leadership.
The players will look to the guy in that slot to provide leadership and most will probably automatically grant him some semblance of respect simply because he is occupying the leadership position. The question then becomes whether he will be able to build on that initial respect with solid play or squander it by “slinging passes just for the sake of slinging them” or piddling in panic.
simply by virtue of stepping onto the field in the QB position he will become their leader.
Just like Quinn?
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I think the key part is that he wears his emotions sometimes on his sleeve. I have heard that he is a fiery leader and a good leader, and the fire would make sense with him wearing his emotions on his sleeve. Even if a guy is a good leader but wears emotions on his sleeve, after a stretch like delhomme had, he can lose confidence.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
I’m just sayin, but Fathers Day is the worst time to have your 16th birthday.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 4:58 PM EDT reply actions
For you.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
At least I got a new Camaro! Unfortuneatly it was a matchbox car that my parents gave to me to rub in the fact that I am not getting a real one.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions
getting a real one. car
I dont want it to sound like I was expecting a new car
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 20, 2010 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Father’s Day fell on your B-day? That hella sucks.
Happy Birthday TRSS.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jun 21, 2010 2:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Thanks
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 21, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
Don’t sleep on Jake!!!!! Experience……when’s the last time we had a qb with that….
by Big Daddy Hickman on Jun 20, 2010 7:08 PM EDT reply actions
Trent Dilfer, Ty Detmer, Jeff Garcia.
by Bernie19Kosar on Jun 21, 2010 12:47 AM EDT up reply actions
to be fair, they only let Detmer play two games.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 21, 2010 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions
My statement was a little too broad apparently…..I should have said years of experience running the same squad….under the same coach…Dilfer won a super bowl yes….but with a top defense……….and he was with them for one year……detmer…..really…..experience doing what……and Garcia……San Francisco….hmmmmmm…..perhaps….a west coast wonder……..But Im talking about the experience of having a Team follow your lead…….Jake’s had that…..and hopefully he gets us going in the right direction…..and if he takes the high road here…he’ll had this thing off to McCoy in due time and we’ll have us an up and coming franchise again…..
by Big Daddy Hickman on Jun 21, 2010 9:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Garcia also saw some success in Philly, even after he played for us.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
and in tampa
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
while i mostly agree with your post, an ellipses doesn’t end a sentence, a period does.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Sure, but half of what BDH wrote weren’t sentences.
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jun 22, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions
this is true. and he wasn’t even using ellipses, those are made of only three dots…
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I am just enough of a language geek to point out the existence of the four dot ellipsis. Even typing that makes me hang my head in shame, however.
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jun 22, 2010 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Actually, I think the fourth dot is a period, and not technically part of the ellipsis.
When ending a sentence with an ellipsis:
…. = correct
…! = correct
…? = correct
… = incorrect
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
hmmm, this seems to make sense.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
I ramble and rant my points…..I didn’t know there was a requirement on here to use complete sentences…..my bad. Anyways, Go Browns!!!!! When does camp begin?
by Big Daddy Hickman on Jun 22, 2010 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I find myself doing the ellipses at times too. It’s not a requirement to use complete sentences, but you have to imagine that seeing a post with so many …… is going to draw a bit of discussion, lol.
Anyways, Go Browns!!!!! When does camp begin?
See, you already improved by the end of that post with the shift away from ellipses ;)
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 22, 2010 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I liked it, it helped build excitement and suspense. It almost forces you to keep reading to find out what’s going to happen next.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
by Villeslgr on Jun 23, 2010 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I didn’t mean to sound snarky or anything, but just look at that post.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 23, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Grammar police……Capt. notthatnoise is on his 12 hour shift and very very cranky……..
Good thing we both hate the Steelers…………buddy.
by Big Daddy Hickman on Jun 23, 2010 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s just that seeing a string of random thoughts like that, with no sentences or proper punctuation, makes it very difficult to read and follow what you’re saying. There is a reason we have grammar and punctuation rules, and it’s because it makes your words easier to understand when being read. Writing like that makes you seem unintelligent (and I’m not saying that your are, just that it appears that way). This isn’t like your typical message board full of idiots and internet shorthand; we like to have intelligent discussions here and the way you write goes a long way towards displaying that high level of discussion.
by Buckeye Brad on Jun 24, 2010 11:43 AM EDT up reply actions
I am an open-minded, positive thinking kind of guy. I chose to speak my thoughts in a manner that may not suit the typical reader. I never thought I’d spur this much reaction regarding my grammar manners. I have strong feelings and know a lot about Jake since I live in North Carolina. I love this site and I love all Browns fans so I won’t go the route of making assumptions about people who I have no clue about.
by Big Daddy Hickman on Jun 25, 2010 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, I’m just telling you that when you’re new here (as far as posting) and people don’t know anything about you then people are going to make assumptions based on what you post and how you post it. We get a lot of newbies here who act like idiots (like those on cleveland.com and espn.com and other places like that) so I’m just letting you know that comments like yours might make people think you’re one of those people. Of course, if you keep posting here with intelligent thoughts then we will respect your opinion, but until then we don’t have much to go by.
You can get upset about people making assumptions of others that we don’t know, but everyone does it all the time (including you, I’m sure). When you’re walking down the street and someone approaches you, you’re going to judge them on how they’re dressed and how they speak and many other factors. That’s just a simple fact of life. I wasn’t trying to be mean, I was just letting you know that if your comments are posted in rambling thoughts with no punctuation (like so many other message boards idiots) then people are going to think you’re like one of those people, at least until you show them otherwise. Just like you would make assumptions if someone approached you on a street wearing ragged clothing, slurring his speech and badly in need of a shower.
But I hope you continue to post here and share your thoughts, and you will see that most people here are very willing to have intelligent discussion about the Browns with you. It just makes your comments easier to read and understand if you use proper grammar and punctuation.
by Buckeye Brad on Jun 25, 2010 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions
No harm, BDH. Just kicking around the language a bit I think. Can’t wait for more Browns action myself!
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jun 24, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Right you are, but since the last period is visually indistinguishable from the ellipsis, it’s often referred to as the four dot ellipsis. As I recall the only technically valid use of this is in quoted material to indicate the omission of sentences, but I could be wrong.
Myself, I tend to ignore that and use the four dot ellipsis all the time in electronic media as some kind of mental shorthand for the conversation continuing on. Language evolves….
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jun 24, 2010 10:51 AM EDT up reply actions
indeed it does…..
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 24, 2010 12:55 PM EDT up reply actions
at this point after DA/BQ, I would be pleased with seasons like Dilfer and Garcia had…QB ratings above 75. And they did it with maybe even worse supporting casts than this year. If Jake can have a similar season I would be mildly pleased.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Garcia was money in a WCO, and he was all wrong in the vertical passing game/power running game (that we lacked) that we tried to put him in. We tried to fit a square peg in a round hole.
Also, our lines were horrible during all of those QBs. Our defenses weren’t great either.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I think the rating for Wallace might be a little harsh at D+. I’m not saying he’s a great QB, but I would consider him an above average backup QB. He’s certainly better than whoever that jackass is that the Colts have backing up Manning (I’m still bitter about that final game from 2007).
Jim Sorgi probably would’ve earned an F. Wallace’s rating in this case would be if he was a starting QB. And, if I think about other starters (i.e. perhaps Peyton Manning as an A, Matt Ryan as a B-, Mark Sanchez as a C, etc), then it’s hard to rank the never-been-full-time starter Wallace any higher.
Then again, if I were rating his ability as a backup quarterback, which certainly might be more appropriate, perhaps I’d start thinking along the C+ range. Either way, these ratings are very arbitrary anyway.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 20, 2010 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Manning not an A+?
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jun 21, 2010 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Manning an A+ for sure.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jun 21, 2010 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions
We won out the last quarter of our season, we should be trying to build on this, not lamenting how bad we’re going to be this year, or saying its ok to pay old QBs who throw 18 ints 7 million/yr. I guess it may have been ok to bring in JD to mentor, but why pay him starters money when nobody else wanted him? And at the same time not having money to reward your up and coming stars.
by HenryDawg on Jun 21, 2010 6:02 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
We definitely have the money to sign our younger guys to long term deals. None of them deserve Haynesworth-type money, so it shouldn’t be a problem. I do not believe we are that close to the cap.
The reason they haven’t gotten long-term deals is because the FO needs to show that not everyone is Cribbs and gets a new contract before they are due to hit FA. Also, they had no reason to throw money at those players because state of the CBA. RFAs almost never go anywhere because their teams hold all the cards (and they aren’t allowed to walk). Why throw big signing bonuses at these guys now, only to have them sit out a year of their contract due to a lockout? Then have to go after them to recoup money that we’ve already paid them (to not play)? That’s not smart. The entire future of the league is in the air, committing to 5 non-star players for a long time might not be the best decision.
Also, we had to pay Delhomme starter money because we didn’t want him to take backup money to potentially help New Orleans repeat as Super Bowl champs. This offense is not great, this team is not great, Delhomme has no ties to Cleveland, something had to entice him. It isn’t your money and most of it is being paid to him in this uncapped year so it isn’t preventing us from picking up someone else. Who cares?
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
I would think the draw for JD would be getting the chance to start. This is indicative of the problems: we’re worrying about what we have to do to get Jake here? No, this is a storied franchise, even if down as of late and there are plenty of players who want to play here. Its been a long time since his Super Bowl run and while I get all the CBA issues, if I was on the Browns and an up and comer like Harrison or Roth I would be a little annoyed that this guys who hasn’t done anything in awhile is getting paid, while our future is getting the heavy hand
by HenryDawg on Jun 22, 2010 10:36 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
there are plenty of players who want to play here
if we pay them more than anyone else.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jun 22, 2010 11:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Players still go to the money in the NFL. If you are really just hoping for guys that want to play here and will take large pay cuts to play here, I don’t think you are going to get many FAs. Savage found a bunch of guys who did want to come home to Cleveland, but they were getting a lot of money to do so (i.e. Bentley). Jake still could have gone somewhere with the chance of getting a super bowl ring. We couldn’t offer that.
Harrison and Roth both still have questions they need to answer. For Harrison; can he continue to produce over an entire season? Of course no one has given him the chance to do so yet, but it’s a legit concern. He’s been injured in the past, were those injuries part of a part of a pattern or anomalies?
For Roth; he potentially faked an injury to get out of Miami where he never produced at the rate he did once he got here. Not only that, but he didn’t like the situation in Miami under Parcells, someone whom Mangini and Holmgren both admire. He clearly wants money and if we sign him now he might want to get paid like he is an 11 sack/year monster. He has never gotten more than 5 in a full season.
Holmgren and Heckert just want to get up close and personal looks at these guys for a while longer before they decide if they want to offer them and for how much. We can still negotiate during the year with these players and no other team can.
I don’t think anyone is angry about us signing free agents while they don’t get long term deals. They are just angry about not getting long term deals period, and there really isn’t much they can do about it.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
by rufio on Jun 22, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I think there are many players on the team the FO look at and think, really fellas, tell us again what you have done? Which I believe is a good thing because it will keep us from paying guys big time money when they haven’t proven themselves to be big time players.
We are building a roster with quality young talent and putting ourselves in a position to continut to fill our holes with more young quality talent in the future. I don’t see this FO reaching to pay guys simply because they have a good “Browns” year. (translation For a Browns player he produced pretty well. Yeah lets give him a lot of money because everyone else sucks.) Not anymore fellas, if you want money you have to be a good NFL player.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

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