Cleveland Browns Draft Bust #2: Brady Quinn

by Chris Pokorny on Apr 14, 2011 7:03 PM EDT

I don't think many people can go back and blame the Browns front office for making this deal. They had already drafted Joe Thomas with the third overall pick in the draft, and the talk of the first round was that Brady Quinn was quickly falling. Cleveland gave up their first-round pick for the following year (and their second rounder in 2007) to move up to No. 22 overall, but that did not seem to matter at the time as it seemed like we got our quarterback of the future one year early.

Quinn basically sat on the bench during his rookie season thanks to a shocking surge by Derek Anderson, who ended up making the Pro Bowl. Quinn also hurt himself in his rookie year by staging a lengthy holdout to start training camp. Anderson kept the starting job in 2008, but after the team started the year at 3-5 with Anderson struggling, Quinn made his first start against the Denver Broncos. It was a great first showing, but over the next two weeks he completed only about 40% of his passes. Part of the reason was that he broke his finger during his second start, which ended his season just as fans were excited about him.

Quinn was given the starting job to start the 2009 campaign, but had difficulty moving the offense and lost his job mid-way through the third week of the season to Anderson. He returned in a Monday Night game later that season against the Baltimore Ravens. I attended that game and let me tell you, it was the most pathetic offensive display I have ever seen in person. The Browns did not trust Quinn to throw the ball down the field. He tried to debunk that belief the following week as he lit up the Detroit Lions (the game Matthew Stafford suffered his injury), and he also had a good statistical effort two games later. When the Browns started having an unbelievable stretch with the ground game under Jerome Harrison, Quinn could not capitalize despite the fact that defenses were focused on the run. He missed the final two games due to a foot injury.

In March 2010, Quinn was dealt for a fullback. "Ha, a FULLBACK!" was the common joke around the league. I do not thank Quinn for making that possible, I thank Josh McDaniels for giving away an awesome running back in Peyton Hillis. When you look at what Quinn did as a member of the Browns considering he was a first-round pick, he was a complete bust. Tim Couch contributed more to this team than Quinn ever did.

Only one more bust remains -- stay tuned Friday to find out who that is!

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BradyQuinnIsBust

Evil wins again, but Truth prevails where Good fails.

by North Coast Flea on Apr 14, 2011 7:54 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs

to me, the brady quinn situation was a tragic one for the browns (to the extent that football players not being any could can be defined as “tragic”). he had all the makings of the browns’ version of tom brady: the qb, face of the franchise, who solely and exclusively wanted to win, was willing to work harder than anyone in the building, and wasn’t afraid to stand up to other players slacking off (see: shaun smith and the case of the dumbell to the quarterback’s face). he was our guy who was going to set the tone in the building for the next decade, and tell the randy mosses of the world, “hey, this is how we do things here … if you don’t like it, get the f out.”

there was only one problem: he stunk.

funny thing is that if he’d been at camp on time his rookie season he probably would have started from day 1. i don’t know if he would have been any better in that situation, but i’m close w/ a few people who were in the facility that year and said brady would likely have been the guy ahead of frye and da. at the very least, we would have found out he sucked a lot faster and not had to waste time on going back and forth b/w him and da.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 14, 2011 8:05 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs

Agree with all of this.

I’d like to think that we are all better fans for suffering through this QB nightmare of humiliating futility. Once our franchise leader is firmly established — and I believe McCoy is well on his way to doing that — we will appreciate and support him all the more.

In theory there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice there is. -- Yogi Berra

by JustPlainBrowns on Apr 14, 2011 8:14 PM EDT up reply actions

Should be told to every QB that wants to hold out.

Get your money, but get your ass in camp.

by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 15, 2011 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions

There was always the rumor that Savage wanted a hold out and didn’t offer a fair deal. Can’t remember the rationale now.

by Roger Dorn on Apr 16, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions

QBs are definitely in a special situation when it comes to holding out. They are more like middle managers in a corporate sense and I think holding out for $10 million instead of $9 million per year alienates a lot of the locker room and the coaching staff. When you have to have guys sacrificing their bodies to keep you from getting hit that is a recipe for disaster.
I never thought Quinn was much of a likable guy. He always struck me as a bit pompous. It is hard to say how much of an affect this had on his relationship with the rest of the team but it likely had some effect. And when he didn’t perform and let the team down in a lot of situations, that probably worsened the situation.

Brownsyup

by Brownsyup on Apr 15, 2011 7:54 AM EDT up reply actions

Not to get political (hopefully), but didn’t Quinn campaign for McCain in 2008? Being openly political probably isn’t the best idea for a guy who has to be a team leader.

"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway

by notthatnoise on Apr 15, 2011 8:47 AM EDT up reply actions

I agree. there is a reason why we don’t talk politics here. Politics is a very divisive issue and not something you bring up in mixed company (that an religion)

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 15, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions

I wish more people knew about this. I hate it when people bring stuff like that up in social gatherings.

"Quote goes here."

by Adrock2099 on Apr 15, 2011 6:51 PM EDT up reply actions

Too bad just about everything is political.

In theory there is no difference between theory and practice.
In practice there is. -- Yogi Berra

by JustPlainBrowns on Apr 15, 2011 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions

I think holding out pretty much doomed him.

by emily522 on Apr 15, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions

A lot of very good QBs held out, and still turned into very good QBs. See, for example, Phillip Rivers. His holdout as a rookie also cost him the starting job most likely, but he seemed to turn out OK.

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions

The nature of Quinn’s holdout was pretty stupid and probably hurt more than the actual holdout.

by The Grimace on Apr 16, 2011 1:25 AM EDT up reply actions

Totally agree.

The Tim Couch comment from CP & DCMJ, dude Couch was a very good QB… It’s hard to be effective when your on your back that with heavy fat assed DL on you. In all fairness, TC would have been good, dont know about great if we had a decent OL, we didn’t so Couch takes the blame? Thats BS! He did work hard at his job and tried with what meager protection that he had. Butch put us off on a bad foundation, and tragedy just followed.

"They kept throwing it at me. I don’t know why. They just kept trying, and I just kept knocking it down." - Joe Hayden, Cleveland Browns.

by J. W. on Apr 16, 2011 4:17 AM EDT up reply actions

I think if Couch went to the Eagles and we got McNabb that Couch would have had a better career than McNabb had with the Eagles.

Evil wins again, but Truth prevails where Good fails.

by North Coast Flea on Apr 16, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions

both to you and to JW … couch just was not that good. he really wasn’t. a lot of browns fans like to romanticize couch’s qb ability, but his numbers were terrible, his throwing motion was atrocious, and he ran a run and shoot in college. he was never going to be a good pro qb.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 18, 2011 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions

I will say the two bums played two very, very exciting games. Anderson and his shootout with Cincy. And Quinn and his shootout with Detroit.
Of course they both had other decent games, but these were just crazy

by The naome40 on Apr 14, 2011 8:28 PM EDT via mobile reply actions

Only one more bust remains — stay tuned Friday to find out who that is!

Does anyone here NOT know who it is? Golan, wherever he is hiding, may be upset about him being on the list.

"There is a small, but important difference between peeing in the pool and peeing into the pool." - Demitri Martin

by Browns town on Apr 14, 2011 9:45 PM EDT reply actions

Eric Mangini?

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions

I don’t think he should be first on the list. He belongs in the top three, but I have a hard time seeing quinn as anything but first. He cost us an extra second round pick and the first we took him with was likely lower than the first we traded. He then set our team back years as he struggled to play QB. The other guy we’re talking about contributed pretty much nothing, but at least he didn’t drag our team down with him.

"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway

by notthatnoise on Apr 15, 2011 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions

This.

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions

Quinn actually played though, and stuck around for more than a year.

Evil wins again, but Truth prevails where Good fails.

by North Coast Flea on Apr 15, 2011 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions

Quinn actually played.

by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 16, 2011 12:56 AM EDT up reply actions

At some point though, the gigantic extra cost associated with him should override that. Veikune never played, sure, but that also means he didn’t directly hurt the team, as it could be argued Quinn did. He also didn’t force us to essentially waste two seasons hoping he would turn a corner while the rest of the team floundered because of it.

"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway

by notthatnoise on Apr 16, 2011 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions

I don’t think CP was considering that factor a ton. He probably was considering it, but just slightly. You notice BQ was one of only 2 first rounders in the top 10? we had some bad draft picks that could be argued were more detrimental to the team than the busts listed (Courtney Brown, BE) but I think CP was looking at these in somewhat of a vacuum which is why we are getting some interesting names.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 16, 2011 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions

Opportunity cost should be considered in my opinion. The difference in OC between Quinn and Veikune is massive.

by Roger Dorn on Apr 16, 2011 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions

I agree it should be considered at least somewhat, and i think it was. I probably would have considered it more, but all that would do is just switch 1 and 2 but only maybe (even with OC, its close who is a bigger bust). the OC difference is massive, but I also think the bust factor is fairly massively in favor of veikune at this point.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 17, 2011 1:33 AM EDT up reply actions

We invested a helluva lot more in Quinn. In terms of picks, years, coaching jobs, GM jobs, and rebuilds. No linebacker outside of Ray Lewis has that sort of franchise impact.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 17, 2011 4:30 AM EDT up reply actions

I think that the main problem with Quinn was just how the staff went about him. Short and screen passes and then pulling him for Anderson at one point? That combined with the holdout he had at the beginning equaled a quality draftee who couldn’t and never will reach his full potential. Or 10% of his potential for that matter.

by macdowellm03 on Apr 14, 2011 9:48 PM EDT reply actions

Just because a short pass is what was thrown doesn’t mean the passing concept only involved short routes.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 14, 2011 11:34 PM EDT up reply actions

I think we’ve seen Quinn’s potential, and the play calls and the way the organization handled him didn’t lower it significantly. He just plain sucked, and I say this as a former Quinn believer.

"There is a small, but important difference between peeing in the pool and peeing into the pool." - Demitri Martin

by Browns town on Apr 15, 2011 12:03 AM EDT up reply actions

The telling thing to me about Quinn is what he has done since he was traded. Denver does not have a stellar, face-of-the-franchise QB and Quinn has hardly seen the field. And he hasn’t been traded to anyone else either. Not all those scouts and front offices are wrong. I think Quinn will be a career backup and that career is going to be fairly short. Think Ty Detmer.

Brownsyup

by Brownsyup on Apr 15, 2011 7:57 AM EDT up reply actions

Come to think of it, Detmer had a fairly long career as a backup. A sweet deal if you can get it.

Brownsyup

by Brownsyup on Apr 15, 2011 7:58 AM EDT up reply actions

in fairness, kyle orton is really slept on as a talent, but your point is taken.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 15, 2011 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions

Re Quinn and Denver, and supporting your point, Josh McDaniels has one talent that I don’t think can be underestimated—he knows how to get the best out of what his QB has. BQ looked awful, just awful, the times we saw him in preseason in Denver.

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions

The silver lining in all this was we got Hillis, and, most importantly, no pink #10 jerseys.

by johnnyphoenix on Apr 15, 2011 12:35 AM EDT reply actions

For real, that was a nice trade.

I have not yet begun to procrastinate.

by NYSteelersFan4 on Apr 15, 2011 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions

I hoped for the best and tried to be in Quinn’s corner as I do with every Browns draft pick. But I was never high on him. Quite frankly, he sucked in nearly every big game I saw him play at ND. I never saw him in high school and I remember being disappointed that he chose ND over Ohio State. When I finally saw him play, I was glad he made that choice. Happy for the Buckeyes, that is.

Out of all the draft busts, at least we got something great out of that whole debacle. Peyton the Beast.

"Do I talk to myself? No, I just remind myself of what I’m trying to do. You know, I never answer myself so how can I be talking to myself?" - Ricky Henderson

by dawgtribe on Apr 15, 2011 4:23 AM EDT reply actions

i’m no quinn apologist, but he was awesome at ND. let’s be fair.

we’ve been over the “sucked in big game” argument here ad nauseum, so i won’t get back into it now.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 15, 2011 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions

I think the best series Quinn ever played was in his rookie year when DA hurt his hand in the (San Fran?) game. Quinn came in for a series and engineered a nice drive that resulted in Edwards and Winslow both dropping passes in the end zone before Dawson put up 3.

That brief showing made me think that maybe he had something good to offer, but the more he played the further down hill he slid.

I am effing hurdling you and you can't stop me.

by JustBob on Apr 15, 2011 6:51 AM EDT reply actions

His best game I think was probably against Denver in ’08 but that was against an awful pass D.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 15, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions

his best game was clearly the loss to detroit where he threw for 12,619 yards and 61 td’s. i agree w/ JustBob, though, that the best he ever looked was in that SF game. i was really excited at that point.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 15, 2011 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions

forgot about detroit. I thought that was the best he looked, though I don’t remember the SF game.

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 15, 2011 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions

He came in for a series when DA hurt his hand. He almost had a TD, but there were 2 drops.

by emily522 on Apr 15, 2011 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions

in that SF game. i was really excited at that point.

Sigh. Me too…

by emily522 on Apr 15, 2011 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions

One thing that stands out to me now with my analysis super-powers granted me by the DBN gods, is that this pick makes no sense when looking at the NFL Draft Point Value Chart. The move up from pick 35 to pick 22 is worth about 230 points. That is a third round pick. Instead we gave up a first round pick the next year which if you were to take the average pick (because at the time you don’t know where you’ll pick next year) is worth about 1000 points. That is giving up a lot… too much in fact. That year our actual pick would have been 22 which is valued at 780. That is still a REALLY bad deal. What the Browns gave up is more like what you would do if you didn’t trade your second round pick at all but just gave them next year’s first. I remember at the time not thinking it was that bad… am I missing something here? Because from a value point of view, this was a terrible move.

Brownsyup

by Brownsyup on Apr 15, 2011 7:46 AM EDT reply actions

Agree. Glad that regime is gone.

Go Brownies!!!

by vinakron on Apr 15, 2011 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions

I mean, if you think you’re getting a franchise QB, it’s worth it to overpay. That said, we didn’t know what we were getting in Quinn, so I’m not sure it was worth it at the time. Making blockbuster deals at the draft is always a huge risk, and one that I would prefer not to take.

"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway

by notthatnoise on Apr 15, 2011 8:54 AM EDT up reply actions

wasn’t Quinn considered one of the safest picks?

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 15, 2011 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions

not by about 21 teams (including the browns)…

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 15, 2011 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions

I was more talking about from the outside. analysts viewed him as very safe…and 21 teams passing doesn’t mean a ton because after a certain point, teams are not going to spend a 1st rounder on a QB even if he is “safe”

I teach good life choices. That’s why I almost didn’t graduate High School.
Intensive Purposes? I could care less...
your whole argument is a fallacy!

by bross09 on Apr 15, 2011 2:19 PM EDT up reply actions

Don’t tell kwoog that — I’ve been beating this drum for years, i.e., that we overpaid like crazy for the draft pick to get Quinn. And kwoog (and others) have told me I was crazy that the trade made sense.

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions

mostly what i remember is tons of disagreement over the actual cost for Quinn

by Villeslgr on Apr 15, 2011 6:54 PM EDT up reply actions

Peyton Hillis was worth it.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 15, 2011 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

I believe it’s exactly the same price thats been historically paid… For example, what Ozzie gave up to get Boller.

The idea that you could have got that pick for only the next year’s 1st, or that year’s 2nd and 3rd is utterly laughable.

www.lowbrowsophisticate.com

by kwoog on Apr 15, 2011 9:30 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions

If you think that a QB is going to be “the guy” then you pay the price.

Even though Quinn didn’t live up to expectations, it was the right move to make.

by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 16, 2011 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions

The value chart underrates late first round picks in the first place, and the chart was irrelevant in that situation considering the circumstances. Everyone knew we needed back in to the first round.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 15, 2011 7:55 PM EDT up reply actions

plus, everything that i read and heard (including from inside berea) was that the ravens were working the phones to try to get down and snag quinn. given the browns’ need at the position AND the opportunity to deny a division rival, it’s hard to argue that they overpaid.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 15, 2011 8:48 PM EDT up reply actions

I vote we never speak of this man again.

It’s not a lie if you believe it.

by Brownie's Year on Apr 15, 2011 10:48 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs

Yup.

by emily522 on Apr 15, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions

what is worse is that Mangini refused to trade quinn when he had the chance for a 1st RD DC plus another high draft choice when we could have.

by sleepy042 on Apr 15, 2011 11:27 AM EDT reply actions

what is worse is that Mangini refused to trade quinn when he had the chance for a 1st RD DC plus another high draft choice when we could have.

No one, no one, and I really mean no one, ever offered Mangini a first round pick for Quinn, let alone a first round pick and another high draft choice. That is just a laughably absurd assertion. I doubt we could have gotten a third rounder for him after his first two seasons. Sure, he was not a proven bust yet, but he was not a proven anything, and there were good reasons to believe he wouldn’t amount to sh!t. You really think that after essentially the entire NFL passed on him in the 1st round in 2007, that what he showed in 2007 and 2008 (ie nothing) made them reconsider his value as a 1st rounder, AND give up another high round draft choice. Seriously. . . ..

2010 Official DBN League Fantasy Football Champion

by TheDriveStillHurts on Apr 15, 2011 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions

Maybe he was thinking of Derek after his ridonkulous 2007 season. I remember hearing we could have gotten a 1st and a 3rd for him.

"Quote goes here."

by Adrock2099 on Apr 15, 2011 6:56 PM EDT up reply actions

That referred to the tender we could have offered him, not any actual picks we were offered if I remember correctly.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 15, 2011 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions

The rumor was Minnesota offered their first rounder for Quinn.

Savage told them no. It wasn’t Mangini.

by Bernie19Kosar on Apr 16, 2011 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions

At the end of the 07 season, I said to my football buddies, that the browns should trade DA and get some value for him. I wish savage would have okayed that deal…

"They kept throwing it at me. I don’t know why. They just kept trying, and I just kept knocking it down." - Joe Hayden, Cleveland Browns.

by J. W. on Apr 16, 2011 4:24 AM EDT up reply actions

hard to trade your pro bowl qb in order to insert a guy who was a major question mark.

by DontCallMeJoey on Apr 18, 2011 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions

I was attempting to refer to Anderson, not Quinn.

"Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital." - Aaron Levenstein

by rufio on Apr 17, 2011 4:31 AM EDT up reply actions

I was one of the bigger Quinn defendants when I first came here. I have to admit…I was wrong. He sucks.

"They kept throwing it at me. I don’t know why. They just kept trying, and I just kept knocking it down." -- Joe Haden

by Kimble_79 on Apr 15, 2011 1:56 PM EDT reply actions

Honestly I never liked the guy. I didn’t like his attitude, I didn’t like his effort, and I didn’t like his skill set. At least we got Hilis out of him.

The voice of youthful optimism.

by brownsboy14 on Apr 15, 2011 1:58 PM EDT reply actions

His effort was never a question. The guy wanted to be good, and worked hard at it. He just sucked.

I met a fairy today that granted me one wish. "I want to live forever," I said. "Sorry" said the fairy, "I'm not allowed to grant wishes like that!"
"Fine" I said, "I want to die after the Browns win the Super Bowl !"
"You crafty bastard," said the fairy.

by The Licensed Pessimist on Apr 16, 2011 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs

Sad but true.

"An intelligent man is sometimes forced to be drunk to spend time with his fools" -Hemingway

by notthatnoise on Apr 16, 2011 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions

I have to be completely honest, I really thought that Quinn was going to be the franchise QB. I was really blown away how well he played against Denver on a short week of preparation. I know their D did suck, still those passes were right on the money. An accuracy he could never recapture.

Change isn't good or bad it just "is". Don Draper of Madmen

by realmccoy on Apr 15, 2011 5:17 PM EDT reply actions