Cleveland Browns Training Camp 2010: Linebacker Preview, where average is celebrated
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 15, 2010 11:55 PM EDT
202 comments
I've been mostly disappointed with our linebackers for years and years. In fact, I'd venture to say that we haven't had a single above average linebacker play an entire season with us since 2001. I suppose you could convince me that Andra Davis was above average for a year or two. D'Qwell Jackson? Well, more on him later, but I'm in the camp that he has been declared underrated so much amongst fans and writers that he is actually overrated.
I don't look for this streak of mediocrity to stop in 2010. The unit is full of past-their-prime vets that were never all that great to start and marginal young players that NFL teams have often overlooked. We lack a top tier prospect or a star in his prime and that has frustrated me for years at the LB position (outside of Kamerion Wimbley's first 2 seasons). Let's see what we got.
1. Starting Inside Linebacker: D'Qwell Jackson
Experience: 4 seasons
2009: 6 games, 59 tackles, 1 Forced Fumble, hurt for most of the season
That forced fumble is quite notable. Even though Jackson has been often mentioned as one of the Browns best players the last 3 years and even though he has been our #1 inside linebacker for about 50 games and made over 400 tackles that was his FIRST forced fumble of his ENTIRE career.
That is my critique of Jackson in a nut shell. He just doesn't make any plays. He racks up tackles, but that's it. Only 3 sacks and 4 INTs in his career. And just one forced fumble. That simply isn't good enough. He doesn't make enough plays to be considered anything but average. And all those tackles (he lead the league in 08)? Well a lot are assists and most are after a solid gain. Even when he would hit someone at the line of scrimmage it seemed like the offensive player could push forward for 3 or 4 yards.
This all might be a bit harsh. Jackson finds the ball carrier, has good instincts and is still pretty darn young. Though the shoulder injury is a little concerning and doesn't make me think he is going to start hitting people any harder.
Job Security (as a starter): B
Player Quality: C
Final Roster odds: 99%
==========================================================================================
2. Starting Linebacker: Scott Fujita
Experience: 8 seasons
2009: 11 games, 43 tackles, 1 sack, 2 FF
These top 4 or 5 LBs are difficult to rank in any meaningful order. First, many of them seem interchangeable as far as ILB or OLB, which is odd considering the more defined roles of each position in a 3-4. Also, none of them are real standouts. In the case of Scott Fujita, his strengths seem to mirror a lot of what we already had: smartness, toughness, experience, leadership. Though Fujita may have an edge in the latter two categories as a central figure in the Super Bowl Champion New Orleans Saints defense over the last several seasons.
I've seen projections for Fujita to play both inside and outside this year. I see him as making the most sense as an inside player. I'm not sure how much production we can expect from Fujita next year, but he seemed like a good pickup. Fujita plays big and is versatile. He has rushed the passer with some success, has called the defensive plays and knows multiple systems. Is that enough to compensate for declining athleticism and production? Probably enough to be a starter as long as he is healthy for the Browns.
Job Security (as a starter):B+
Player Quality: C+
Final Roster odds: 100%
==========================================================================================
3. Starting Linebacker: David Bowens
Experience: 11 seasons
2009: 16 games, 72 tackles, 5.5 sacks, 1 INT Started multiple games inside and outside.
David Bowens was the most surprising and impressive of all Browns defenders last year. He started the first 6 games as an outside linebacker, showing his ability to blitz and set an edge as a 3-4 OLB. Then, after injuries to Eric Barton and D'Qwell Jackson, he became a steadying force in the middle of the defense, the unquestioned prideful leader of a front seven that improved as the season went on.
Bowens is one of the bigger linebackers on the team. He hasn't missed a game in 6 years and has exhibited the same versatility, savvy and leadership that Mangini seems to demand out of all his linebackers. All that said, last season was pretty much his ceiling. So let's not get too carried away. I'm guessing he starts the season outside again.
Job Security (as a starter): B+
Player Quality: C+
Final roster odds: 98%
==========================================================================================
4. Possible starting or backup inside Linebacker: Eric Barton
Experience: 11 seasons
2009: 8 games, 52 tackles, potentially career-ending injury
Eric Barton may be the key to figuring this linebacker puzzle going in to 2010. If he is recovered from the neck injury that kept him out of the second half of last season and has limited him in off season drills, he instantly becomes a favorite to start inside, either pushing Jackson to the bench or Fujita to the outside. On the other hand, if his health is in question or if Barton looks like he's lost a step, he could find himself out of a job completely: thanks to the depth behind him.
Barton is another guy with a versatile background, having some success in different cities for different coaches and in different systems. And while he was solid for the first half of last year, he had a lot of the same problems as D'Qwell Jackson: not making enough impact plays. And when both of your ILBs have that lack in play-making production, well, you get a bad team. The only reason he is "ranked" this high is because 1.) he is a Mangini guy and 2.) he has some pretty darn good seasons in his 11 year career. But in the NFL, reputation can only get you so far.
Job Security (as a starter): D+
Player Quality: C
Final roster odds: 60%
==========================================================================================
Starting or backup outside linebacker: Matt Roth
Experience: 5 seasons
2009: Started season with Miami as backup, finished season with Browns as #1 pass rusher (4 sacks in 6 games).
Guess what? Matt Roth is a solid veteran with some flashes of success, but is not and likely will never be a star in the NFL. It does seam clear, however, that if Matt Roth is on the field, he will have a defined a clear role: get to the QB. He seems to have a knack for rushing the passer, racking up 4 sacks in the last few weeks of the season last year. In 2008, Roth got consistent playing time and had 5 sacks.But he couldn't find the field too often in Miami last year and the Browns took advantage.
Roth gets off the ball very quickly, seemingly knowing the snap count on numerous plays. He doesn't have the speed to get to the edge most of the time, but he is big enough and a good enough overall athlete that once he has that step, he can get through a LT. I don't remember him much against the run and perhaps that is what has limited his playing time in the past. That is something to watch for in camp. I'd guess he comes off the bench as a common 3rd down rusher, but it is possible he wins a job in camp.
Job Security (as a regular contributor on D): B-
Player Quality: C+
Final roster odds: 85%
==========================================================================================
6. Potential starting Outside linebacker: Chris Gocong
Experience: 3 seasons
2009: 15 games, 35 tackles, 1 sack
I know almost nothing about Gocong. Apparently, he was drafted as an OLB with big time pass rush potential. But in three seasons with the Eagles, he has had just 4 sacks and seemingly less and less impact every year. Tom Heckert obviously is familiar with him, drafting the Cal Poly product in the early 3rd round in 2007. This is another guy (along with Bowens, Fujita, and Trusnik) that is projected as both an inside and outside guy. He is big at 265 and apparently has improved against the run. Reports are that he shined in off season workouts and drills.
Job Security (as a defensive contributor): C+
Player Quality: C-
Final roster odds: 60%
==========================================================================================
7. Depth linebacker/special teams: Jason Trusnik
Experience: 3 seasons
2009: Came over mid season from Jets, started for first time in his career
Trusnik has made the most out of his big frame and hustle, earning roster spots and special teams praise out of Ohio Northern for 2.5 years in New York. Then he was traded to the Browns, where he became a starting linebacker, playing both inside and out and managed not to embarass himself. In fact, he could find himself into the rotation again, if there are injuries or disappointments in front of him. At worst, he is a good special teams player.
Job Security (as defensive contributor): D
Player Quality: D+
Final roster odds: 60%
==========================================================================================
8. Linebacker depth/Special teams: Kaluka Maiava
Experience: 1 season
2009: Mostly special teams, 16 games, 45 tackles, 2.5 sacks
Maiava is a legit prospect with something of a higher ceiling than maybe any of the guys in front of him. As a rookie, he took advantage of injuries in front of him to earn playing time and show flashes of why the Browns drafted him despite not starting for his college team. At under 230 lbs, Maiava is small, but he has good instincts and plays fast. I rank him this low, only because he has very little chance of starting. But I am all but certain that he makes the team and contributes because of his high ceiling.
Job Security (as defensive contributor): B+
Player Quality: C
Final roster odds: 80%
The Rest:
David Veikune- I guess he's looked good in off season drills and workouts. Making the rare college DE to pro ILB transition. If he couldn't find the field last year, I don't know how he does this year with a deeper LB unit and (hopefully) better luck with injuries.
Blake Costanzo- Another special teams ace. He could make the team just for that, but will have to earn it with so much more versatile talent in front of him.
Marcus Benard- He had almost as good a late season run as a pass rusher as Matt Roth. He had 3.5 sacks during those last few weeks. He will compete for a roster spot, but he will have to show he can be at least competent in rush defense or dropping into coverage.
Titus Brown- I got nothin.
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I love the review on Titus Brown.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 16, 2010 12:43 AM EDT reply actions
I thought that was a quote from Brown
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
by Villeslgr on Jul 16, 2010 1:54 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree completely with the rating of the LB corp. There are no game changers and this franchise hasn’t even had the hint of one since its rebirth. I still think they should have taken Sergio Kindle. I know that the state of the secondary has been atrocious, but Kindle would’ve been a nice step up in talent. I hope that LB is a priority in next year’s draft.
Colt McCoy... the cure for Cleveland's Eric Berry man-crush.
We probably passed on Kindle because of the distinct possibility that he will require microfracture surgery. I do think that he would have been selected in the first round otherwise.
It couldn’t be any worse than the knee problems that both Ward and Hardesty had.
Colt McCoy... the cure for Cleveland's Eric Berry man-crush.
key word being “had.” their problems are in the past. Kindle still has a problem.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 16, 2010 9:58 AM EDT up reply actions
They were also not our first round pick.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 16, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Kindle wasn’t a first round pick.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 16, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Eh, don’t care.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 16, 2010 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I disproved what you were saying and you just say you don’t care?
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 16, 2010 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Homophobe.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 17, 2010 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s funny
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 18, 2010 5:22 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t care if you think it’s funny; it’s not appropriate for this blog.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 18, 2010 6:25 PM EDT up reply actions
It’s happened like 6 times and wasn’t even started by me.
Why try to bite my head off now?
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I never said it was started by you. I simply said “let’s stop doing this” — how is that biting your head off? Why can’t you just say “OK” and move on instead of always acting like a victim of injustice?
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 19, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
That’s fair.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 5:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Kindle wasn’t a first round pick.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 16, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t say this franchise has been completely bereft of linebackers. Jamir Miller was pretty great for one season but other than him, yeah, linebacker has been pretty bleak. I could never understand how DQ Jackson got so much pub for being under rated when he’s never stood out during a game.
Just a few thoughts:
-If you could tack about 50 pounds on these three guys: Scott Fujita, Matt Roth, Jason Trusnik. You would have an interesting alternate defensive line.
-Vaikune, oddly enough, because he´s fairly large and beastly, is the only one in the group that has the speed and agility to be an old school outside linebacker.
-D´Quell Jackson is an adequate place holder type player. Exceptional, no. Gets the job done, yes.
-Reminder: With the star power assembled at the linebacker position at USC in 2008, that is: Brian Cushing, Rey Maualuga and Clay Matthews. We chose Kaluka Maiava, the fifth wheel at USC. We still don´t know, is he merely adequate or talented for the position?
-Of the choices presented, I would have to go with Eric Barton and Kaluka Maiava. The old school inside linebacker has good leverage from below with a good motor and a hard head. short and stout lends itself to that job description. Kaluka and Eric are the closest thing to that description, that we have at the moment, minus certain invitees to training camp, that obviously have not gotten the chance to make a name for themselves. Eryk Anders, Alabama? Jon Dempsey, Louisville? Daniel Howard, Texas Tech? Brandon McLaughlin, Maine?
-Here are a few inside linebacker prospects from last year, that fit the bill, and I deemed valuable: Maurice Crum Jr., Notre Dame; Worrell Williams, California; Greg Trent, Washington State; Jake Flaherty, Syracuse; Mike Rivera, Kansas; Morris Wooten, Arizona State; Solomon Elimimian, Hawaii; John Bacon, Oregon;
-And here is a few prospects from this year´s draft, that you may want to keep tabs on, even if they had invitations from other teams: Reggie Carter, UCLA; Patrick Stoudamire, Western Illinois; Reed Williams, West Virginia; Kion Wilson, South Florida; Andre Revels, Cincinnati; Arthur Moats, James Madison; Mike McLaughlin, Boston College; Joe Mortensen, Kansas; Terry Riley, LSU; Rennie Curran, Georgia; Patrick Benoist, Vanderbilt; Bear Woods, Troy; Will Patterson, Indiana; Andre Sexton, Oklahoma State; Jeff Smart, Colorado;
-Here is a few outside chances from years prior: Bo Ruud, Nebraska; Nate Harris, Louisville; Darnell Ellerbe, Georgia; Demorrio Williams, Nebraska; Ernie Sims, Florida State; Phillip Hunt, Houston; Buster Davis, Florida State;
…just to name a few.
If you want to question my prototype, you may also want to question these Pro Bowler´s careers:
Mike Singletary
Zach Thomas
Ray Lewis
So all we need is Ray Lewis, Zach Thomas and Mike Singletary?
That’s it?
by Bernie19Kosar on Jul 16, 2010 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Is that all?
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 16, 2010 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions
I"m pretty sure his point was that he made his LB selections by using the above players as a prototype for their build and not their productivity. Obviously we would be better if we had players of that caliber.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
No, but you may need:
OLB Demorrio Williams
ILB Morris Wooten
ILB Mike Rivera
OLB Reed Williams
f.e.
That´s why I provided the list, so that you may make your own evaluations, of players that have at least the same build as those three.
No, but you may need:
OLBDemorrio WilliamsSomeone who won’t die when J.T. pancakes them in practice.
ILBMorris WootenSomeone with an exotic name.
ILBMike RiveraSomeone with a murder record
OLBReed WilliamsSomeone who got suspended for using performance enhancing substances.
by BrownDawg1409 on Jul 17, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
The bigger the bug the messier it squashes. If their skin was made of chitin, compact is tougher. Pancake Jason Trusnik and then pancake Erinie Sims, and then tell me who´s more hurt.
by mooncamping on Jul 18, 2010 6:07 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is Trusnick more hurt?
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 19, 2010 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Our run in 2002 was partly due to a strong LB core that year, which was promptly gutted the next year.
Yea, I was going to make note of this year as our only above average linebacking year from a play on the field standpoint. Rudd, Holmes, and Davis were quite solid.
Frankly, part of the reason I don’t share Ryan’s concern is that I don’t believe a star linebacker is necessary to form a solid linebacking unit. Plenty of some of the best teams in the NFL last year had strong linebackers without a superstar quality name. The issue I think for Browns fans is that we are often comparing ourselves to the Ravens and Steelers which might have the best pass rushing OLB’s in the league each year over the past several. While it would be nice to have a superstar pass rusher, the Browns still managed to be 8th in the NFL in sacks last year which came mostly from the LB position. Our rush defense still needs improvement.
This.
Sorry Ryan.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 16, 2010 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you’re correct in regards to ILB, but you’re dead wrong with OLB. Every top team has great OLB or DE’s. The Colts, Ravens, Minnesota, Packers, Saints; yes we got to the QB last year, but its not good to have to send 7 or 8 players just to get a sack. That’s why the secondary got torched last and that’s why opposing QB’s like Stafford made our defense look foolish.
Being a good team mean to be a balanced team. And obviously this team isn’t balanced without players who can get to the QB by using skill, rather than gimmicks. The one aspect of the defense that determines how well the west of the defense plays is the pass rush.
by The Licensed Pessimist on Jul 16, 2010 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Part of the reason our secondary got torched is that we had 3 of 4 below average players back there. The Detroit game we got torched because of a few huge plays which really didn’t have much to do with sending extra pass rushers. Brodney Pool got juked out of his pants on Calvin Johnson’s TD. Atrocious tackling allowed for the huge RB pass TD, again not we weren’t sending extra rushers on that play.
You guys are right to a degree. You can´t arrive at a great player without a comparison.
How it´s played gets you who plays it. How who plays it gets you who plays it better. How who plays it better plays it gets you into the realm of who plays it the very best.
…was a racist.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jul 18, 2010 7:18 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
because wikipedia is INFALLIBLE!
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
And cops are secretly given steroids.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 19, 2010 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions
And Walt Disney’s head is stored below Magic Mountain under the orders not to be brought back til the Jews are gone.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 19, 2010 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
As long as it’s not the result of some False Douche-cotomy Stanford Hyperbole Googling Experiment.
by RelapsingDawgCatcher on Jul 19, 2010 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Now this is true. Players are still subject to do exactly what the commentator smears onto the screen with the Madden pen. There is still a propensity to only start players that were deemed draftable in fantasy drafts all around the country.
Being on the roster in Madden football also raises the odds for them to play.
by mooncamping on Jul 20, 2010 10:02 AM EDT up reply actions
Tell that to Travis Wilson and Syndric Steptoe. Do you really think every scout in the NFL gets it’s info from EASports?
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 20, 2010 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m not sure what is more amusing — the fact that he called them “Madden pens” or the fact that he actually thinks that commentators drawing on the screen affects what players do on the field.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe he watches all games on rewind after taping them ant that’s why it looks this way to him, probably listening for subliminal messages in his favorite foil hat.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 20, 2010 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions
After recently watching Memento, the idea of watching a football game backwards is intriguing to me.
Great movie.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 21, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Aww come on Moon you walked right in to that one, don’t worry I’m still a fan of yours.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 21, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions
And a nazi.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I just don’t think we even have the giid linebackers. I agree that you don’t need to be great at LB, but we struggle to reaxh average.
I didn’t attempt to put the LB importance in context, just that compared to the league- and our division- it is unimpressive on an individual level. And that is the point of these previews.
No need to be sorry. SB
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 16, 2010 8:18 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying we are good at linebacker even, I would probably characterize it the same way you did, as average. It’s also pretty clear that Baltimore and Pittsburgh are far better than us at the position, but I would argue those 2 teams have the best linebacking corps in the league. My main position is that with a strengthened secondary (fingers crossed) our defensive coordinator will be able to get the most out of a bunch of serviceable players and get to the QB like we did last year without fear that our secondary won’t be able to pull their weight.
Fair enough. I would say it is fair to view our team against the others in our division. In the NFL, your fate is so tied to your rank within the division. If we’re way behind Pitt and Balt in certain areas, it becomes a big part of the reason we are far away from being competitive for the playoffs.
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 17, 2010 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Spot on Analysis
As I read each description and rating of each linebacker I could not agree more. I think this unit puts more pressure on the rest of the defense than any other unit. That is saying a lot since the defensive secondary WAS below average and the defensive line was nothing to crow about. I think the lack of strong play by this unit really has taken its toll. I also agree with Dorn, that the rush defense needs improvement. Until this unit can shut down the run the defensive unit as a whole will continue to struggle.
I wonder what was the intentions with drafting Veikune last year. Is he being moved to ILB because he sucks as a OLB or what that his intended transition? His drafting always came off as a “McDaniel” move and is disappointing.
by The Licensed Pessimist on Jul 16, 2010 10:43 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
I think their intention was for him to play both, but i think they overestimated how much information he could handle as a rookie coming out of hawaii, where defense isn’t exactly a priority.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 16, 2010 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
He wanted to have another Teddy Bruschi (sp?).
Mangini thinks his versatility is more useful at ILB.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 16, 2010 12:29 PM EDT up reply actions
From what I’ve heard, Manginin saw a resemblence (or something) to Bruschi with Veikune. Joe Thomas willing, that’s what he’ll turn out to be.
by BrownDawg1409 on Jul 17, 2010 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I am convinced that both Veikune and Robiskie were Kokinis calls, and Mangini was never that hot on either of them.
by TheDriveStillHurts on Jul 16, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions
i don’t know about robiskie, he seems like a classic “mangini guy.”
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 16, 2010 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions
So does Veikune.
Kokinis was probably taking a dump during the second round or something
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 16, 2010 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m pretty sure he was allowed to pick out the curtains in his office.
Then again his secretary probably had veto power.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Why do you think that? I think they scream mangini; “character” guys rather than physically gifted talents.
We can’t say Kokinis did nothing while he was on the team which is why he got fired, then try to use him as the scapegoat in order to alleviate the blame from the rest of the management.
by The Licensed Pessimist on Jul 16, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
The reason I think that is because both of them got no playing time even though it would seem that if Mangini had been sold on them to draft them so highly, he would play them. Who knows, however. It’s all speculation.
by TheDriveStillHurts on Jul 18, 2010 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions
just because you draft a guy highly doesn’t mean he ends up being the player you thought. he might have severely misjudged how “NFL-ready” they were.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 19, 2010 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I’m nearly 100% certain that Veikune is a Mangini pick. Mangini’s eyes lit up every time he talked about him last offseason. The already mentioned Bruschi comparison is straight from Mangini.
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jul 16, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Then why didn’t he ever play him?
by TheDriveStillHurts on Jul 18, 2010 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions
so because a guy did not play, he must not have been wanted by the coach? this is pure speculation. Veikune is switching from pass rushing DE in a 4-3, to an ILB in a 3-4. A similar comparison would be to Tedy Bruschi. Bruschi was a more talented (IMO) and more prolific college player…but he only started one game in his first 2 seasons and was not a consistent starter until his 4th season.
Because he was making the transition, when he got time, he got it some as just a pass rushing specialist. Bruschi was not an every down LB until maybe his 4th season and mostly a ST and pass rush Specialist his first one.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
this is pure speculation
Uh, yeah. That’s exactly what I said above, “it’s all speculation.” Apparently, you can read bross. Congrats.
by TheDriveStillHurts on Jul 19, 2010 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Uh, yeah. That’s exactly what I said above,
uhh…that was
Then why didn’t he ever play him?
which was what I was directly responding to…not the comment about how you are just speculating
Apparently, you can read bross. Congrats.
even though that was sarcastic, actually yes I can. Thank you…I am sorry however you got so insulted that I didn’t read every single comment you made on here that you had to result to sarcastic ad hominems instead of avoiding the point that a player with more talent than Veikune, making the same transition, ALSO didn’t see a ton of PT.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
generally speaking if you are going to respond to a set of comments, you should read the comments above it.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 19, 2010 9:25 AM EDT up reply actions
a) it was technically in a different set of comments (if you keep pressing the up button, you will not find it) but it was a similar subject.
b) I read every one of the comments except that one…my bad. I just pressed Z through it without reading.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
bross, it was all in the same thread originating from the same comment. You’re really grasping for straws here.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 19, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
well…like I said…I am sorry I pressed z through one comment and decided not to read…
Yes, the original comment is the same, but the progression of comments leading up to it is significantly different…But whatever. I guess after I said ‘my bad’ for pressing Z through a comment, you had to come back and make a snarky remark.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Yes, you said “my bad” but only after giving a list of excuses. Just like I knew you were going to respond to my comment again to give more excuses. You really need to learn when to just let things die.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 19, 2010 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
THIS
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 20, 2010 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions
You really need to learn when to just let things die.
it was pretty much dead until you came along…
Yes, you said "my bad" but only after giving a list of excuses.
those list of excuses were all pretty much the same one…that I DIDN’T READ IT. GOD…Fine…for every other thread I will comment on, I will read EVERY SINGLE COMMENT…would that make ya happy or would you find another reason to criticize me?
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
You seem to have an obsessive compulsion with always getting the last word, please, please, please, prove us all wrong and stop being so damned argumentative.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 20, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Honestly that’s kind of BS, because most of the time people end their communications with Bross with some sort of insult trying to bait him in to coming back for the last word.
Also it’s kind of hard to tell Bross not to have the last word and to tell him not to respond when someone is always responding to his last statement. If Bross needs to have the last word so do a lot of other people.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Honestly after what was just wrote by Brad and to get yet another response from Bross is BS. That is exactly what we are all taking about. You know what NCF meant. Maybe a bad choice of words, but Bross does not let things go when they should be.
A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright
Bross is bross, but it’s bs to think people don’t get off on baiting him and that this is a site full of people letting things go.
Also, BB responded to Bross directly, then NCF added the very necessary THIS.
Bross responded back directly to BB. Yet, for some reason NCF still felt the need to comment on Bross’s comment.
It’s BS to call Bross out for trying to have the last word when in that very thread NCF did that exact thing.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
People are very frustrated with bross because of his behavior. We’ve asked him multiple times to stop doing it, but he hasn’t. And it’s very annoying for others to read, so people are allowed to voice their frustration. I don’t see anything wrong with someone voicing their agreement with my comment. He’s just letting bross know that other people feel that way, too.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I get that…there are many here who like the last word. I wasn’t trying to come across as a dick to you either. I just get tired of seeing those posts over and over and over again. It shows either an inability to learn when to stop or a complete disregard for when to stop. Either way is annoying.
I have nothing personal against bross…I love his stats and his complete miss of jokes sometimes, but this constant remark thing is getting annoying.
A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright
That’s simply false. Nobody is “baiting” him to respond. He just doesn’t know how to let things go, and he feels the need to always have the last word even when people ask him to stop. When someone asks him to stop, he can just stop — he doesn’t have to respond with a list of reasons why he didn’t stop.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
prove us all wrong and stop being so damned argumentative.
Just like I knew you were going to respond to my comment again to give more excuses.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
You’re really grasping for straws here.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
None of those comments have anything to do with what I said above. Nice try, though.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
yes they do, they’re both baiting.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 20, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No, I wan’t baiting him at all. I just wanted him to shut up and let this whole conversation end. Obviously we’re way past that point now.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Nobody is "baiting" him to respond.
I might be wrong but this is what you said above and to me those seem like an example of that.
I’ll drop it because i don’t think anything is truly going to change one way or another, but it does get kind of old watching certain attacks go unchecked.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
How exactly was it dead until I came along? I responded only a couple hours after your comment, so how was the conversation dead? Stop making things up just to deflect criticism off of yourself.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Is this not having the last word.
Nevermind I see your two questions, so obviously you’re expecting or seeking a response. Or I guess they were just rhetorical?
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Is this not having the last word?
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Damn you Dorn. I want to but I want.
Ok maybe just this one time.
Word.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
what? Want? How about won’t, though I guess I did so maybe will?
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
this was extremely confusing
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 20, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions
He made an accusation about me, and I was asking him to explain himself. I don’t see what’s wrong with that. I’m not going to let someone just say whatever they want about me with no factual basis.
I know you have a problem with me so you’re looking for something to argue about, but this is really going overboard.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
He made an accusation about me, and I was asking him to explain himself. I don’t see what’s wrong with that. I’m not going to let someone just say whatever they want about me with no factual basis.
is this not exactly how bross feels?
also, stop playing the victim. nobody has it out for you, you’re just resorting to that so you can feel like people don’t actually have legitimate points.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 20, 2010 3:22 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Well, it’s not “people”, it’s just one person. And he’s done this many times before to me so it certainly seems like it’s personal.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
By my count this would be the 3rd time, and I stand by comments and they were and are not some vendetta against you.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
ha…thats a good one…when I first came on here and went a bit nuts, i was suggested by many more veteran commenters, including possibly you (I don’t remember exactly) to not take stuff personal…I really don’t much…maybe you could use that same advice i was given.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
You made me laugh out loud on that bross. I really do enjoy your posts on here (albeit very, very long sometimes), but please when things like the above that started this whole thing starts, just say…
“Sorry, missed that comment”
And nothing more. That is all you need to say. Nothing more, nothing less. While I do agree many bait you into things on here, this was not an example of this. I think many here just get upset with you responding to something that 90% of us would have ended with yet another paragraph. Again, we enjoy your posts on here, truly, but try your best to learn when to just say forget it.
A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright
A bit nuts?
Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.
by golanbatrac on Jul 23, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions
You’ve accused me of this same thing, just not as recently. Nobody has any reason to have a personal beef with you.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 20, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
and you totally sidestepped my other point. you just reprimanded bross for defending himself too much, then tried to excuse yourself from doing the same.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 20, 2010 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions
is this not exactly how bross feels?
If you prick Bross does he not bleed? If you tickle Bross do he not laugh? If you poison Bross does he not die? And if you wrong Bross shall he not revenge?
by johnnyphoenix on Jul 21, 2010 4:11 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
If you prick Bross does he not bleed?
yes, but it is black like orc blood.
If you tickle Bross do he not laugh?
…until I cry
If you poison Bross does he not die?
…Not Iocane powder because over the last few years I have built up an immunity to it…
And if you wrong Bross shall he not revenge?
…don’t get me started on the man who killed my father…
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
My name is Inigo Montoya, joo keel my father, prepare to die!
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 21, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
did you get the third one then?
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
It’s always in both glasses.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 22, 2010 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions
No, that’s exactly what happens to Bross a lot of the time. It’s acceptable to give Bross all kinds of shit and no one says anything about it except to tell him to shut up and take it (i give him crap myself).
If people want to give him shit, you included, then don’t get mad at him when he defends himself, because you know he’s going to do so with long posts.
Also I don’t have a problem with you and I’m not looking for anything to argue about. If anyone else would have said the BS you said above I would call them out as well, as I did to NCF. It’s nothing personal, it’s the internet, but it’s BS to try and pretend that all of this is Bross’s fault.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
by Villeslgr on Jul 20, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Nobody is giving him shit and telling him to “shut up and take it.” This all started when he didn’t read a comment above when he responded to someone — which NTN himself pointed out — and instead of just saying that he missed it and moving on, he made some lame excuses like he always does. He didn’t need to say that it was technically in a different set of comments, because they were all part of the same converstation from the same original thread. That’s all I was saying — he needs to stop making these dumb excuses and arguing technicalities every time someone calls him on something. He does this frequently and it’s very annoying, to me and many others. Then, of course, he has to respond to my comment again and make the same excuses. I don’t see what is wrong with just asking him to stop doing that. I’ve tried to say this in a nice way to him many times, but he still does it.
And I don’t know what “this” is supposedly all bross’ fault, so I’m not sure how to respond to that. I’m not blaming him for things he’s not responsible for, just telling him to stop coming back with lame excuses every time someone shows him that he’s wrong.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions
and instead of just saying that he missed it and moving on, he made some lame excuses like he always does
He didn’t need to say that it was technically in a different set of comments,
you are really trying to pick and choose what to read of my own comment to denegrade me. From the beginning pretty much I said oh, I didn’t read that comment…But you decided to focus on this part of the comment and say I am making outlandish excuses when in reality, you chose to ignore the part which was a legitimate point…a point you said I SHOULD have made.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Listen, bross, I’m sorry that this conversation deteriorated to this point. That certainly wasn’t my intention. I was just trying to get a point across to you and didn’t intend to have a huge discussion with mulitple people.
I’m sorry if you think I’m picking on you and that is certainly not the case. You’re a very valuable member to have on this blog, and you’ve improved quite a bit from when you first joined. I appreciate your efforts. But there are still times when many people here get frustrated with your comments and I’m just trying to show you how you can avoid those situations. You take comments way too literally sometimes, like when people are obviously joking or exaggerating and you give a 5-paragraph response that wasn’t necessary. And you can’t just ignore comments or let things die when it’s prudent. Certainly, you’re not the only one who does these things at times — and I’m not trying to say that I’m perfect — but you seem to do them more than most people, which is why so many people get frustrated with you.
I’ve tried to nicely give you suggestions many times in the past, and so have other people on here. And you’ve taken many of them, as I said above, but you need to do a little more. Also, please stop claiming that everyone is picking on you because that’s just not true. Don’t say that everyone says crap to you and you ignore it but then when you say something then I get on your case (as you said above) because you know that’s just not true. Or, at least, you should know that. You’re not a victim of harassment here — you get the responses that you deserve based on your comments. If you want that to stop, then please adjust your behavior accordingly. When many people are telling you that you’re being annoying then maybe you should listen instead of claiming that we’re all ganging up on you.
With that being said, I hope that this is the end of this whole discussion. I hope you take suggestions from me and others to heart, and I will try to be less hostile with my suggestions in the future. Let’s all move on.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 11:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You’re not a victim of harassment here — you get the responses that you deserve based on your comments.
I thought I tried to say that it was partially brought on by my comments…maybe I didn’t above, but I admit a lot of what is thrown at me, I bring on myself…I did not at all mean to make myself out to be this victim of harassment…
…However, I agree with a lot of this and I appreciate this. I agree i still have some things to work on and when I get called out, I do make a mental note and try to remember that note when posting…I just don’t have a very organized brain…its like a fridge with a ton of sticky notes on it. I appreciate what you do say here and I will take to heart what you say about the improvements and what I have to work on.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Perfectly stated…we enjoy your contributions Bross, we just get frustrated with some of your responses that really doesn’t need to be. While Ville is right, some people do antagonize you, this was not an example of that.
That said, lets move forward, but keep that in the back of your mind. I am by no means saying let someone trash talk you and just sit there, but many times you don’t need a response brother.
A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright
I get shit thrown at me all the time on here, and by this point, I have learned to not care that much. However, I am the jerk once i take one swing back.
Its like that archetypal jerk, dirty cop, or other authority figure (not saying anything bad about cops) in movies. He will beat suspects senseless but they use their arms to block an attack and its assaulting an officer.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
You are totally one man against the world. Just taking blow after blow and being accused for nothing. How dare they!
YOU’RE LIKE BATMAN ZOMG!
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 20, 2010 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think I am one man against the world…but I do take my fair share of flak here. Sometimes I will admit it is warranted, but sometimes it does seem like people automatically take the other’s side without really looking things through.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Hey! This is my argument against BB.
Find your own!
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 20, 2010 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, seriously. I can only pick on one person at a time.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 11:14 PM EDT up reply actions
its too overwhelming to pick on multiple people…way too much effort for the internet.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Out of everyone on this board I believe I have defended Bross the most, but when he’s wrong he’s wrong and he’s the last to admit it. I have nothing against him but when someone is full of crap I am going to call them on it. And yes my comment may have been written the wrong way but my point is not BS and you know it. By the way, nice baiting yourself calling my comment BS in three different comments of your own.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 20, 2010 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not worried about being accused of baiting so you telling me i’m baiting you is not an issue. I wasn’t trying to avoid baiting you I was telling you I felt that was BS.
If you say your comment was written the wrong way that’s fine. It just came across as baiting Bross and then complaining when he responds.
If that’s not your intention I apologize.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
It’s cool /manhug
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 21, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess after I said ‘my bad’ for pressing Z through a comment,
What does pressing ‘Z’ do? OH SHI———-
by johnnyphoenix on Jul 21, 2010 4:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Trusnik Final roster odds 99% for ST.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jul 17, 2010 11:44 AM EDT reply actions
I guess. You can only keep so many of these types though, and if he doesn’t earn a spot in the LB rotation, he will be competing with ST aces that are as good as him, like Costanzo and guys with higher upside, like Veikune.
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 17, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you’re too harsh on Trusnik.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 17, 2010 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions
how so, he was one of the last men on the roster for the Jets for two seasons, and played for one of the more depleted units in football for half a season last year. He was undrafted out of a DIII school.
I think he is a good depth option that will probably make the team, but you can’t possibly tell me that he has a job locked up 99%. I just don’t see it.
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 17, 2010 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
For ST, yes because I think he’s proven himself. When a tender is put on you from a NFL franchise, you’re worth at least more than ST value to that franchise. He was put into a starting position as an UDFA from a DIII school, as a former Jet who was teetering off the roster and did fairly well, which is more than you can ask from a player that’s had to work his way up like that. Is he starter material? No. But is he good depth and does he at least have the ability to be a ST ace? Yes.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 17, 2010 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
I think he is a good depth option that will probably make the team,
But is he good depth and does he at least have the ability to be a ST ace? Yes.
I think you guys are arguing pretty much the same thing now…except that maybe you feel he will be on the team because of ST ability…and it doesn’t sound like RK is saying if he doesn’t make the LB rotation, he is off the team…He just doesn’t agree with his spot being pretty much guaranteed.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
For ST, yes because I think he’s proven himself.
This is the thing I don’t get. He didn’t even play half the games his first two seasons. He isn’t as good at Costanzo as a ST ace. Would it surprise you if he had a so-so camp, players like Costanzo and Benard did better, and he was cut? It shouldn’t.
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
I do agree with SB that the fact that he was given a tender is a pretty clear indication of how the staff views him. I would be stunned if he didn’t make the roster.
This is a decent point, and one that I have overlooked in these previews: contract status. I don’t know that it changes my outlook on Trusnik very much (that he probably will make the team, but not a sure thing), but it is something that works, though slightly, in his favor.
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 18, 2010 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I do agree with you on Costanzo being the better special teams player, and if Trusnick is likely just linebacker depth, he really isn’t valuable enough to warrant the tender.
I agree, but there are so many question marks right now with our Linebackers, that giving him a tender like that was wise.
Our 2 starting guys on inside (DQ and Barton) including the player who RK ranked as our best LB got injured early in the year so there has to be some question as to the level of play they will now bring. Barton, and Bowens (who started a lot for us last year) are both getting up in age and are both around 33. We have 2 LBs (Fujita and Gocong) who do not have a defined role yet on the D and have never played in a 3-4 before…plus then we don’t know if Matt roth can put up those kinds of numbers again.
There were so many questions at LB that it makes sense to give him that sort of tender…however, if everyone ends up working out perfectly (which IMO is a bit of a long shot) ahead of him, then maybe he might not make the team.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
I am pretty sure his contract is guaranteed this year in light of the tender. Although there is no salary cap, I’d still be pretty surprised to see us paying a guy close to $2 million to be cut.
by TheDriveStillHurts on Jul 18, 2010 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Fair enough, DD. He’s not that bad though. I think he stays on.
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
by Brownie's Year on Jul 17, 2010 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Off-Beat Note:
Inception is an incredible movie! If you were thinking about seeing the film, do so as soon as you get the chance. It’s worth your time and the price of a ticket.
I would recommend this movie to anyone who enjoys movies. (Over the age of 12, not due to violence, but rather it’s complexity.)
We made a Pluto article!! In his Sunday notes column today, he mentions that Jackson has forced only one fumble in his career and gives credit to DBN for that information. That’s awesome! I had no clue that Pluto was reading our site — we’d better be on our best behavior now.
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 18, 2010 9:40 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
woo hoo!
fka "DaytonDogg". Now a contributor to SBN's Dawgs By Nature. www.dawgsbynature.com
by Ryan Kelsey on Jul 18, 2010 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I knew he was aware of the site, but it’s very cool to see him mention DBN in his column.
Does anyone know if the full-length column that Pluto writes is published in the Plain Dealer? I haven’t been getting the Plain Dealer anymore since I can read almost everything online, but if someone knows if the DBN mention made the print copy, I’d probably go out and get one for a keepsake.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jul 18, 2010 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions
i hope so.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 19, 2010 9:26 AM EDT up reply actions
He only would if he’s a masochist.
Art Modell gives me a hard one
by gahnki on Jul 23, 2010 12:51 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well, don’t I feel like a jackass.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
You and Ryan have now had your articles noticed by AP/ public writers. (Even though yours was seen for the wrong reason)
Kudos.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I was hoping that ESPN read Bernie’s post about Russell and then published an article “Browns legend Bernie Kosar thinks he can mentor Jamarcus Russell.”
AWESOME.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 19, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
To me it just looks like a cluster"" of average-to-meh linebackers.
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 19, 2010 12:52 AM EDT reply actions
(Before entering thread)
Yay, 40 new comments!
(Clicks posts and reads through)
Crap, they all revolve around getting the last word.
Back on topic, I think we’re going to keep a lot of linebackers, but I’d like to see Maiava, Veikune, and Benard all make the team. In order for that to happen, someone like Barton or Trusnik is going to have to get the boot, and I’d lean toward that being Barton.
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
Obviously you must be new to this game.
Word.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
Barton has some serious back problems, I don’t see him making it either.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 20, 2010 8:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I thought neck problems
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 21, 2010 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Chris, why do you always need to have the last word? Do you think you run this blog or something?
by Buckeye Brad on Jul 20, 2010 11:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Dawgs By Nature - Covering the Cleveland Browns on SB Nation.
by Chris Pokorny on Jul 20, 2010 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I am so full of hate for family guy.
I hate the steelers the way a mother loves a child.
by notthatnoise on Jul 21, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Family Guy’s amazing
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 21, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Family guy get’s old fast.
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 21, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree mostly…especially the newer episodes. They just replayed on TV stewie kills lois/ lois kills stewie…that one was great.
I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
i only watch it occasionally, but stewie seems like the best part of the show; i also really dig the Cleveland Show.
I love how the Seth Macfarlane universe intertwines.
I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.
LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.
by SpecialBrownie on Jul 21, 2010 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Peter kills Stewie, “It’s just been revoked.” “Actually he didn’t really set you up for that line.” “Ok, I’ll have what she’s having.” “That’s….. better?”
For the love of Joe Thomas.....
by North Coast Flea on Jul 22, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
That joke you just told was amazing
"Young men, I have no doubt that you're gonna do well today. But I have 1 favor to ask of you... SAVE JIMMY JOHNSON'S ASS FOR ME!" Lou Holtz
by TheRealSlimShady on Jul 21, 2010 10:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Family Guy is terrible. It’s like 4-chan on TV.
I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.
by notthatnoise on Jul 23, 2010 1:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Consequences will never be the same.
Because I backtraced it.
They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best
About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback
I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?
by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT
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