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Delhomme Reportedly a Game-Time Decision Against Chiefs

Cleveland Browns quarterback Jake Delhomme did not practice Wednesday as he tries to recover from an ankle injury he suffered this past Sunday against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. Backup Seneca Wallace took reps with the first team on Wednesday in his place.

According to ESPN, head coach Eric Mangini will make a game-time decision as to which quarterback will start. I don't think fans should read too much in to this. This isn't a performance issue, but rather Mangini keeping his options open should Delhomme wake up Sunday and say, "it doesn't feel ready." Mangini noted that Delhomme's ankle already feels a little better than before:

Star-divide

"I'd say that he's better. He's sore," Mangini said. "In terms of how long he will be out, he's a pretty tough guy. I'd say it's day to day."

If Mangini does have to turn to Wallace though, he is confident in what the veteran backup can bring to the table:

"[Wallace] can run anything we game plan for," Mangini said. "You have the game plan and the quarterback picks out his favorite things and if he goes in, his priority sheet comes out. You want it to be a collaborative process."

In other news, LB D'Qwell Jackson could start practicing again on Friday, but might not be ready to play in a game until Week 3. The Browns also released two players from the practice squad -- DB DeAngelo Smith and RB Andre Anderson. I thought that the recently released Clifton Geathers (cut by Miami) might take one of those spots, but it doesn't sound like that'll be the case.

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As a Chiefs fan...

who should we hope starts for the Browns… Im almost more scared of Wallace b/c hes good on his feet

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 15, 2010 4:48 PM EDT reply actions  

They will cut your toes off and whip you with a wet noodle over here if you use the subject line.

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 15, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

May I ask why?

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 15, 2010 5:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

They say its annoying and distracting.

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 15, 2010 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is. And thanks for setting him straight.

It’s hard to say much about Wallace. We’ve seen some good performance in preseason and some mediocre. It’s hard to get a solid read. He doesn’t have the command that Jake has. And we have not seen much of the wildcat/cyclone to know everything up their sleeves. It would be interesting since most plays will have an extra WR and an extra QB.

One difference will be that the gadget play will not be a “one-shot” effort. What we have seen is a quick substitution of Wallace for Delhomme for a single play. I think keeping them on the field in successive plays will allow them to get into a flow and not feel they need to break something big on every play.

"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin

by Spidey on Sep 15, 2010 6:17 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

All im saying is, every other SBnation board I’ve EVER been on somehow gets by with the subject line and the world doesn’t implode.

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 15, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

neither is Arrowhead Pride.

you should check it out sometime

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 15, 2010 8:31 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

AP is the second best blog on SBnation, just behind RollBamaRoll and just ahead of BloodyElbow.

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 16, 2010 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is all wrong.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

reality is harsh to the feet of shadows

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 16, 2010 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Rec

DBN

AP is not either

Nice reply

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

agreed

its a football blog not the New York times…

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 15, 2010 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

so because it is a ‘blog’ about sports, its pretentious of us to not want annoying, distracting formatting? it is just as annoying to some as when someone types LIKE THIS. For some, it is just an eyesore and makes things harder to read. it doesn’t make them at all the new york times, it just means they have some sort of standards about formatting and like it that way.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

no one is claiming that it would be terrible to have subject lines. we just think it makes the site much less readable and doesn’t serve a purpose.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

also, nobody said a word about it in the other thread. we typically don’t make it a big deal for people who are just posting here for a short time. It wouldn’t be an issue at all if you hadn’t brought it up.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

exactly…he brought it up and is making a fuss about it. however, no one cares THAT much to even come close to fitting his hyperbole. the most anyone does is kindly point out how we prefer not to use the subject line.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Nevermind didn’t realize that was directed at him.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 8:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

DAMN
I missed the point.
I did do this on the SB Nation Mocking the draft Board

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Feels good doesn’t it?

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 15, 2010 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

When I remember :)
It is fun to talk to Fans like me

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

This whole comment section was hijacked by stupidity. Congratulations on those of you who felt the need to point out that he used the subject line.

by pl4tinum on Sep 16, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

the person who pointed it out was criticizing the fact that we don’t use it. The people on this blog that actually don’t like the subject line never said anything.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

exactly. 1 person hijacked it.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Don’t let actual facts get in the way of his point next time please.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 16, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Please go back and read the comments again.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 1:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Most of us haven’t seen Wallace much outside of his Seattle days, but I would imagine you would rather see Wallace.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 15, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought Seneca played at Iowa State

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah I saw him play.
Most of AP saw him play

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

in case this wasn’t a joke, Wallace has been with the seahawks his entire career.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

No in College

is what I meant. Big 12 territory

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok, I thought you were confused as to why he said “seattle days.”

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

For the record, I am a Mizzou fan.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 15, 2010 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah Seneca was a big Deal

Pretty Cool that Chase Daniel got a ring :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

If Wallace gets the start, should we expect to see the Wildcat used more?

Columbus til I die, Columbus til I die. I know I am, I swear I am, Columbus til I die!
"Turner, at midcourt...inside it, at the buzzer, GOT IT!!!!"
We're the Big Ten, who the F@*# are YOU??!?!?!

by Andrew Tolliver on Sep 15, 2010 5:02 PM EDT reply actions  

I would hope we find ways to get Cribbs the damn ball. I saw he completed a pass last week, but I would like to see some running QB stuff to keep defenses off balance if we can’t throw it as well as Delhomme.

If they aren’t worried about defending run vs. pass, make them worried about defending run vs. different run.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would like to see more of this as well. I think Cribbs only had one or two rushes last week.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think he had 3 rushes and a pass…but definitely not enough. the rushes designed for him out of the wildcat seemed somewhat ill designed.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’d almost rather see Wallace play. He’d probably be less prone to turnovers and it might inspire our play calling to tip more towards the running game.

Moisture is the essence of wetness.

by troy145 on Sep 15, 2010 5:17 PM EDT reply actions  

I think Jake needs to suck it up, take the needle, the wrap and beat KC. I remember when Bernie had to where some popsicle stick wrapped in with rubber bands and threw for like 400 yds in a playoff game. He was brought in for leadership, and a win over KC will cement his team leadership.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wouldn’t wish the lifetime of chronic pain that Bernie has endured since retiring on anyone. He should come back when ready and not a moment sooner.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.™

by golanbatrac on Sep 15, 2010 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

Interesting point. Wonder what Bernie would say? He is a beloved Browns legend, and he really could not have been without his disregard for his body, and the courage he displayed in the pocket. He was so slow, that so often he would have to wait for the last split second to make the play, and then just fearlessly take a hit. So what would you choose? To have the pain associated with football, and to be a legend and have some asset to rebuild your life on? Or less pain and being a mediocre bankrupt has-been?

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 16, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

two things:

becoming a browns legend didn’t keep him from going bankrupt, and it didn’t help him recover.

he is just that, a browns legend. to 90% of football fans he is a mediocre bankrupt has-been.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 12:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Right on. Bernie is only 47 and in bad shape. It’s not worth it. Heckert/Holmgren brought in a competent backup, let’s use him.

by Monsters of the Midway on Sep 16, 2010 10:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think many players would say that this is a beautiful, yet unfortunate part of the game. You’ve got to give everything you have while you are playing. I think if Jake can help and not hurt the team by playing, he should play.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is exactly the wrong attitude to have.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 15, 2010 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

it would be impossible to rec this enough.

by Dawg Nuts on Sep 16, 2010 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Jake Delhomme has led a team to a Super Bowl before to his credit.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 16, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I completely disagree. For a few reasons

1) worst pocket presence ever

2) one of the most panicky QBs I have ever seen

3) decent arm, but doesn’t at all stretch the field; looks for the checkdowns and short patterns way too often

All of the negatives you can say about him (low ypa, not a pocket passer, sacks himself, can’t throw in the pocket at all, short) tie into these 3. I would MUCH rather have jake in for the fact that I have confidence in his game managing abilities and his ability to contribute to the offense.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t know about the less prone to TOs. He would definitely be more prone to stepping out of bounds for losses.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

that really bothers me. it’s not like it’s hard to flip the ball out of bounds at that point.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

And it’s the difference between 3rd and 3 or 3rd and 7.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

exactly.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

it should be noted that in sporting news’ daily e-magazine last wednesday that they had the browns at 2-14. thats worse thatn the bils, rams, broncos, lions, chiefs…….

by sleepy042 on Sep 15, 2010 5:32 PM EDT reply actions  

Not to be snide but how is this comment relevant to this thread?

"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin

by Spidey on Sep 15, 2010 6:20 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

yeah…I am guessing these guys haven’t seen the bills play and actually think Arizona will be good this year and bump St. Louis up for that. Granted, I can see the rest beign better, but I don’t see it as being likely.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

The Kansas City Chiefs are NOT a good football team. They really do not have much talented personel. If the Browns lose this game at home to the Chiefs, no miracle will save Mangini this year. I am telling you this is a very important game for him to remain the coach of this team. The reason being is that the Browns are actually better than Kansas City is almost every phase of the game and the game is at home. I know this is a shock coming from me, but I even like Delhomme over Cassel anyday. After this game the Browns will be MAJOR underdogs for the next 7 weeks (Ravens, Bengals, Falcons, Steelers, Saints, Patriots, and Jets) . A 1-8 start or 2-7 will kill Mangini’s chances of coaching next year.

If they could have beaten Tampa Bay and Kansas City and then went 2-5 over the next 7 they would have be 4 – 5 but lose this game and at best you are getting is 2-7 and that is the end of Mangini.

by champion64 on Sep 15, 2010 6:24 PM EDT reply actions  

I know that you are right that a slow start will doom Mangini – but I really think he can become a very effective coach. I sincerely hope that Holmgren can give him a 3rd year, as the team sorely needs talent, and judging from Heckert´s first draft – the new regime will make solid drafts. I am hoping that the Big Show has patience with Eric and that Eric has impatience with Daboll.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

wash.rinse.repeat.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

If they could have beaten Tampa Bay and Kansas City and then went 2-5 over the next 7 they would have be 4 – 5

Thank you for the math lesson.

In other news, if the Browns win all their regular season games then they’ll be 16-0.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 15, 2010 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I watched KC on Monday night. From what I saw, you are really underestimating the Chiefs. They have speed skill position guys and some veteran defenders.

Even with the Browns at home, I expect the Chiefs to be favored.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 15, 2010 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

They may be favored, but does that make them the smart bet?

by Roger Dorn on Sep 15, 2010 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Browns started as a 2 point favorite. The line may change based on Cleveland’s quarterback starting the game. I think the Browns are a better team than the Chiefs. It just looks like a must win for Mangini based on the next 7 games. They need to win the ones the are supposed to win now because it isn’t getting any easier and 1-9 or 2-8 may spell the end for Mangini (WHO I LIKE) Holmgren may want to completely start over including the coach if they go 1-9. Maybe not.

I honestly think the Browns are not a bad football team. Not a strong football team though. The quarterback situation is really the major problem. A better receiving core may help that but that is the glaring problem to me.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

We aren’t going to lose every single game that we won’t be favored in.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 16, 2010 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

Of course not, but it is highly likely through that stretch of 7 games we would lose 5 of them. All I am saying is that Mangini has a tough road ahead. I like him I hope he is here.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did you watch them against the Bolts this past weekend? I thought they were young and very talented.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Chiefs had pretty much two plays. Charles ran for 56 yards on one play and then they had a punt return for a TD of about 94 yards. Total they had 68 yards passing (that is gross yards) only 9 first downs and were 1-11 on third down. The Chief defense gave up almost 400 yards (390+ I think) I think this is a team that the Browns are better than. I think the Chiefs are on par with Tampa and I think the Browns are better than both teams. Point is the Browns really need to win this game. I think the Chargers are overrated. Weak division out there.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I wasn’t trying to say they produced consistently, I said young and talented.

We have to defend McCluster and Charles, which will be difficult for us. Bowe is difficult for anyone if he is catching the ball. Their defense is loaded with first round picks, and a Crennel/Vrabel reunion.

They might only need one or two plays against us if we are putting up 14 points per game. They are explosive enough to get those one or two plays.

Maybe the Browns are still better, but I don’t agree with this:

The Kansas City Chiefs are NOT a good football team. They really do not have much talented personel.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Completely agree…I thought they looked young, fast, and explosive during MNF against the Chargers.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 16, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Champ, in this case I have to agree with you. The second half of that game went all the Chargers’ way. They barely squeaked out with a win, just like we barely squeaked out with a loss. I also believe the Chargers are overrated.

Charles is dangerous if we let him break out, even for just one play. Our special teams is good enough to contain Arenas and McCluster. Regardless what anyone else thinks, Chiefs fan or Browns fan, I think this is Cleveland’s game to lose, just like the Tampa game. Let’s hope we remember how good our running game can be.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 16, 2010 4:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Severely overlooking the Chiefs.

Special teams is excellent. Defense played well considering they were on the field most of the game. Running game is dangerous.

by SupremeChief on Sep 16, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think he watched you guys play MNF last week. I think he is still thinking of your team from last year. You looked like a different team on Monday.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 16, 2010 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Th running game is dangerous, but inconsistent. Normally your special teams would be an advantage, but not this week. The defense gave up almost 400 yards.

There are many encouraging signs for KC, much like the browns, but sometimes we all let our enthusiasm get the best of us. It should be a good, close game.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would say the same about the browns. Should be a good game.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I like Mangini. I think he makes alot of sense. I am afraid they dont have the players here to keep him here for another season, which means another rebuild and more years of waiting for a quality team. I guess it is why I am so down on Delhomme. I dont think he can make this team competitive. I hope he can but watching him the last two years in Carolina, I just think he really has a major decline in his skills. I like Mangini and was one of the ones wanting him to stay at the end of last year.

by champion64 on Sep 15, 2010 8:01 PM EDT reply actions  

I think Holmgren is smart enough to assess Mangini’s work independent of Delhomme’s shortcomings.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree, and really am supportive of Mangini. I think he is bright, disciplined, and most importantly has learned from past mistakes. But I must say, he has to address the offensive side of the ball. He has 2 coordinators, and one is getting the job done basically with rookies and rejects. The other has 3 very very good OL, a decent back, nice wildcat talent, and just struggles on adjustments on a weekly basis.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is one area where I feel Mangini will be judged. Daboll stayed he must produce. Fair or not that is going to reflect to some degree on Mangini. Whether or not Delhomme reverts back to 1985, I don’t feel is a product of Mangini’s coaching, but how we choose to use Delhomme will reflect on Mangini. If he decides to allow Daboll to have him throw the ball like last week I think he will be judged on that if Delhomme turns in a bad season.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very well stated.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Who is Daboll and why is he contentious?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Our OC.

"My mother always told me: ‘You will see the light of people when they hit adversity. You’ll get a good sense of their character." - Ironic words from LeBron James

For the love of Joe Thomas.....

by North Coast Flea on Sep 15, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks does Mangini want to call the plays? or does Daboll?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

or Haskell or Holmgren?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not certain about Mangini’s desires for playcalling, however he didn’t choose to get rid of Daboll (i assume) and I don’t see us having a good year record wise, so I think Mangini will be judged based on the improvement of the team’s competitiveness and the ability of his coordinators to develop winning strategies. I think if we enter each game with a “winning” (i know) strategy but lose due to lack of talent (not bad in game decisions, Mangini stays.

Throwing the ball with Delhomme is a risk and it’s a risk that whether or not he signed off on it or not will affect mangini’s evaluation, so he either has to remind Daboll of his duties or he has to cosign his playcalling. I don’t think Mangini is in a position this year where he can deflect blame on Daboll.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks
The Chiefs are maybe in the same boat. Most do not believe Cassel is a franchise QB, we are still struggling with whether he can be a game manager.
Just from the outside. It must be tough to know who to listen too as the QB.
As far as the talent, I think Cleveland has loads of talent, it comes down to a plan to use the talent. Cleveland has a more proven defense than the Chiefs, Cleveland has a more proven Offensive line than the Chiefs. Cleveland has RB’s that have proved more in the NFL maybe a wash I forgot Thomas Jones for a moment. I want the Chiefs to win Sunday as you all do the Browns. If there was ever two teams more tied together than us I don’t know who.
It will be a hellavu fun game to watch :) Good luck Browns and you Dawgs:)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Cassel has proven over a year that if you surround him with talent he will do a nice job. I think that was a steal of a deal for KC. From what I saw on Monday, you are not in the same boat as it looks as if you have more speed and talent than the Browns.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

From what I saw on Monday, the Chiefs looked a lot better when Cassel wasn’t throwing.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 11:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is true. But I am drawing on his performance with NE and the fact that KC got him for a 2nd rounder (and some vets) after he posted a very nice first season. He made Josh McDaniel alot of money that year.

Note to Bill Byrne "Because you aren´t Texas and you´ll never be Texas"

by realmccoy on Sep 15, 2010 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cassel is good in the Pats system, much like Brady.

Cassel is not good when’s he not in the Pats system.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 11:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

We are trying to replicate the Pats System

We have a 300+ comment arguement going on about Cassel right now. We got Fricken Mike Vrabel too.

On Monday night Vrable called a defensive timeout right after the Chargers burned their last timout for the 4th down play. We got to see the Chargers plan for free:) and then triple covered Gates who Rivers fixated on until he could not anymore. Plus Vrabel is 11 for 11 on TD’s as a Pass Catcher. Cassel was the throw in for the 2nd round pick trade!

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Glad to know there are some KC fans who don’t think that Cassel is the next coming of Brady.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 11:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not Brady

He could be Trent Green though

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Trent Green was always underrated for you guys.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

I always liked Trent Green, and I don’t think he ever got the respect he deserved.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree. One of the best overachieving game managers who could occasionally put the team on his shoulders. Never had elite talent but was able to make the most of his talent and the talent around him.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

We got to see the Chargers plan for free:) and then triple covered Gates who Rivers fixated on

I could have guessed this as the gameplan in the first place. they only have one good WR threat in Malcolm floyd, and Flowers can handle him. i would have double covered gates on every play.

Cassel was the throw in for the 2nd round pick trade!

Really? I really like vrabel, but to me, this sounds ridiculous. the whole point of the trade and the trade talks was to get cassel…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Really? I really like vrabel, but to me, this sounds ridiculous. the whole point of the trade and the trade talks was to get cassel…

Bross, let me introduce you to Sarcasm. Sarcasm, please meet bross.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Sep 16, 2010 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

TDSH. I know what sarcasm is, but the wording of that whole argument strongly implies that Vrabel is the better player, so it makes it much harder to pick up on.

He starts out by dismissing cassell and then goes into a discussion of every single thing vrabel brings to the team and is singing vrabel’s praises. How am I supposed to understand sarcasm without hearing the tonal response after he writes so seriously about the positives of vrabel. That sentence alone, I could take as sarcasm, but coupled with that paragraph, it throws off my sarcasm meter.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

DUDE, THE GUY WAS MAKING A JOKE.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

it throws off my sarcasm meter

Not trying to be mean, but I really am not sure you have one of these.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 16, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I do…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

They did just hire Weiss. If anyone knows the Pats’ system outside of that organization, I would think Weiss would be the guy.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

cassel excelled in the pats system, with pro bowl Offensive Lineman, and a possible future HOF receiver, and a pro bowl WR next to the HOFer.

that offense around him has 16 pro bowl appearances total; 9 from the WRs and 7 from the OL. Its hard to find a more talented and productive offense than the one he was in…the same offense that Tom Brady threw 50 TDs with. there was also good coaching.

He is struggling to be a gamechanger, now that he doesn’t have gamechanging weapons. he HAS talent around him now, but none that will make the plays for him. Bowe and chambers are good and so is the left side of the OL.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Gamechangers or hope to be
Jamaal Charles
Thomas Jones
Dexter McCluster
Tony Moeaki
Dwayne Bowe
Chris Chambers
Pope
Battle
Cox
Castille
The Chiefs are giving Cassel more than enough to prove he can do the job.
Weigman
Lilja
on the new ZB line to let the weapons shine.
A decent Defense and Hoffman led ST’s.
If you all can rattle shake sack Cassel you win

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

yeah. all of these guys have the potential to be gamechangers, but none of them are yet, though Charles is the closest one.

chambers and Jones were never gamechangers and it would be ridiculous to expect them to become gamechangers at this point.

there is a lot of talent, but no one yet who is a gamechanger. A lot of good players like Charles, Bowe, and chambers though. Great QBs have proven more with less.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

I agree. I think these are 2 improving teams that are very evenly matched.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

Cleveland has RB’s that have proved more in the NFL maybe a wash I forgot Thomas Jones for a moment.

Appreciate the sentiment, but Peyton Hillis + Jerome Harrison are nowhere close to Jamaal Charles + Thomas Jones. Again, though, you are welcome here, and I appreciate that you are going out of your way to compliment our team.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Sep 16, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Throw in Vickers and ya its pretty close

by year of the elf on Sep 16, 2010 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Hasn’t Jamaal Charles proven even less than Harrison?

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 9:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Jamaal Charles has proven more in less time than Harrison.
Jerome Harrison Career Stats: 1362 yards and 6 Tds thats 4.8 yards per carry
Charles Career Stats: 1569 yards and 8 TDs thats 5.8 yards per carry.

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 16, 2010 9:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thomas Jones’s stats are substantially worse than both, but that doesn’t mean either have proven more than Jones.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well I’m not sure what stats you’re talking about but Jones has significantly more yards and TD’s than either of them.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 1:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was referring to the YPC, should have been more clear.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would think when someone calls a player “more proven” they would refer to cumulative stats like yards and TDs not average stats like YPC which don’t reflect how long they’ve been playing.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think that’s exactly what he did?

Thomas Jones’s stats are substantially worse than both, but that doesn’t mean either have proven more than Jones.

I.e. Jones is “more proven” but less productive on a per play basis to this point.

Excuse me if that was not your point, NTN.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

exactly.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

my point was that harrison has the larger sample size, so he has shown he can be successful over a longer period of time, and has in that sense “proven more.”

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Charles has shown more in less time, but Harrison hasn’t had the opportunities.

by HenryDawg on Sep 16, 2010 12:25 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Charles only has 3 more starts than Harrison

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 16, 2010 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Harrison also has 280 carries compared to Charles 168. Harrison has over 100 more carries than Charles

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 16, 2010 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

right, so he’s proven he can put up great numbers over a longer period of time. Either one could easily be a flash in the pan, but as of right now Harrison has done more to prove he is not.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

And to prove he is less flashy in the pan.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mangini would call the defense if anything, I think.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Delhomme is just as capable at keeping this team competative as a healthy stafford, Sam Bradford, Josh Freeman, Matt hasselbeck, Trent Edwards…basically any QB of the teams that drafted in the top 10 last year.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions  

yes. Trent Edwards? Really? Even after what we saw yesterday, there are only 1-2 teams that I would likely rather take their QB (for this year at least) of teams that drafted in the bottom 10 and that would be the Jags and the Raiders.

Every guy pretty much on the teams that drafted around us has a sucky QB. You can argue that one is a bit better than the other, but that all comes down to a matter of opinion. at the end of the day, all of them aren’t very good at this point.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would have to give this one to bross only because the names mentioned along with Delhomme are not exactly top tier QBs yet, or are past that phase of their career as is Delhomme, competent for this year, maybe even the next….and then I expect either Wallace to take over, or McCoy

by year of the elf on Sep 16, 2010 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

You can forget Seneca Wallace ever being a long term fix. He is a career back up, and Colt McCoy is too small for the NFL. The Browns future quarterback has not been drafted yet. Hasselback was who Holmgren wanted, but the price was too high. I still like Jason Campbell as a mid term fix. I know ship has sailed but my point is any of the three quarterbacks on this roster will not be here long.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Colt McCoy is too small for the NFL

I’m skeptical of McCoy as well, but this is not a reason why. There have been plenty of successful QBs as short or shorter than McCoy.

Hasselback was who Holmgren wanted, but the price was too high

evidence please?

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

Doug Flutie was above average at least and he was shorter.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

there’s always Drew Brees, but at this point we all know about that comparison.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Chase Daniels?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

We don’t know yet if Colt can be the future. its way too early to tell and many QBs have been able to survive without being very tall. It will be difficult but that doesn’t mean we can write him off as the future.

I agree with you on wallace and Campbell though. wallace is really just a spot starter at best and I would like a guy like campbellz

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

It did not seem as though McCoy was really a player Holmgren enthusiastically wanted. I think he really wanted Bradford. Is there a good group of quarterbacks projected to come out next year. Whether Delhomme works out or not, the Quarterback situation I think needs to be addressed immediately and I dont think Wallace or McCoy are the long time answer.

Hey we actually agreed on something Bross09!

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

It did not seem as though McCoy was really a player Holmgren enthusiastically wanted

I’m pretty sure Holmgren is on record as wanting to pick Colt much earlier than we did. In fact, when we finally did pick him, holmgren said he had to pull rank over Heckert and Mangini.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

I thought it was the other way. That he did not want to pick McCoy but in the end he gave the ok based on a need not because he coveted McCoy. You could be right. I am not sold on Colt McCoy. I think with a good quarterback this team could be competitive this year. I am not saying they would win 8 games or more, but be competitive.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, the FO still had players on the board above Colt, and they skipped over those guys to take him because Holmgren said so.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

I heard the Browns wanted Jason Peters, the DT from Kentucky, but when he was chosen 2 or 3 picks before Colt then Holmgren pushed for them to take him. If Peters was still there then we would have taken him over McCoy.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Possibly, I don’t know. I definitely read that when we were on the clock, we skipped over several players that we ranked as better than Colt and that were still available.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I heard that too, but I read about Peters in the PD several times (and it was Corey Peters as bb said below).

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

And adding on to that point, I believe one of the players that we “passed over” was Shuan Luavo who we ended up getting later.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 16, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Cory Peters was the DT from Kentucky, and yes I also heard that ATL picked him just a couple of spots ahead of where the Browns wanted him.

by bbstirrd on Sep 16, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

You all could be right. Maybe it was like as you say they had others the rated higher and Holmgren who wanted to draft a quarterback (although not in love with McCoy) did not want to wait because he did not like any other quarterback left. I know Holmgren is noted for drafting a quarterback in alot of his drafts. Thanks for clearing it up.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

All of that said, I wonder if McCoy will amount to becoming a starter in the NFL? Obviously the kid has the leadership and work ethic needed to do so, but is the talent there? He will be interesting to watch over this year and going into next.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 16, 2010 2:51 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is correct. Can’t remember where I read it, but that was indeed the case.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 16, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

It did not seem as though McCoy was really a player Holmgren enthusiastically wanted

this is just wrong. he pulled rank to get McCoy. He is the kind of guy that fits best in a WC offense too.

He might have been intrigued at bradford, who also could run a WCO, but I believe a lot of that was smokescreening before the draft.

Is there a good group of quarterbacks projected to come out next year.

There is not that one elite guy who is a surefire first QB taken, but a lot of guys who could go in the first round. the elite guys with the most experience all have their issues (locker has consistency issues, mallett has drug issues, etc..). The only guy i would personally go for is Andrew Luck. he was a RS sophmore last year and had incredible touch on his passes and good decision making.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, the FO still had players on the board above Colt, and they skipped over those guys to take him because Holmgren said so.

If that’s the case i would tend to believe that they’re really trying to develop Colt into the franchise QB…..say Delhomme decides to retire, or something happens, Wallace could step in, especially when paired with a guy like Cribbs. We really don’t know what we have yet in McCoy, but for the records (NCAA) he has, it says something as well. Who knows if he’s ready next year, but Wallace could move into the starting role and if they’re still developing McCoy there’s still pressing needs across the team…..#1 WR, LB, right side of the OL, DE. If Holmgren, as the “football czar” pushed for McCoy THAT hard, I don’t think he’d be willing to admit a mistake like that after the first year with the team.

During his career, Wallace has completed 333-of-556 passes (59.9 percent) for 3,547 yards and 25 touchdowns against 14 interceptions. His most productive year as a quarterback came in 2008, when he completed 141 passes for 1,532 yards and 11 touchdowns against three interceptions.

Room for improvement for a guy who’s been on the shelf most of his career, but not horrible numbers.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think he’d be willing to admit a mistake like that after the first year with the team.

\

McCoy wouldn’t be considered a mistake yet, but that’s more so in reference to Holmgren “flexing his muscle” and overriding Heckert and Mangini and selecting McCoy ahead of other players on their board.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 12:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

So over at that KC blog they seem to think they’re going to roll over us.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 8:42 PM EDT reply actions  

so does every team. never mind jerome harrison rushed for 286 yards against them last year.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 8:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

How soon they forget.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

no we didnt forget... but we are a totally diff team this year

I dont think we will roll you but I think it will be a very close game

Chiefs Will

by tomahawk44 on Sep 15, 2010 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

After reading some of the comments there, that seems to be the consensus. You’re crowd also thinks that KC has done a lot more in the offseason than we have as well. I’m not sure of all of your offseason moves, but that seems a bit ignorant.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Coming off a big win against San Diego in front of a national audience, I’d expect no less than unbridled enthusiasm.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.™

by golanbatrac on Sep 15, 2010 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

I know I would be irrationally optimistic.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 10:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very good point.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe I was one. Troy came over.
AP has some knuckle heads.
I still want to know about Daboll

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

He’s our OC. Our offense sucked last year, and a lot of people were calling for his and Mangini’s head.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

But I heard/read that there was some difference in what the gameplan would be.
Mangini vs Daboll’s Run vs Pass.

Haley fired Gailey over a difference in gameplan

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately I don’t know the inside story and who wants to do what. Not sure if any of us on this blog know that. Some think it’s Gil Haskell and Holmgren influencing the passing game.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn confusing
So who is Haskell?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

passing game coordinator?

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

I believe its more along the lines of trying to incorporate more of the west coast offense into what we were running last year

by year of the elf on Sep 15, 2010 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

Are you all running the Power block scheme still

or the Zone Block on offense?
The Chiefs switched from Power to Zone last year as well as from a 4-3 to 3-4 Defnse. All thanks to the New England bias. Mangini was a New England apprentice. Holmgren is not.

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

most teams use a bit of both in the running game. My guess would be that the differences from last year are more along the lines of philosophy than actual X’s and O’s.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 15, 2010 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

shanahan is the only guy i can think of who primarily ran ZBS…and even then, he still had some non ZBS plays.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Colts also, there are a few other teams who could be called “ZB systems”.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t realize the colts ran it.

I forgot houston also runs it, but both Kyle Shanahan and Kubiak were assistants under Shanahan so it makes a lot of sense.

Wikipedia (yeah, I used that to check) says the Packers and Raiders also use ZB Systems.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Our main runs are the Power, Counter, I/S Zone, O/S Zone, Pin and Pull O/S Zone, and the ISO.

Last year we were probably most successful with the Power/Counter and O/S zone in terms of breaking big plays. We are not a true Zone Blocking team like a Denver Shannahan team, but like everywhere else we will run the hell out of the zone plays if we think the other team is weak against them.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

You do know we have a hole at RDE.
Jackson showed pretty good against the run week one. Now we got our Cleveland player Shaun Smith manning the spot or Gilberry.
I would assume you all would attack the Right gaps 1 , 2 , 3 against Edwards, Smith, and Vrabel for Rush plays.
Shhhh don’t tell Mangini :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

YOU HAVE SHAUN SMITH ON YOUR TEAM?

(In a Nelson voice) Haha!

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 9:37 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Hehe Yes
He looks good in Red :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 10:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

So will Matt Cassel’s nose when he punches it…

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

that might be the point when Cassel takes over this team.
O vs D would be a scrum to see :)

Where Corn don’t Grow

Is music a NoNo too :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 17, 2010 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

he was an OC under Holmgren and was brought in for an advisory role.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Haskell has been a friend of Holmgrens and was brought in as an advisor to Daboll

by year of the elf on Sep 15, 2010 10:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Damn I would be pissed !

Holmgren needs to shit or get off the pot

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

He could have just fired everybody and started over if he really wanted to. Daboll is lucky to have a job after last year (not that I’m saying I don’t support keeping him).

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Pioli almost did, and then Haley fired the OC in 2009 and the DC in 2010. Thank you all for Crennel.

A good coach that was possibly promoted ala “Dilbert” over his head. Did you all see the triple team on Gates. That was awesome :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 15, 2010 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Romeo’s awesome. Was not meant to be a Head Coach, but is a great guy, and a first class defensive coordinator.

by TheDriveStillHurts on Sep 16, 2010 12:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

This.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

like I said above, IMO, the triple team on Gates is a no brainer. Flowers can handle Floyd, and the rest of their WRs (Crayton, Davis) aren’t that scary of options (especially since Crayton is just learning the offense). Sproles can catch out of the backfield, but Matthews isn’t that much of a WR from what I heard in college.

Without V-Jax, that offense looks way too ordinary

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

It still takes guts and creativity to triple team and mug the hell out of Gates on that play.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

without a penalty :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

thats true. It takes guts. I guess it takes creativity because it usually isn’t done.

However, how often is an offense that dependent on one player. Without V-Jax, Gates makes up for almost 40% of the passing offense based on last year’s numbers.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 11:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Made Rivers Cry

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 17, 2010 12:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

…which makes me glad.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 17, 2010 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Haskell is an offensive advisor to our coaches. I think they wanted to learn some things from Holmgren, and Holmgren wanted to make sure they knew and/or implemented some things because they (Mangini/Holmgren) came from different coaching trees.

Holmgren is a busy guy, in charge of the whole organization. So I think he hired Haskell as a sort of stand-in for himself on the Xs and Os. Haskell knows what Holmgren knows, and he is available for Xs and Os when Holmgren is not.

Mangini and Daboll have a pretty stable relationship, I think. They both want to favor whatever they think will help us win. They both want a flexible offense that they can tailor to the opposing D’s weaknesses. If we have to run 50 times to win, we will. If we think we have to pass 50 times, we will. I think they are both on board with this “be flexible and exploit their weaknesses” offense, based on the Pats’.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

So a Scheme based game plan?
That is what the Chiefs profess to run.
Haley as much as said in this weeks pressers that the gameplan changed based on the 14 point edge. The rain factored in. SOunds like a possibility of Rain this week in Cleveland too.

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

With the New England roots of both of our teams, none of that surprises me. We are probably pretty similar in terms of the coaches’ philosophies.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

The million dollar question.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 10:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Do you read this blog? Everybody here thought we were going to roll the Bucs. Team-centric blogs produce hubris.

by Chemo on Sep 17, 2010 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, it’s always amusing to read people on this blog talk about how games against bad teams like the Bucs and Chiefs should be “easy” wins for the Browns then get upset — or act surprised — when fans of those other teams say the same thing about us. Almost all fans have overvalued opinions of their own team

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t really remember overconfidence that we would beat the Bucs but a lot of people did think we should have won, which is true. We should have won.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Also, many forget how close in talent NFL teams are. There are no 1AA teams in the league. “Any given sunday” is cliché for a reason.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 18, 2010 5:11 AM EDT up reply actions  

but we are a totally diff team this year/blockquote>

and so are we. we have an actual competent QB now and good Tight Ends. Plus, we have a RB besides harrison and now have enough talent in the Defensive backfield not to get burned on every play.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:24 AM EDT up reply actions  

we have an actual competent QB now

Who?

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 16, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not on the player roster.

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think his name starts with jake…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

Jake is competent, but he shouldn’t have had the game put on his shoulders. He’s competent enough that he can manage the game like he did for so many years in Carolina.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

A competent QB should be able to hold an 11 point lead on a garbage Tampa team.

He chunked a horrible INT to end the half that killed the momentum for us. This is exactly what Delhomme has become. A turnover prone QB that doesn’t understand that he doesn’t have the tools to take chances.

If Quinn or DA had done this, this board would have exploded with “DA SUCKS!” and “Quinn sucks!”. We faced a bad defensive team without their best player (Talib) and scored 14 points.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 17, 2010 1:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly, after making this comments I started to think about all this. I really think that if Seneca plays (exceptionally) well, he should remain the starter. I want the best chance to win, and I don’t want to have to go back and forth once Jake starts struggling. He flashed back to 09 last week, thinking he could make throws that he can’t. I don’t want a QB controversy, but I want to win.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

I agree 100% with wanting to win, but after all off-season NOT having a QB controversy (for once), that’s exactly what it’ll end up being….if it was a different situation, say Jake was out several weeks and Wallace played well it would be different, especially since it’ll be a young secondary this week, as is ours. Not to take anything away from the work they’ve done.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 1:34 AM EDT up reply actions  

I know, and I’m torn. I’m not sure how to feel about all this. Ugh.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yupyup, maybe it’d be different if we weren’t paying Delhomme as much as we are. I tend to believe Wallace has the ability to stretch the defense out more because of his mobility.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 1:47 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think we have a QB controversy, I still think it is Jake’s job.

He just sucks.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 17, 2010 1:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

True, we don’t have a controversy, just discussing outcomes and possibilities.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 2:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

he’s not great, but I don’t think he’s as bad as you’re making him out. It it would have been Quinn or Anderson those 14 points would have been a kick return and a defensive touchdown. At least Delhomme has shown the ability to lead the offense.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 9:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, because Quinn or Anderson never led the Browns to an offensive TD.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

It was an obvious exaggeration. Even though he didn’t play particularly well last week he at least showed long stretches of average QB play. something we rarely saw from the other two.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, I know it was an exaggeration, but Bernie’s point is correct. Quinn and Anderson have both showed long stretches of “average QB play” (or better) in their years here, and Delhomme didn’t really do that much on Sunday even if you take away the interceptions. The TD pass to Massaquoi was helped by a terrible play by the safety. If Quinn or DA threw a pick like Delhomme did before the half which gave them a TD and turned the game around then we’d all be killing them here, but because we want to believe that Delhomme will be better people are making excuses and looking for positiives. It’s a natural fan reaction and I’m not being critical, but you have to at least acknowledge that it’s happening.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Anderson may have shown a long stretch of average QB play, but I am grasping at straws to think of when Quinn was able to so. Delhomme is better than both.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

which is saying nothing, because I don’t think much of Delhomme.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Quinn has showed a long stretch of average play within a game many times, which is what ntn was referring to above.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 9:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

I have to point out that, out of our two touchdown drives this week, one was nothing but running plays and the other was a sitting duck lob that Sean Jones completely misplayed into a touchdown.

by Chemo on Sep 17, 2010 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

With our team honestly not expected to make playoffs, I still wanna see McCoy get thrown in the deep end. Let him play and learn this year. Baptism by fire if you will.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

If Quinn or DA had done this, this board would have exploded with "DA SUCKS!" and "Quinn sucks!".

This is very true.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

but it wouldn’t have happened after the first game they played in a browns uniform. It’s not an accurate comparison. We gave both of those guys a few games of sucking before we jumped on them, why not do the same for Delhomme?

Also, as I said above, when you play a pretty decent game it’s easier to forgive a couple really bad mistakes. But when your entire game is one mistake after another, the really bad ones are going to make people mad.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

But Quinn and DA never played before they got to the Browns so that’s why nobody jumped on them after a few games. Delhomme was terrible for an entire season last year in Carolina, so it’s foolish to pretend that never happened and act like he’s never played before so we have to wait a few games to judge him.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

he also had a long track record of success before last season as well as a very good preseason. so to come out and say he sucks after one game would be premature.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

When players in their mid-30’s start sucking you really shouldn’t expect them to revert back to playing like they did in their prime — that rarely happens. And preseason performances don’t matter, as we’ve seen many times.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

sure, we shouldn’t expect him to be as good as he was, but we also can reasonably expect a slight rebound.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 18, 2010 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions  

There are plenty of people saying Delhomme sucks and blew the game just as we would have done for the other 2 losers.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Exactly.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 17, 2010 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes there are, but there are also plenty of people making excuses for him.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 17, 2010 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s the groupthink.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 18, 2010 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

This.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 17, 2010 2:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

As they should, regardless of last year, KC is a better team than the team we lost to last week, and the product we put on the field sure didn’t do much to change that perception. Ya the defense is improved, but the 2 strengths that gave us 4 wins at the end of the year, O-line and running game, took a step back, at least last week. We can hope that week 2 ends differently, but unless these boys strap it up tight and smack KC in the mouth early and get the fans involved, its gonna be a long game. Offense needs to take steps forward and keep moving forward throughout the game.

Ya Jerome rushed for 286 yards, but 18 rushes in game doesn’t cut and we need to get back to the run game and grind it out. If we’re on defense first, SOMEONE needs to get to the ball carrier and smack his ass, fast.

by year of the elf on Sep 15, 2010 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Our o-line took a step back? I wasn’t aware.

I really think after losing the game the way we did, we’’ll get our act together.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 9:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

I didn’t get a chance to watch the whole game, but i’ve heard numerous times that the o-line didn’t look up to par and Thomas was beat a couple times, if i’m mistaken i apologize, but I’ve read and heard on a couple sports shows that people weren’t happy with the o-line play.

by year of the elf on Sep 15, 2010 9:34 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think Thomas got beat once (I hope I don’t get struck down) and I believe it was on the interception, which was also the injury. You may be right, I just didn’t think our o-line played poorly, barring one play that basically screwed us over.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

The PD said that Thomas got beat on the interception right before the half.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 15, 2010 10:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

Guess that’s where I heard that.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

I was watching the play. thomas got beat but eventually negated the guy. Not a good play, but when they say that, they seem to imply that he was a cause of the INT.

I looked back and the guy that got beat and whose man caused the INT was Steinbach. Granted, he did get beat by McCoy.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions  

On the INT, Steinbach was beat up the middle forcing Delhomme back in the pocket – and into Thomas’ man who was going wide and around.

I think I also remember a play in the second half where Thomas got beat badly by Crowder; he basically got tossed aside. I’d never before seen anything like that happen to Thomas. I don’t think it resulted in a sack though, maybe just an incomplete pass.

by bbstirrd on Sep 16, 2010 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

Thomas got beat badly

easy friend, you’re calling down the thunder.

by Dawg Nuts on Sep 16, 2010 10:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

I hope my memory on this one if faulty, but I don’t think it is.

by bbstirrd on Sep 16, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

thomas’ man got wide, but then thomas pushed him down from behind so the guy wasn’t coming after delhomme anymore. Granted, this was about a second before delhomme threw the INT.

You make it seem though as if the INT was thomas’ fault. a second or 2 before the INT, thomas negates the guy he was guarding. you are correct in what you are saying but you seem to imply that JTs man forced the INT which is incorrect. it was gerald McCoy coming up the middle (steinbach’s man)

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

You make it seem though as if the INT was thomas’ fault.

Well he’s certainly not solely responsible. Delhomme is the main culprit for throwing the pass. But Steinbach and Thomas are also culpable for allowing pressure (it was Thomas’ man who hit Delhomme’s legs as he threw the pass) and also Watson and Stuckey for running routes right next to each other.

by bbstirrd on Sep 16, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wrong bross. Thomas did not “negate” the guy. Thomas’s guy got around him and got ahold of Delhomme’s ankle.

Need proof?

http://www.youtube.com/v/0rMu96PqYtU

Skip to about 2:15. I hate to admit Thomas made a mistake as much as the next guy, but you’re being an idiot making unjustified statements.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 16, 2010 3:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah, Thomas was beaten badly on that play.

Dawgs By Nature -- where Hitler, apparently, 'did some good things'.™

by golanbatrac on Sep 16, 2010 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

Does Thomas own Hali on Sunday?
Hali has a bend and has owned Ryan Clady, the problem is that the Nose and the ROLB has not been able to push enough for a concensus at the QB.

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Thomas is a God.

Tamba Hali is human.

Hence, Thomas owns Hali.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 16, 2010 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Hali is no match for Joe Thomas, sorry.

by BuenosAires_Dawg on Sep 18, 2010 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

I really wouldn’t say that. Thomas’ man fell, and Delhomme was supposed to be on a quick drop and throw. Delhomme didn’t see anyone open and had to hesitate and step back.

Thomas’ job is to wash his guy out of the play if he wants to go that far upfield. Delhomme should be on a 3 step drop and the ball should be out, or he should have a pocket to step up into somewhere.

JT could have certainly done better, but I think Steinbach did a worse job on that play.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

yep. If Steinbach stays in front of McCoy, Delhomme is nowhere near being taken down by JTs man. If Steinbach doesn’t get beat, there is no one in Jake’s face and he is much more likely to have made a better decision.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Is it really that hard to admit Thomas got beat on a play? Holy shit. I love the guy, but his man made a great play to get around and get Delhomme. I’m not saying Steinbach is not at fault, or Delhomme, or even Stuckey for running the wrong route. It seems the whole team sucked on that play.

And thank God rufio came to your rescue, eh?

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 12:14 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think I came to his rescue, I think I am somewhere between “beaten badly” and “infallible”.

Joe let his man do too much, but it shouldn’t have caused a sack. It wasn’t like he got flat out schooled.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 17, 2010 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions  

I got that you were saying Joe could have done better and that Steinbach is also at fault, but bross was saying Joe completely “negated” his guy and that he didn’t even touch Delhomme. He then used your statement to try and keep his argument alive.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think I came to his rescue, I think I am somewhere between "beaten badly" and "infallible".

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 18, 2010 5:16 AM EDT up reply actions  

I looked at it a third time and you were right. The guy got Delhomme’s leg. JT got beat. However, my belief is there isn’t an INT if Steinbach takes care of McCoy. there might not be an INT if JT takes his man on and Steinbach gets beat (though its more likely to happen than if just JT got beat). Its the fact that both got beat that led to the INT.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 17, 2010 2:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe was beat. His guy got around him and to Jake. That’s getting beat. The whole left side of the line collapsed, and Joe was certainly part of that.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 12:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

So you counted it as a sack when Joe had his guy blocked and DA would run right into the blocked defender?

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 17, 2010 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe is the left tackle. He’s responsible for blocking the guy that Jake can’t see. Jake didn’t know that there was somebody about to take his legs out from under him. Joe’s job is to make sure that doesn’t happen.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:17 AM EDT up reply actions  

QB’s are sometimes at fault for sacks. The lineman have different protection responsibilities on different plays. (Not weighing in on this play, just making a point.)

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

He didn’t take Delhomme’s legs out from under him, he grabbed Delhomme’s legs as he was walking over the guy.

Also, the play is on a 3 step drop from shotgun. Look at Delhomme’s feet. One, two, three, hitch, then he moves back, falling over and throwing the ball off of his back foot because McCoy is about to eat him alive—not because Thomas’ guy hit him during the throw.

He is already off balance and falling before Thomas’ guy grabs his legs. It wasn’t like the DE was able to actually move forward to grab Delhomme: he falls near the skull, he hits Jake near the skull.





The last image is during the forward movement of the arm, before the DE is able to grab Jake.

Look at how far Thomas has washed his guy behind the LoS! If the protection were perfect (and it never is in a live game) Jake should be able to step up in to a pocket. You can see Mack and the right side of the line forming that pocket, and Thomas’ end should be far enough upfield to be out of the way as well.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 18, 2010 5:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yea normally the QB should be able to step forward when the end is that deep. He wasn’t able to do so because the DT had penetrated quite a bit.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 18, 2010 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

the HD replay i watched which was fullscreen on my CPU (which is over 17 inches…the screen, so maximum viewing experience with all of this) the guy didn’t seem to grab delhomme’s ankle.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did you watch the video? Are you kidding me? He had ahold of his whole freaking leg.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 12:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Or maybe that was my non-HD 15" monitor tricking me. That must have been it.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions   2 recs

Ha!

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

I took a third look and it looks like he did get him a bit. but his whole freakin leg is a bit of an exaggeration from what I saw.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 17, 2010 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well, excuse us Rockerfeller.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 17, 2010 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

You’ve got one thing right here. Joe’s man did not force the INT. In fact, whether or not Joe’s man got to Delhomme, he would’ve thrown that pick.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:31 AM EDT up reply actions  

By the way, what I’m doing here is saying anything I said about Joe’s guy causing the interception was wrong. After my post to rufio, I realize Jake was going to make that throw whether or not Joe’s guy got to him.

I still stand by the fact that Joe did in fact get beat, and because of it Jake is in a walking boot, and this could cause a QB controversy. But hey, it’s Cleveland. Would you expect any less?

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 17, 2010 1:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

This. JT caused the boot, but Steinbach’s man truly forced the INT. I also saw in the video that Delhomme had already made the bad decision to throw it there before JTs man touched him. Maybe if JTs man doesn’t touch him, he throws it more accurately, but that still would have likely been an INT.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 17, 2010 2:28 AM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Thomas got beat on a play, i think we all acknowledge that; but to now also blame Jake’s injury on Joe is laughable.

are we saying Joe someone controlled the way the defender hit Jake, or that Joe had something to do with Jake not being able to step up and alowing his ankle to be grabbed? unrealistic.

finally, if it weren’t for Joe Thomas, all of our QBs would get ground into a fine powder on a regular basis.

by Dawg Nuts on Sep 18, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Refer to Rufio.

Thomas was not beat.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 18, 2010 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

I just really have a hard time thinking a DE would be able to say he “beat” his block and got a QB hit when he is lying on the ground 10 yards behind the line of scrimmage.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 18, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Thomas’ man did help to cause the injury. JT had no control over his man and how he hit. I agree with that. maybe saying ‘he caused the boot’ was a little harsh and incorrect. I was more referring to his man causing the JD injury. However, if Delhomme doesn’t force that throw, He might not be injured…

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 18, 2010 9:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

That’s not getting beat.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 18, 2010 5:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

Tsk Tsk.

They gone have to stop sleeping on me one day.. I gotta be one of the best

About 3 hours ago by Eric Wright Cleveland Browns – Cornerback

I understand, as a big daddy come and take my spot type of demeanor?

by mooncamping on May 14, 2010 7:24 AM EDT

by Villeslgr on Sep 15, 2010 10:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

KC is a better team than the team we lost to last week

so bad gameplanning won’t work against them either?

O-line and running game, took a step back, at least last week

Huh? our O-Line was protecting well. Especially considering that we had 2 key players hurt. Womack had a hurt knee so wasn’t at 100% and Lauvao was completely out. Plus, I would call 4.5 yards per carry pretty good.

but 18 rushes in game doesn’t cut

wow. you are really shooting the messenger here. the browns only call 18 runs so it’s harrison’s fault and he is not cutting it? he doesn’t control the playcalling. he was ‘cutting it’ when he got the ball’ and the run game didn’t take a step back. The browns were up most of the game but the coaches decided to pass it more than twice as much as run it. whats harrison supposed to do?

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 12:40 AM EDT up reply actions  

As far as the O-line, its all hear-say, as i said i didnt get to watch the game. I’ve listened to a lot of other people’s opinions on the radio and local radio stations seem to think the O-line wasnt up to par, i apologize if it was.

When i said the running game took a step back i was more so referring to the imbalance of running plays v. passing plays, which obviously isnt Harrison’s fault. I was referring to the fact that it didnt seem like a priority in the plays called, which obviously it should’ve been considering thats how we won the last 4 games. I am by no means inferring that it was Harrisons fault.

Hillis is a sexy play, cause he typically bounces off the first defender, but i dont believe thats a reason for Harrison who was on the team last year, to take a backseat. Hillis is going to be/is a fan favorite already because of his hard-nosed style of running but when you play like that, you’re subjecting your body to alot of abuse and someone with that style shouldn’t be a featured back in this modern era when most teams use a tandem RB backfield.

by year of the elf on Sep 16, 2010 12:48 AM EDT up reply actions  

Okay. i guess I missed what you are saying a bit. I totally agree on the playcalling. Just horrendous.

both hillis and harrison took a backseat to the passing game, though I think harrison got shafted more for touches.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

Oh most definitely. Yes our WRs looked better throughout the offseason but they’re still young and we don’t have a true #1 at this point. Going into the Tampa game, in my mind, was a tune-up game, which means (again, in my opinion) that running the ball should’ve been a priority and we should’ve worked our WRs in slowly and got them more comfortable and confident in our offense, especially Robiskie……I’m still scratching my head about last week’s performance.

by year of the elf on Sep 16, 2010 1:20 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m still scratching my head about last week’s performance.

As far as the play calling goes.

I believe on “Xs and Os With the Pros” (ESPN Radio) they inferred that it might be the fact that we have more talent than last year and the coaches are having a hard time deciding on who to give the ball to. Validity?

by year of the elf on Sep 16, 2010 1:25 AM EDT up reply actions  

agreed. We desperately need a #1 and this seemed more of a game where we were finding what worked on Offense. granted I thought that was what the preseason was for. and as you said below, many people seem to be expressing this and there may be some validity to it.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.

I appreciate Male Beauty

Intensive Purposes? I could care less...

by bross09 on Sep 16, 2010 2:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

ya, thats pretty much blasphemy haha…..but we need to get back to running the ball

by year of the elf on Sep 15, 2010 9:52 PM EDT reply actions  

OT, but this “Hey Rohaie” show on ESPN, it’s basically all about Haden and McCoy, give or take a few spurts from Tate, Gilyard and Spiller.

It’s actually really entertaining. Haden’s hilarious.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 10:15 PM EDT reply actions  

Damn “Rookie”.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wow, wish I knew this was on before it was almost over.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha, best part of the show was this game film they showed. Guess what play this was…

McCoy – “What? did you want me to throw it down there to nobody?”

Mangini – “IT WAS THE LAST PLAY OF THE GAME!”

McCoy – “…What if he ran it back for a TD?!”

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Haha I did see that. Good stuff. I’m glad I was able to finally hear what Mangini and Daboll were saying.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

It’s actually a good show. It’s letting me learn a lot on the two and when Daboll talks he actually doesn’t sound like an idiot.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 15, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yea I really wish I could’ve seen it all. I looked on directv to see if it was playing again and found nothing.

Kill them. Kill them all.

by StuckInPa on Sep 15, 2010 10:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

how did you turn “rookie” into “rohaie”? that was kinda funny.

by Dawg Nuts on Sep 16, 2010 11:02 AM EDT up reply actions  

I saw it too. I loved that he bought his own jersey for his parents haha.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yeah I saw that part. He said he’s bought 10 or 12 of his jerseys — every time he sees them in the store — and sent them to his family. That’s what I would be doing if I played in the NFL.

. . . says the man from Columbus.

by Buckeye Brad on Sep 16, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Wonder if he actually bought the iPhones/iPads.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Sep 16, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, we know Geather didn’t get one at least.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 6:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Does anyone think we might move the ball more effectively with Seneca Wallace. He is more of a problem to defenses in that he is more mobile. Maybe with him and Cribbs in the game together, the Browns might be able to force defenses to think of more than just a short passing game when teh offense dont run Harrison or Hillis. Alot more option offense or Wildcat offense maybe? Wallace can be rolled out. I am not saying he will move the team better than Delhomme, just a different look than what the other teams may expect. THOUGHTS?

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 1:44 PM EDT reply actions  

I think it will be a different look for sure. I’m not sure how different, as this team will/should run the ball a lot anyway. I don’t know whether Wallace will be any better, because he has his own problems with decision making, but it will certainly be a different look.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

If Wallace plays I assume we will run the ball more.

However it happens, I want this team to run the ball.

by Bernie19Kosar on Sep 16, 2010 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

there really is no excuse for not having at least 25 rushes per game, unless we get down by a lot really early.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 16, 2010 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

KC media is hoping for Delhomme.
Seneca has that stretch to the Offense that Delhomme doesn’t.

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

he also has that “run out of bounds 3 yards behind the line” that Delhomme doesn’t.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 9:05 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, and I think you guys mentioned it earlier, but how easy is it too just toss the darn ball out of bounds before doing that? He struggles with that often.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

it really boggles the mind.

I have been complimented many times and they always embarrass me; I always feel that they have not said enough.

by notthatnoise on Sep 17, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions  

Do you think the Browns can win running 30- 35 times a game or the O-Line not that dominating to run that many times per game? A three back rotation?

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 6:38 PM EDT reply actions  

Did you just become a Browns fan over the off season and in no way saw last year’s last four games?

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Beating Pittsburgh and Jacksonville (who were teams that gave up) and inferior teams like Kansas City and Oakland by running the ball was impressive for a team that had won one game up till then, but I mean over a season, being able to run the ball and run the ball effectively to win week in and week out. Is it a lot to ask of the Offensive Line to support a one dimensional offense? The Browns have done it before in the modern era (1985 Browns with Byner and Mack). All I am asking do you think they can effectively move the ball being that one dimensional and post 6 or 7 wins?

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 8:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

No, it can’t. It was great over those four games but even a one dimensional game is very unsustainable and if not working, is very prone to implosion.

I can't believe Cribbs was considered the second best athlete in Cleveland.

LBJ. Lying. Backstabbing. Jackass.

by SpecialBrownie on Sep 16, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

relating to the Chiefs

If you can do one thing good build on that.
Last year Haley took fan abuse for giving up in the Philly game.
We just ran the ball for next to no yardage in the second half while we were losing.
the quote was something like

We are going to run the ball, we have to be able to run the ball

Win or lose you have to be good at something or you are just spinning your wheels

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 16, 2010 9:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

Win or lose you have to be good at something or you are just spinning your wheels

Agreed, win or lose, a team needs an identity. If you’re a rebuilding team, you need to build on that identity and incorporate the other missing parts along the way, but being able to identify and utilize your strong points is the first step.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

This also why the abandonment of the run game in week 1 for the Browns was such a head scratcher, ya Holmgren/Haskell want to incorporate more of the their philosophies with what Mangini/Daboll were already doing, but for such a lopsided display, questions were definitely raised.

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 1:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think so….see Jets VS Ravens game from last week for further proof. Ground and Pound days are over, unless your defense is completely stacked. Even with a stacked defense you can still lose due to lack of explosion…see Jets.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not saying the whole entire game. Not even reversing the numbers from last week (i.e. 38 runs v. 18 pass, or whatever) I’m saying thats our ID from last year, thats how we won, we have a hell of a FB in Vickers and the left side of the OL is pretty damn solid as well…..i believe what Mangini says when “theres no number of plays” that they’re specifically going to target certain people, but, when you have Robisikie for example, who had an excellent offseason, he at this point should be your definite #2 and get him more comfortable as the game goes on, throughout the whole game, and build on it the next week and the next and the next but we also have Stuckey, Moore, Watson, Cribbs, A. SMith, etc….that they want to get mixed in the game, which isn’t bad, it’s just an overload at this point in my opinion, when you’re trying to build someones confidence who had none whatsoever last year and is the type of player that realizes he did good in the offseason and isn’t going to make a big deal out of it until he proves something to himself in a real game situation (referring to Robiskie in case i lost ya)

by year of the elf on Sep 17, 2010 8:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think the Browns can post a .500 season doing that. However, I don’t think the Browns as currently constructed can post a .500 record with any offensive philosophy. Our best bet to win some games right now is to be a heavily run-centric team, and it’s not like we’re trying to develop Jake Delhomme for the future, so I say we pound it as much as possible.

by Chemo on Sep 17, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

The point has always been that until we get a better QB, we should be favored to running the ball. More runs than passes with Delhomme or Wallace at QB.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

every team with a non-franchise QB should build a Running game and an Offensive line.
That rookie with a rookie WR behind a rushing game and an O-line can shine enough to make a playoff run. Just look at Sanchez.

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 17, 2010 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agreed, although as stated above the ground and pound days are over and teams are rarely likely to be built solely on the run these days, a strong run enough run game should be there to keep defenses on their toes, which is why the tandem RB has been such a success…..defenses now have to prepare for two different styles of running, combine that with a somewhat competent passing game and you have that “flash in the pan” for the beginning of an offense, but you need to build upon it. Even in the passing game nowadays, you need multiple reliable options to throw the ball to, case in point, NO had 7 receivers that had MORE than 35 receptions last year (stats from the week 1NO v. MIN match up aired during the game)

by year of the elf on Sep 18, 2010 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Well that’s just dandy.

by emily522 on Sep 16, 2010 8:38 PM EDT reply actions  

I wasn’t going for Dandy, but you made me laugh! Ha!

by champion64 on Sep 16, 2010 8:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Interesting to see some of the confidence brimming from the Chiefs fans – probably some in the national media too.

Before we get ahead of ourselves, let’s put some context around the situation. The Browns played an out-of-conference game they disappointingly lost in soupy Florida in September (playing in Florida in September is tough for northern teams, no matter how you want to spin the fact that it was hot for a couple days in Cleveland).

The Chiefs played a division rival at home and on national MNF television.

Now, these two teams are playing at 1 pm ET on Sunday: the Browns in a home opener and feeling punchy after a frustrating loss; and the Chiefs on the road, a short week after an emotional victory.

This game is a test for Mangini – many of the “intangibles” are lining up in his favor. Let’s see if the team performs…

"Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge..." C. Darwin

by Spidey on Sep 17, 2010 1:16 AM EDT reply actions   1 recs

rec

But as far as the Chiefs, The Coaches know that Cleveland has talent.
Romeo had some input on that. I expect a Snot slobbering, hard hitting slugfest.
A very entertaining game for the Defensive minded fans to enjoy.
Kudos to Cleveland not being a SD or Oakland that cannot sell out the Home-opener :)

Ninja Ass

by Steve_Chiefs on Sep 17, 2010 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

Kudos to Cleveland not being a SD or Oakland that cannot sell out the Home-opener :)

We do have some pretty loyal fans, much appreciated.

I found it quite odd however that PFT already projected the STL @ DET game to be a blackout ( i believe week 4).As a fan of one of the worst teams in the league since their return, i kind of find it hard to believe fans would be less inclined to go to a game that they have a shot of winning, @ home.

by year of the elf on Sep 18, 2010 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions  

Alright guys, I´m going to hijack this thread. Time for Trautman to rescue Rambo.
What´s wrong with this quote, or rather right with it regarding a supposed predictablity of reality based on establishing a rate of statistical factualities, and peoples´ propensity to participate in helping or expecting the stastical trend to continue?:

“1. How long can Cutler survive?
Jay Cutler is a very talented quarterback but is playing with an offensive line and in a system that could see him get sacked 50-plus times. He got taken down 10 times in the preseason or once every 4.7 attempts. Dan Marino said he never heard of such a thing. Well, Cutler got sacked four times in the opener and if you look at all of his throws in the Mike Martz system, including preseason and regular season, he is getting whacked once every six throws. If Martz calls 500 passes this season, Cutler could go down close to 80 times. This week, Chicago travels to Dallas, which should make things even worse.”
Here is the rest of this article:
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d81a97779/article/while-cutler-tries-to-survive-cj2k-looks-to-keep-streaking?module=HP_cp2
As you can see, what I´m not going to do is become a member of some Bears forum to do it. Thankfully SBN is cross-referential, so chances are some Bears fans and constituents are reading this.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 9:47 AM EDT reply actions  

If he continues to take a beating like that, he will be out before the halfway point of the season. There is no excuse for letting a QB that you gave up an entire draft (nearly anyways) for to take that kind of abuse. Say what you want, but there is no excuse for it. Either provide him with quick drops, or upgrade your line, or something. Cutler will not last long with kind of abuse.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

The money put into Cutler apparently is not viewed as his, if he gets injured it´s a monetary loss to the organization and to the fans. Thus not really his money. His health becomes a factor that can be controlled according to how vulnerable he is made to be, or rather the validity of his salary versus approval of his performance.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

Approval of his performance will be hard to reach when he is being taken to the ground that often. If it continues, I would expect his decision making and timing to degrade quite frankly. That said, I was never sold on the fact that Cutler could become a great NFL QB. He has the skills and talent, but has not really proven it yet.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

The other thing I predict has happened, is that Mike Martz is forcing Jay Cutler to stay in the pocket no matter what. I consider Jay Cutler to be dual threat, he does not take sacks normally.
Jay Cutler´s punishment, or shall I say the attitude swayer in this equation, is forceably imposing Mike Martz´s will on Jay Cutler, which is assumed to be the Greatest Show on Turf Part Two. This is done through positive or negative play-calling, reinforcing predictable safe play out of Jay Cutler, through fan approval or disapproval. That means, if Jay takes off, Mike takes plays out of his play-book.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions  

4526 yards to a smorgasbord of receivers in Denver, in 2008, dinking and dunking, threading the needle successfully like no one has in a long time, says he´s not only talented and skilled, he´s effective.
How about these rushing stats out of non franchise running backs, adding up to 1862 yards?:
Michael Pittman 76 320
Peyton Hillis 68 343
Selvin Young 61 303
Jay Cutler 57 200
Tatum Bell 44 249
Andre Hall 35 144
P.J. Pope 17 130
Ryan Torain 15 69

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:16 AM EDT reply actions  

In other words, if history is not blind to his accomplishments in Denver, he is a great NFL quarterback.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

I didn´t want to get analytical here, but here are the factors we can affect here:
1. Jay Cutler
2. the receivers
3. the media
4. the FO
5. the stat department
Here is the factors we can´t control:
1. the offensive line
2. the opposing defense
3. use of a running back
4. Mike Martz
5. the NFL
6. rabid fans
7. the media

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

Year TD-INT
2007 20-14
2008 25-18
2009 27-26

1) I wouldn’t include Brandon Marshall in the terms of a smorgasbord of receivers.
2) Yards are there, but the stat I have above is my problem.
3) I’m not sure with that many INT’s you can call him a “great” NFL QB

If the decision making could get better (probably due to a poor O-line performance and zero receivers last year), then maybe he could be great. I just think he still isn’t proven. My opinion though, for what its worth. Either way, he won’t be doing anything for the Bears if he is getting tossed around by 300lb D-linemen all year. He did look really good in the opener though with over 350yds passing, and 2TD’s.

A lot of people are afraid of heights. Not me, I'm afraid of widths --- Steven Wright

by Kimble_79 on Sep 17, 2010 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions  

What you say makes sense, logically at least.
I see a greater predicament at this point though.
Can the Bears degrade Jay Cutler enough, to make him unattractive to potential future employers? I would say, due to the receivers marooning him last year, and the offensive line this year, that trend has been established.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

The point is, neither the team, nor the fans, nor the media, nor his teammates, are taking the hit on this. I won´t mention Lovie or DeAngelo, they allowed this travesty to ensue, past tense, too late.
I think it´s time for Jay Cutler to count his chickens and hightail it out of there, before they can him.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions  

I don´t want to put it all on Pat Kirwan, but if in his capacity as an influential reporter, this statement does not spell gloom and doom, for Jay Cutler individually, once again I chalenge you, what does it spell?:
"1. How long can Cutler survive?
Jay Cutler is a very talented quarterback but is playing with an offensive line and in a system that could see him get sacked 50-plus times. He got taken down 10 times in the preseason or once every 4.7 attempts. Dan Marino said he never heard of such a thing. Well, Cutler got sacked four times in the opener and if you look at all of his throws in the Mike Martz system, including preseason and regular season, he is getting whacked once every six throws. If Martz calls 500 passes this season, Cutler could go down close to 80 times. This week, Chicago travels to Dallas, which should make things even worse."

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 10:47 AM EDT reply actions  

What I see once again, similar to in Denver, is a propensity for certain media representatives to seek consensus with choice fan advocates, to how shall I put it, entice a situation on the field, that vindicates their prophesies.

by mooncamping on Sep 17, 2010 11:15 AM EDT reply actions  

You are quite the Cutler fan.

by Roger Dorn on Sep 17, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Not in a DeNiro as a sociopath way. But, yes, very.

by mooncamping on Sep 18, 2010 11:09 AM EDT reply actions   2 recs

Kirwan could have said “the line sucks”. But he decided to put the focal point on a statistical trend and the consequent threat to Jay Cutler´s health. I take this seriously.

by mooncamping on Sep 19, 2010 7:40 AM EDT reply actions  

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