Possible Off-Season Targets: Fred Davis
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 12, 2011 9:00 PM EST
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PrintAs the season winds down, it's time for us to take a look at who could be a front office target this summer.
Who, what, when, where, why and how much?
We start with Washington Redskins TE Fred Davis.
Contract Status for 2012: Unrestricted Free Agent
Why we want him: We need playmakers, and right now Davis has quietly become one of the better young TE's in the NFL. Plus, he is a field stretching TE. As you see he is averaging 13.5 YPC this season, but last season he averaged 15.0 YPC.
According to Football Outsiders Davis ranks as the 6th best TE in the NFL this season. Pretty good considering he ranks behind Rob Gronkowski, Jimmy Graham, Tony Gonzalez, Antonio Gates and Jermicheal Finley. Every single one of those TE's have Pro Bowl QB's. Davis has been doing his damage with Rex Grossman and John Beck.
I know the Browns have a decent set of TE's, but Davis is miles better than what we have. Ben Watson has been a disappointment this season, Alex Smith is the prototypical version of replaceable, Evan Moore is a complete question mark and Jordan Cameron is an unknown.
My ideal world would be let Smith and Watson go (Watson's deal is up after 2012, and I couldn't care less what Smith's contract situation is), replace them with Cameron and Davis. This would give the Browns three TE's that would be ideal pass catchers in a West Coast offense (I assume Cameron is a fit, otherwise we wouldn't have drafted him).
Plus, we would get younger. Davis, 25, is the kind of guy we want to target, he is young and have a lot of tread left on the tires, as he has only 131 catches and has been a back-up up until this season.
Why he fits what we need: Again, the guy catches the football. If we stick with Colt, he has shown that he "likes" to throw underneath. How nice would it be to have a TE that could open up the middle of the field? Run Davis down the seam and let Norwood destroy Linebackers underneath over the middle.
Davis gives the Browns a young athletic TE that we haven't had since a healthy Winslow the Wizard.
Why he would come here: Money. Bags and bags of money. How much? Don't know. If I had to guess, I would wager somewhere north of the Owen Daniels contract (Four years, 22 million). I would love 5 years for 30 million. Before you start saying "Wow, that seems like a lot of money", it's going to be a good deal once the current crop of TE's (Gronk, Jimmy Graham, Finley) get their deals.
I think within three years, a lot of TE's are going to start getting WR money. Get in now while we can get a "deal".
Plus, the chance to return home. Fred Davis was born and raised in Toledo, Ohio. Attended Rogers High School and was a highly recruited WR. Chose to attend USC over The Ohio State (some believe that Pete Carrol worked some of his "magic" to get the Ohio boy out of the Scarlet and Gray).
Doesn't seem like he has any real ties to Cleveland, but coming home is always a factor, no matter how minor it may be.
Why the Redskins will let him go: This is where it gets tricky. The reason Davis has played sparingly before this season was because Chris Cooley, the all-time leader in TE catches and yards, was ahead of him. The question is, do the Redskins keep Davis and Cooley? Do the Redskins cut Cooley and keep Davis? Cooley is only 29 years old, but has struggled with injuries as of late.
Cooley is expensive (6 years, 30 million) and Mike Shanahan reportedly loves back-up TE Logan Paulsen. Can the Skins afford to sign Davis to the same contract that Cooley has? Seems like a lot of money.
They could use the franchise tag on Davis, but that is another spendy ticket. Last season the TE franchise tag cost teams 7.3 million dollars (again, this number could skyrocket if some of the younger guys sign extensions before next season). That would be over 12 million dollars in just Davis and Cooley alone. A lot of money for a team that could be looking for a WR, OL and QB in the off-season.
Finally, Davis is under suspension for Drugs. He reportedly failed a drug test twice for marijuana. Don't get me wrong, a guy coming up to his biggest pay day getting popped for weed is a bad sign. Can it be overcome?
I think there is a chance Davis gets tagged, put a gun to my head I would put it at 40%.
So, what do you feel we should do?
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You can work around that in the contract.
Fail a drug test, lose money. Money keeps everyone on the straight and narrow.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 12, 2011 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
I doubt the agent would push for a team that is making you sign contract based on drug usage. There would be a team willing to not include that sort of language and the agent would push the player to sign with those teams.
I would be surprised that any team would sign a guy of a drug suspension without some sort of CYA in the contract. It’s possible though.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 13, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
As long as it’s not performance enhancing I don’t really care.
"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway
by notthatnoise on Dec 13, 2011 7:40 AM EST up reply actions
It’s the responsibility of an NFL player to expect to be a role model for children. I don’t condone the use of pot even though I was a pot head for over 8 years. Hell, I’ll take a puff, and regret it, a few times a year. Honestly, I don’t care who does it. But if you’re in a position where the NFL says "no", then you shouldn’t be doing it. It’s the RULES and I don’t want him on the team.
by Brownie's Year on Dec 13, 2011 4:42 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t care if my players are good role models. I want wins.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 13, 2011 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
It’s hard to win when one of your best players are suspended for being an idiot. How many positive drug tests till you say “no thanks”? It’s not that hard of a decision, bro.
by Brownie's Year on Dec 14, 2011 1:13 AM EST up reply actions
It’s a calculated decision. I don’t want to fill the entire roster with guys just fresh from the joint, but we need to take some risks.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 14, 2011 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
neither do I really outside of the threat of future suspensions.
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by bross09 on Dec 13, 2011 6:13 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
This would be a waste of a large chunk of money. TE is way off the care o meter.
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Look at the good offenses in the NFL. They are all using their TE’s.
TE has been a huge disappointment to me this season, I see it as a place where we really need to upgrade.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 12, 2011 10:18 PM EST up reply actions
Look at the good offenses in the NFL. They are all using their TE’s.
Then how is this Watson’s, Moore’s or Smith’s problem? Let’s retitle the article “FA Coaches”.
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 12, 2011 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
You can’t blame every damn thing on the coaches.Jesus Christ, all this whining about we need this coach, and we need that coach. No the only coaching change i would tove to see happen is special teams. Other then that. We are fine. Shurmer is in his first season ever as a head coach. I’m pretty sure you wouldn’t be able to do his job better then him. Now i wouldn’t mind bringing in a younger TE he’s big and got some decent wheels. I love watson, but he just isn’t big. And he is a little older. And the only reason why we have alex smith is because he can “block” so what? Waste of space. 3 TE’s is plenty. This guy, moore and cameron would be fine by me. Blocking can be taught, not speed and size.
by lightninmcqueen on Dec 12, 2011 10:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Watson has great size for a TE. You think a blocking Smith is wasted space? Go ask Pashos then. We have no clue what the hell Cameron is. I’m not going to drop assured talent in Watson to pay this guy big money for Shurmur’s crap play calling to just waste it.
You know why everyone bitches about the coaching? Because it’s relevant to why we suck. The scheme is awful, the playcalling is awful. Watson and Moore were great last year in a DABOLL offense, meow McCoy’s best relief valves just all the sudden suck? You wanna know why they do? Becxause the scheme they’re in screws them over. Until we get a scheme that would better implement an expensive TE then fine, but not now. And until then, I will bitch about the shitty coaching BECAUSE IT’S SHITTY.
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 12, 2011 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
Ysomadbro? And no people are so impatiant. What did you expect. Shurmer was gonna come in here and we were going to be the packers? It takes time. We have the YOUNGRST team in the NFL obviously it’s going to take time to start getting the W’s
by lightninmcqueen on Dec 12, 2011 10:56 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Yaomingbitch.jpg.
So explain to be how veterans like Watson and Moore suck then? Because the offense is awful. I mean you can sit in your recliner with no friends and lose for the rest of your life; that’s fine. But just because you sit and watch Pat Shurmur for ten years doesn’t mean he’s going to turn into an amazing coach. So how about you quit changing the subject because I blew your TE argument out the water? Comeatmebro.jpg.
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 12, 2011 11:01 PM EST up reply actions
Ha.Haha.Hahahahaha.
I never said they sucked, just i’d prefer davis. You can blame Moores lack of production on the coaches. But not because of the scheme but because of the numbers of plays he recieves. Only in “red zone situations” i’d love for him to be in a lot more. Watson just isn’t as fast any more. Like i said i love yhe guy and the passion he has. But this is a buisness. And i’d rather take the younger, more talented guy and take the risk, then the older guy with not as much production. Because you have nothing else to blame except the coaches. The coaches don’t play yhe game for the players. Good players play what the coaches want. No matter the scheme. justservedbro.
by lightninmcqueen on Dec 12, 2011 11:31 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Good players play what the coaches want.
So, you agree with me then? Because Watson is playing a shitty scheme for Shurmur that ruins his production?
Good to know.
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 12, 2011 11:47 PM EST up reply actions
No. If watson was better, he would producting in shurmers scheme. But he isn’t because he diesn’t have the right skill set. Cameron and moore do.
by lightninmcqueen on Dec 13, 2011 12:08 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
You have no damn clue if they have the skill set or not. We’ve seen Cameron once and Moore in the endzone. That’s it.
But you’re saying though, that Shurmur’s system is perfect and the ONLY REASON our TEs suck as a whole in the system is because Watson sucks?
Uh huh.
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 13, 2011 12:16 AM EST up reply actions
This whole time you’ve just stick words in my mouth, i never said shurmers system is perfect, is there flaws? Yes. Is he ridiculously stupid at some of the play calls he makes? Yea. But if watson was better. He would be able to make it work, and true about cameron, my bad. But moore does. And why would it hurt? We have the money? Were not using it on anything else. Shurmer is going to need time to get settled in. This the first season shurmer, jauron, and all the coaches have coached together. In time we’ll get better. Look at the saints. First year brees was there, thry were horrible, brees didn’t have the arm, the size. But they built around him, a few years down the rode and they have a super bowl win and brees is an elite QB. I think that’s what H&H are trying to do. Clone the saints.
by lightninmcqueen on Dec 13, 2011 12:54 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Look at the saints. First year brees was there, thry were horrible,
They won their division.
by Brownie's Year on Dec 13, 2011 2:35 AM EST up reply actions
Butyusomad?
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by SpecialBrownie on Dec 13, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions
Then how is this Watson’s, Moore’s or Smith’s problem?
Because they aren’t very good?
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 13, 2011 11:15 PM EST up reply actions
But Shurmur’s offense is world destroying? Mhm…
XBL - TheRabbit087. Get at me.
by SpecialBrownie on Dec 15, 2011 1:32 AM EST up reply actions
TE has been a huge disappointment to me this season, I see it as a place where we really need to upgrade.
Gronkowski and Graham are at the level. Fred Davis, I just don’t see it.
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I’ve watched a few Skins games this year because I had the horrible three-headed monster of Hightower-Torain-Helu in my fantasy backfield. (Incoherent mumbling about Shanahan). Davis is a legitimate down field threat. I’m not saying we should definitely get him, but he is a better receiver than Gronkowski and has WR speed/hands combined with TE size. He can stretch a defense.
I’m not convinced that TE is a high position of need with our current personnel at the position, but not only would Davis be our best TE, he’d be our best WR bar none right now.
As for the Skins, I think they let Cooley and his contract go and either sign Davis or franchise tag him unless they’ve had enough of his herbal life. I’ve never seen Paulson play, though, so that plays a factor, but I don’t know how much.
by chitown browns fan on Dec 13, 2011 8:35 AM EST up reply actions
Haven’t seen any skins games, so I don’t know about him much beyond stats. Get younger, bigger and better at catching the ball at the TE spot – yes, if the price is right. We still need a RG, RT, & 2 WR’s that don’t have butter on there hands, and that’s just the offense. Dont get me started on the defense.
Same here, I have watched probably 5 games this season. Davis has big time skills.
by Bernie19Kosar on Dec 13, 2011 11:16 PM EST up reply actions
5/30 seems a little steep, I think we would have to cut Watson to even consider it. I do think Watson will get the axe this offseason.
He’s a good player, but I don’t see the front office going after him or the Redskins letting him go. Cooley won’t be a factor in their decision, he sucks at this point.
unless the Redskins are going to cut Cooley or rework his contract, he will play a part in the decision because of his large deal.
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I think Cooley’s done as far as the Redskins are concerned. Davis is better than Cooley is or was in terms of catching and running. Blocking may be a different story; I can’t comment on that.
by chitown browns fan on Dec 14, 2011 12:08 AM EST up reply actions
I would take a chance on him. I agree to let Watson go – but Alex Smith is a nice blocking TE that would bring alot more to the table than Cameron – who really is more of an Evan Moore type. The only justification for keeping Cameron is that he was drafted by Heckert. Nothing else.
Change isn't good or bad it just "is". Don Draper of Madmen
Cameron has size, hands, and bigtime athletic ability. Those are pretty good reasons.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Emily’s reasons:
1. Google images results of “Jordan Cameron.”
2. Nothing else.
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by emily522 on Dec 14, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
yea we should just get all TEs. forget everything else. We’ll call it the Tight Coast Offense where we have a tight end literally play EVERY position.
Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?
We already tried that with fullbacks.
by jonnyphoenix on Dec 13, 2011 9:58 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
OK Off topic a bit here but if the IDIOTS that are the reporters ask one more F**ing time about what procedures were followed before the put McCoy back in the game I am going to puke. How many more times must Shurmur say the sideline procedures were followed and he did not show any warning signs of a concussion?? It is not like McCoy was 21 of 25 and threw for 300 yards at that point and we needed a game winning drive to make the playoffs. I would think if there was any doubt Shurmur would have pulled him. Reporters are just trying to make it an issue. I think Shurmur is actually handling this situation well. Finally I get to compliement him.
I think they know he is lying. MKC has said that Shurmur has avoided answering the question directly.
Rec
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by Red-Right-88 on Dec 13, 2011 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
Don’t you think that if they thought if McCoy was hurt they would have removed him? There is no story in Cleveland so they are trying to make a story. The Cleveland reporters are awful. Grossi, Cabot, forget them. In the speed of the game and remember Wallace was good when he was in there for a play, McCoy said he was ok, and the medical staff said he was ok, and remember Shurmur is still the OC so he was not over on the bench checking out McCoy so he went with what the medical staff said. Shurmur to me seems to be avoiding pointing any fingers because in the end it is a non issue. Now if McCoy has a concussion and they FORCE him to start this week against medical clearance then there is a story, Thursday night was a non issue. In retrospect I think it would have been better for the offense and McCoy if her were pulled
I think if they didn’t think McCoy suffered a concussion on that play, then they (the coaches and training staff) are incompetent.
In retrospect I agree. I am just saying the medical staff said he was ok, and I dont think it was thought through enough because of the timing in the game. We all watched it and no one thought anymore about it till after the game. He obviously was calling plays in the huddle and it wasnt like he wasn’t functioning. I guess my point is now with all the stuff that can be seen due to 3 million camera angles, we are asking everyone to be perfect and they are not. I could see if he was throwing up or could not stand or was running the wrong plays, but it did not seem that way. I think they made a decision and he seemed ready to go, and it was the wrong one. I don’t think they will make that decision like that again. The concussion thing is much over played. Concussions many times do NOT show up till hours or days after the incident, so he may have tested fine and reacted fine and was ready to go. Everyone is acting like he was out and they used smelling salts and taped him up and sent him out there dead on his feet. That was not the case in my opinion
He obviously was calling plays in the huddle and it wasnt like he wasn’t functioning.
I’ve been concussed before and and afterwards I must have appeared to be functioning normally. But I couldn’t vouch for that personally because I didn’t remember the things that others told me I did. That’s why I think if the league was really serious about handling concussions nobody would be bothering to say things like, “and he said he felt alright.”
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Off topic, but there are like 6 different threads related to Colt’s concussion and its handling on the front page, you could have just posted there instead of starting yet another Colt’s concussion/Shurmur should be fired thread. Not trying to be a mod or anything, just thought it was funny that a conversation not related to Colt’s brain could turn into another one.
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by JustBob on Dec 13, 2011 5:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
For everybody that keeps talking about what a great blocking TE Alex Smith is, I just don’t see it. Almost every time the announcers mention his name, it’s a bad thing. It’s either a dropped pass, a missed block, a fumble, or (my favorite) him getting completely pancaked. They must have replayed him getting pancaked during that Steelers game 4 times while talking about it. Maybe the bad things are just sticking out more to me, but I think more realistically the problem is that there are more bad things to say about him than good. He should have been cut during the Steelers game after he got pancaked and told he had to pay his own way back to Cleveland. The reason our TEs have been less productive this year is because Colt has no time to throw and we have no real run game to buy him any time or to draw people off the pass coverage. Ben Watson is a great guy and he’s working hard, but his injuries are piling up and he’s getting older. The time to find his replacement is now even if you don’t think the answer is Fred Davis.
Smith just isn’t that good in any phase of the game.
"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein
Yet the coaching staff has him getting significant playing time at two positions.
by chitown browns fan on Dec 14, 2011 12:14 AM EST up reply actions
Is that significant as in a large number of reps or significant as in a total failure when he is in?
"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened."
— Winston S. Churchill
I have the best wife - ever.
RG, RT, S, CB, DE, LB, LB, WR, WR are positions we should be looking at. OC and ST coaches even. TE is not a position devoid of talent on this team.
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by The New Kardiac Kids on Dec 15, 2011 10:05 AM EST reply actions
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